Best way for ON-2 person to now learn ON-1

[yippee1999]

Without starting a discussion on merits of ON-2 versus 1, or in-depth explanation of beat counts, etc., ....

I am an ON-2 dancer. Tried one class in ON-1, and that was it. Besides understanding the difference in the basic step, IS there much difference beyond that? In other words, so long as I know how to start off with the basic step ON-1, do you think I could generally then pick up the rest of the timing instinctively by "following" my ON-1 partner? Or do you think it IS worth getting actually trained in ON-1 also? (I would like to be able to seamlessly go from 1 to 2, depending on who my leader is at the time.)

If I were to take ON-1 classes, I would imagine that it would be easiest to approach it as my learning an ENTIRELY NEW dance, and to not try to make constant comparisons to ON-2... that that might just confuse me all the more?

Thanks!

[englezul]

Without starting a discussion on merits of ON-2 versus 1, or in-depth explanation of beat counts, etc., ....

I am an ON-2 dancer. Tried one class in ON-1, and that was it. Besides understanding the difference in the basic step, IS there much difference beyond that? In other words, so long as I know how to start off with the basic step ON-1, do you think I could generally then pick up the rest of the timing instinctively by "following" my ON-1 partner? Or do you think it IS worth getting actually trained in ON-1 also? (I would like to be able to seamlessly go from 1 to 2, depending on who my leader is at the time.)

If I were to take ON-1 classes, I would imagine that it would be easiest to approach it as my learning an ENTIRELY NEW dance, and to not try to make constant comparisons to ON-2... that that might just confuse me all the more?

Thanks!

Practice your basic step on1 every other day for 30 mins for 1 or two months and you will be fine. It will probably take less than that. It's different footwork per beat and it's a different feel to it. Once you get this feel (listen to the music) just follow. 123 567 is bull anyways.

[GayleR]

My experience is the opposite. I am an On1 dancer trying to earn On2. I find the thing that gets in my way is muscle memory. As an On1 dancer, I really have to concentrate on "waiting" and using the space for styling and not rushing or reverting back to On1. I have taken a few private lessons and found them to be particularly helpful for advanced turn patterns where I tend to lose the count and end up back On1.

[SalsaManiac]

My experience is the opposite. I am an On1 dancer trying to earn On2. I find the thing that gets in my way is muscle memory. As an On1 dancer, I really have to concentrate on "waiting" and using the space for styling and not rushing or reverting back to On1. I have taken a few private lessons and found them to be particularly helpful for advanced turn patterns where I tend to lose the count and end up back On1.

I am also trying to go from On1 to On2 and am having the same problems with muscle memory. I've been experimenting with different grooves to get my body used to the footwork for On2 because I find that trying to use the same body rythm for both tends to confuse me some.

--T

[alemana]

whichever you dance more will be easier, so if you want to be equally proficient... seems to me you have to do them both equally.

[yippee1999]

Makes sense Alemana. Ok, so can anybody recommend a good place in Manhattan to learn ON-1? I took one such class at YSBD, but would prefer someplace else for ON-1.

Tx!

[alemana]

i think you are wasting your money, but: see if Emmanuel is teaching any "classic" salsa classes at Stepping Out.

[quixotedlm]

I am an ON-2 dancer. Tried one class in ON-1, and that was it. Besides understanding the difference in the basic step, IS there much difference beyond that? In other words, so long as I know how to start off with the basic step ON-1, do you think I could generally then pick up the rest of the timing instinctively by "following" my ON-1 partner? Or do you think it IS worth getting actually trained in ON-1 also? (I would like to be able to seamlessly go from 1 to 2, depending on who my leader is at the time.)

I'm a green beginner in the On-2 world..but some difference I've noticed are..

i. The distribution of empty space is different in On2 vs On1. On2 feels a lot less rushed, as if there is a lot of time to do your moves. Consequently, On1 must feel rushed to someone going from 2->1.

ii. In On-2, the lead as well as the execution seem to be concentrated on one half of the 8-count. In On-1, it is very common to use the first half of the 8 count to prep the lead, and use the other half for the actual execution. So it's likely that you'll have to be less sensitive to the lead and bide your time before execution.

iii. On-2 seems to provide more 'time' for turns etc. A simple cross body turn with left (inside) turn can easily allow for 2 turns for a beginner not too well versed in spinning, and end with the break back on the 6. On-1 doesn't lend itself to more spins the way On-2 does. It instead expects you to be done with the spin by 7 (thus, you can NOT use the 8 and 8& to throw in another spin and then break on 1).

I've seen followers who are so sensitive that they can follow changes in the lead on almost every count in the music, and react to it deftly. These followers can generally adapt to On-1, On-2 etc easily. Although because they are purely following, they don't try to do their own thing and dance to the music within the framework presented by the leader. Instead, they merely follow.

I suspect that if you already dance On-2, you might want to try and understand the differences between On1- and on2. Listening to the part of instruction targetted at the leaders might give you a lot of clues. I for one listen carefully to the instructors when they are giving out tips to the followers, because it helps me envision the dance fully.

This note I've written is certainly expected to have grave errors. I'm but a novice On-2 dancer.

[noobster]

I learned both styles simultaneously, because I was taking classes on-2 but I had a practice partner who was already trained on-1. It made it a little confusing in the very beginning but I can pretty much follow either way now without a lot of difficulty (although I do tend to revert to on-2 in open shines).

By the way, I have noticed people dance on all kinds of beats. I have seen almost every variation: guys breaking back on the 2, back on the 1, forward on the 2, forward on the 1, you name it. One dude broke on the 3. I have stopped trying to categorize people into whatever style and decided I am just going to follow whatever the niznit the leader is doing. Even if he is off-beat or whatever.

Anywayz, I wouldn't bother trying to take a class on-1. It's true there is a slightly different 'feel' to each style, but if your goal is just to be able to follow the occasional on-1 dancer to be found in NYC, I'd say you should just make an effort to seek them out and dance with them. The styles aren't that different (you are still stepping on all the same beats), and the difficulties seem to be more on the leader's part (having to switch the beat on which he starts his leads).

The follow mostly has to remember to rock back on her right (rather than left) when coming out of a spin on the 1 for on-1, as opposed to rocking back on her left when she ends the spin on 5 for on-2. If you are being sensitive to his motion, the breaks should come pretty automatically.

I'd say the basic is all you need to know. As englezul said, practice it at home, and dance with some on-1 leaders. That should be plenty.

[Salcero]

i think you are wasting your money.

You're going from driving a stick to driving an automatic so it shouldn't take long since you already know where the 1 is. I think Jamie Josephson teaches On1 and On2. But, as a follower, you can probably pic it up from dancing with some On1 dancers and practricing your basic. Formal training may not be needed.

[amo_dile_que_no]

You're going from driving a stick to driving an automatic so it shouldn't take long since you already know where the 1 is. I think Jamie Josephson teaches On1 and On2. But, as a follower, you can probably pic it up from dancing with some On1 dancers and practricing your basic. Formal training may not be needed.

I agree that she would be wasting her money on taking lessons for On 1, but I would say the same for someone switching from On1 to On2. One style is not more difficult than the other when it is the first one you learn. The problem comes in when you learn the new style (regardless if it's On1 or On2) because what you already learned interferes with what you are trying to learn. Others in this thread have alluded to "muscle memory" and they are right about that, but it's in the head too. This kind of interference is particularly strong when the two activities are so similar to each other, as is the case with On1 and On2. As some mentioned, practicing both is a good idea if you want to be proficient at both. One thing I try to do is stop and start again often, because I tend to revert after a shine, break in the music, or if I stop stepping.

[Tony_Salvi]

I agree that she would be wasting her money on taking lessons for On 1, but I would say the same for someone switching from On1 to On2. One style is not more difficult than the other when it is the first one you learn. The problem comes in when you learn the new style (regardless if it's On1 or On2) because what you already learned interferes with what you are trying to learn. Others in this thread have alluded to "muscle memory" and they are right about that, but it's in the head too. This kind of interference is particularly strong when the two activities are so similar to each other, as is the case with On1 and On2. As some mentioned, practicing both is a good idea if you want to be proficient at both. One thing I try to do is stop and start again often, because I tend to revert after a shine, break in the music, or if I stop stepping.

I'd agree it would be a big waste for a follower unless they were having lots of problems. Once the fundamentals of following are in place the only thing you should do is get to know the footwork and practice, practice, practice. I would recommend social dancing on1, and maybe taking one or two privates after a few weeks to see if you're doing things correctly.

[alemana]

i was arguing that exposure/practice was the most important issue if one's goal were to keep both timing styles available at the muskoskeletal-memory level, and i think in nyc it would be challenging to get the same exposure/practice to on-1 at anything other than a beginner level versus on-2. i can go all over the city to ballroom and social dance studios and get on-1 coursework, but it will be, mostly, rudimentary. the teachers will not be salsa specialists. and there won't be a flourishing *social* on-1 scene connected to any of these places, which means limited opportunity to practice in a social setting.

one thing that might be true of on-1 training in NYC versus on-2 is that the teachers of on-1, at ballroom studios specifically, might be more formally trained and might be better able to convey the kinds of technical things that street-trained salsa dancers typically cannot. (after 3+ years of coursework in NYC, i have experienced this over and over. that doesn't mean there aren't exceptions.. there are. but still.) so the ballroom on-1 teachers might give a better foundation, generally speaking. the tradeoff, of course, is in styling, flavor, authenticity, and connection to the on-2 scene in NYC, which is a bigbigbig part of the way ppl come up in this town.