Practicing Routines

[fireinflight]

Dancing Am-Am routines, how do you practice the routine without sacrificing the lead and follow? (This is mostly for Latin, but I have this problem to some extent in Standard as well.) Our routines are rather new, and in many places throughout the routine I feel like my partner is leading me to do the wrong thing because he isn't comfortable with the leads, often to the extent that it is impossible for me to do my step correctly (i.e. when we have a delayed step, if he doesn't delay I can't delay either). When you are in this situation, what do you do?

I can't just ignore the lead, and have floppy arms or something, because that's counterproductive - it doesn't help him lead, and it gives me very bad habits. But if I just follow the lead as he gives it, I end up doing really odd things, and we can never make any progress.

We do practice lead and follow separately from our routines, and we practice our individual parts of the routines separately, but when we try to dance the routine together it's a total disaster. I never know when to just follow and do the step incorrectly, or resist the lead and do the step right, but feel incredibly uncomfortable doing it.

[White Chacha]

One of the purposes of practicing the routine together should be to refine your partner's lead. If you're not following, the two of you won't look connected and the judges can see that. Heck, even I can see it when a couple are just dancing their parts of a routine. You must let your partner know when the lead isn't working.

When you're on the comp floor, you have to make the best of it. If that means just dancing your part, so be it. At the comp is not the time to dish out dissatisfaction over lead. It's the time to help your partner so the two of you can get through it togther as a team.

How's that for advice I wish I would follow myself? ;-)

[waltzgirl]

Maybe do what my pro-am teacher does with me. When something goes wrong, we stop and work on just that pattern (or individual step) without music until I get it, then we resume or restart the routine.

Of course, it helps that he's a teacher and can diagnose what went wrong and see how to fix it, although I'm getting better at that. And the interpersonal dynamics are easier (i.e., he's always right! ;) ).

[fireinflight]

I guess stopping and working on it is the thing to do - the only problem is that we never make any progress. I mean, I can't just stop at every single step and say, "I can't do my step with that lead" - I'm not a teacher, I can't say that kind of thing. When we practice I try (read - try!! I'm not very good at keeping my mouth shut!) not to make too many comments at all, because what do I know? I try to leave that sort of thing to our teacher. But it makes it very hard to practice together!

[reb]

Early on it was difficult. I don't know how my wife does it, but in Standard and Smooth she does as WhiteChaCha and our coaches recommend - she does have a tough time doing her part when I do not do mine well, but they tell her to follow - no matter what. In rhythm, we should be doing the same, but let's just say that I'm still learning to step up to the plate . . . .

[waltzgirl]

I guess stopping and working on it is the thing to do - the only problem is that we never make any progress. I mean, I can't just stop at every single step and say, "I can't do my step with that lead" - I'm not a teacher, I can't say that kind of thing. When we practice I try (read - try!! I'm not very good at keeping my mouth shut!) not to make too many comments at all, because what do I know? I try to leave that sort of thing to our teacher. But it makes it very hard to practice together!

Well, you feel that he's leading wrong, but he may feel that you're doing something that throws him off. When I had a practice partner, we both were also dancing pro-am, so we were used to the stop-and-fix-it approach. We just never talked about what the other one was or wasn't doing. It was more like, "That didn't seem to work quite right. Let's try it again." Try again. "Well, I felt . . . . Maybe it would help if . . . ."

If you both agreed on that approach, maybe it would work if you danced your full routine, with you following. Then each of you could pick a spot where things didn't seem right to you and work on both your choices. Equal opportunity complaining!

[Nik]

Just both work away from the connection. Stop and imagine there is a wall between both of you from which you are trying to push off of to do the movement (the one not working).

Also it helps to do you steps slowly right next to eachother but with out toching. That works on being in perspective of each other and knowing where the other partner is.

If all else fails, ask your teacher next lesson and don't work on that movement anymore.

[fireinflight]

That's a good idea, Waltzgirl - he often doesn't say anything about how my following feels, so I feel like I'm complaining all the time! It is true that I have more experience following than he does leading, though, so maybe he wouldn't notice as much. (I do a lot of social dancing - WCS, AT, salsa, etc - in addition to ballroom, whereas he just does competitive ballroom.)

[reb]

Just both work away from the connection. Stop and imagine there is a wall between both of you from which you are trying to push off of to do the movement (the one not working).

Also it helps to do you steps slowly right next to eachother but with out toching. That works on being in perspective of each other and knowing where the other partner is.

If all else fails, ask your teacher next lesson and don't work on that movement anymore.
Definitely agree with this! We were taught that if we could figure it out -great, but if not, stop and write it down and take it to the teacher next lesson.

[cornutt]

Does your partner have much experience with learning choreography? It sounds like he is mentally overloaded. I've been there; the first time you try a routine as a lead, the responsibilities of remembering the choreography, leading, and doing your own steps can be overwhelming at first. You may need to give him some extra time to work either by himself or with your instructor, so that he can get his own steps down better, before you can work with him much. If he's agreeable to this, offer to help him practice by cueing the music for him, prompting him on what steps come next, operating the video camera, etc.

Another thing that can help is to practice to a reduced tempo while you are learning the routine. Can you get your music slowed down somehow?

Also, I'm a big believer in the divide-and-conquer approach. I like to learn routines a little bit at a time. I work on a section until I've got it, then I add another section, etc.

[Zhena]

Take this with a grain of salt, because the only routines we have done were for studio showcases, but ... The first couple of times our teacher choreographed a routine that we learned as a whole, but I didn't like the results. Since then we find it helpful to put off working on the routine sequence until we are comfortable with the lead-and-follow for the elements we are going to use and can do them at random. Then when we put the elements together in the routine we know what we want them to feel like and the only new challenge is remembering the order.

[RIdancer82]

When you're at a competition or if you're on a really really tight deadline just try to get through the routines and make sure you know them well for now. Otherwise, during a portion of your practice time, go through your routines w/out stopping at all and just try to get through them as best as possible. Use another portion of your practice to really work on the connection and lead-follow. If he leads you into a step, or a direction that is not correct or not in your routine, just go where he leads you anyway. If it's not where he wants you to be, he will start to learn not to lead it like that anymore. It will give him the opportunity to assess exactly how his movement affects you.

[fireinflight]

This all sounds like great advice! It looks like we'll just have to slog through it bit by bit, with me following exactly what he leads, before we can really do the thing as a whole.

Thanks for the speed suggestion, cornutt - we're actually working on it way below tempo anyway, when we try to do it to speed it falls apart after the first few steps!

Since then we find it helpful to put off working on the routine sequence until we are comfortable with the lead-and-follow for the elements we are going to use and can do them at random. Then when we put the elements together in the routine we know what we want them to feel like and the only new challenge is remembering the order.

Gosh, I wish we could do this! I hate fighting against the lead. But I think it would take a really long time to get to this point, and he really wants to compete, so I guess we're under time pressure.

We've already been working on this routine for a while - he's had parts of the routine for about six months, and I've been dancing with him for about half that - but it looks like it'll just take more time.

[Nik]

Just remember it IS the man's fault too half the time.

Plenty of times when I had a problem with my partners connection, I would try to change something in myself to improve the overall picture.

[Joe]

She should be following you no matter what you do. If your lead is confusing she should tell you so, and you should fix it so she's happy with it. How else is she going to follow you if you need to adjust something on a comp floor?

[White Chacha]

Just remember it IS the man's fault too half the time.
...


Wow, only half?

;-)

[Another Elizabeth]

Just remember it IS the man's fault too half the time.
Jim Donaghey once told me, "The lady makes all the mistakes - but they are all the man's fault."

[cornutt]

Wow, only half?

;-)

The other half, it's the lead's fault. :p

[Love2Dance]

In any partnership, I think the most counterproductive thing is when one person assumes that they are always right and their partner is always wrong. I've seen both men and women do this. I think one of the things that makes a true partnership so hard is the ability to question your actions first, then constructively share criticisms with your partner. This is one of the reasons why myself and many other women do not compete with their spouses! :p

Granted, every now and then, I do mention to my pro if I feel something wrong from him. This at least gives him a better idea of what's going wrong, because something definitely has broken down in our connection if I'm feeling something different than he's leading. (granted, it almost always comes down to false anticipation.... is there any way to shut down that part of the brain?;))

Either way, it all comes down to you just have to find the way to best improve your communication with your partner. If your partner isn't a pro, sometimes a mediator/coach is necessary to point out what one or both of you are doing incorrectly or could be doing better.