Non-Sanctioned Dance Competitions

[Love2Dance]

I'm wondering what the general consensus is on non-sanctioned ballroom competitions. People I've talked with in different places and even at sanctioned events seem to speak rather poorly of non-sanctioned events. Now, I've been to a couple of non-sanctioned events. One I went to was very nicely put together and there was a mix of ballroom, country, latin and swing, and it wasn't for any circuit, just for fun.

However, I have seen competitions, and I'm not even sure if there's a standard name for them aside from non-sanctioned, that really just seem like a place for teachers who may be intimidated or maybe not quite qualified to dance in any circuit as a pro to take their students. However, nothing against teachers with limited experience, but I guess the chief complaint I hear is that these kind of events also tend to make "everyone a winner" so to speak. I know that more than a couple of people I've asked about these events ask what's the point of the competition if everyone's a winner? This makes it more of a showcase than a competition. I'm sure those of you who have danced for a while have encountered or heard about these kinds of events.

I'm just wondering what the general opinion is. I know that competitions can be fun and it's also fun to be showcased every now and then. Plus, it's nice to bring home a prize of some kind.

I guess I've just heard a lot of negative on it and I'm wondering if anyone here views them in a positive light.

[wyllo]

There are a couple of non-sanctioned events in my area and they tend to be very small, with three or four local studios participating. They're inexpensive, have a low time commitment and very few people wear professionally-made costumes. So, I think it's a great way for dancers in the community to meet each other and have some fun. Yes, they are a little generous with their blue ribbons, but I'm not sure I see any real harm in that.

[cornutt]

Well, as you say yourself, it's a mixed bag. Some of them are pretty good, although I'm not aware of any "outlaw" comp that's as big as the larger USA Dance or NDCA comps. Others are indeed "comps" where winning is directly proportional to the amount of money spent, with little or no actual competition in most heats. My general advice is, before you sign up for any such, try to talk to someone who has done that event before (and doesn't have a financial interest in it).

[PasoDancer]

I wish somebody would think to actually announce and list these "not as good as your shiny comp" dates, locations, etc. ONLINE, as many of us don't subscribe to "paper" media. They'd be fun to watch.

[White Chacha]

Many collegiate comps are not "sanctioned"...

[SPratt74]

Well, it's probably not a prize I would put on a resume, because it's all for fun really. I don't see any harm in them as long as they aren't advertising that it's a real competition (well, you know what I mean). Then that might be a problem. But I'll take a blue any day lol! No biggie. ;)

[PasoDancer]

Is there a sort of "Intercollegiate Ballroom Dancing" comp association? There's such a creature for showing horses.

[cornutt]

Many collegiate comps are not "sanctioned"...

True, but I don't think that's what the original poster meant. Our studio hosts an unsanctioned comp each October that is probably typical. It's a one-day (one long day) comp with usually around 250 heats. We send out invites to other independent studios in the region, and typically we get around 40 out-of-town competitors plus the local crowd. It's a nice-sized comp, but not really big enough that applying for a sanction woulld be worthwhile. The comp takes place in the studio itself, which even with our new larger building is just barely big enough to hold it.

(An aside: One reason that we haven't attempted to grow the comp further is the cost involved in getting a larger venue. For some reason, we have a dearth of mid-sized venues in town. There are several other places like our studio, in the 2000-3000 sq. ft. range, and then from there it jumps directly to the >20,000 sq ft behemoth spaces at the civic center, which cost an arm and a leg. Why this is, I don't know. :rolleyes: )

[Indiana_Jay]

There are several other places like our studio, in the 2000-3000 sq. ft. range, and then from there it jumps directly to the >20,000 sq ft behemoth spaces at the civic center, which cost an arm and a leg. Why this is, I don't know. :rolleyes: )

It's a shame the civic center can't partition off a small piece of one of its big spaces. If they can't, I'd say that's a design flaw.

[little_mouse]

Newbie-question: what does that mean "sanctioned" & "non-sanctioned"?

[Porfirio Landeros]

Newbie-question: what does that mean "sanctioned" & "non-sanctioned"?I think generally, people here are referring to events recognized by the world dancesport bodies, or their affiliates. For professionals this is World DanceSport Council, or NDCA here in the U.S., and for amateurs, it's IDSF, or USA Dance.

It's funny, though, because you can call the ballroom competition at the senior olympics a "sanctioned" competition even though it doesn't have WDC or IDSF recognition, and same with the dancesport event at the Gay Games... they're just sanctioned by somebody else ;)

[wyllo]

Is there a sort of "Intercollegiate Ballroom Dancing" comp association? There's such a creature for showing horses.

There is the Youth and Collegiate Network (YCN), which is affiliated with USA Dance (formerly USABDA). I'm honestly not sure what they do in terms of organizing youth/collegiate activities except for running the Collegiate National Championships which is held at the Ohio Star Ball every year.

[cornutt]

Newbie-question: what does that mean "sanctioned" & "non-sanctioned"?

The job of the sanctioning bodies is to establish a common set of rules, means for enforcing them, certification of judges and officials, and (when applicable) ensure that prize winners are paid in due course. There may also be a championship fund and a point system for determining regional or national champions.

Comp organizers who want to have their comps sanctioned have to pay a sanctioning fee to the sanctioning body. They also have to abide by the rules set by the sanctioning body. A lot of smaller comp organizers don't see it as worth their while to pay the sanctioning fee or contribute to the championship fund, so they run their comp without benefit of a sanction. (In auto racing, unsanctioned events are commonly referred to as "outlaw", which is where I got the term from.)

There are two large sanctioning bodies in the U.S. for ballroom dancing competition. The National Dance Council of America (NDCA) sanctions all of pro, pro-am, and amateur competitions, although they are not as well established in the latter area. USA Dance (the artist formerly know as USABDA) sanctions only amateur comps. They are the U.S. representative to the International Dance Sport Foundation(?), or ISDF, which purports to be the sanctioning body for all dancesport worldwide.

[little_mouse]

Thanks Porfirio & Cornutt!

[DanPost]

Newbie-question: what does that mean "sanctioned" & "non-sanctioned"?

Tangent: it's somewhat ironic that "sanctioned" has two definitions, that are in complete opposition... it certainly generated some confusion when I first saw an ad for a competition containing "sanctioned by NDCA". My initial reaction was, "why would they advertise THAT?"

I can't post links yet, so just look it up at any good dictionary website.

[SDsalsaguy]

Tangent: it's somewhat ironic that "sanctioned" has two definitions, that are in complete opposition... it certainly generated some confusion when I first saw an ad for a competition containing "sanctioned by NDCA". My initial reaction was, "why would they advertise THAT?"

:uplaugh: :uplaugh: :uplaugh:

[Porfirio Landeros]

Tangent: it's somewhat ironic that "sanctioned" has two definitions, that are in complete opposition... it certainly generated some confusion when I first saw an ad for a competition containing "sanctioned by NDCA". My initial reaction was, "why would they advertise THAT?"

I can't post links yet, so just look it up at any good dictionary website.
Technically, the NDCA prefers that organizers use the language "Recognized by the NDCA" on their literature. Maybe this is to eliminate any confusion, and to also leave much of the perceived accountability to the organizers rather than the national organization.

[Merrylegs]

I've attended a non-sanctioned competition located just north of us each year (well for the 2-3 years or so the comp has existed) and it's a blast. It's so cheap and it's a great way to get some floor time in. The organizers are super sweet and it's a nice way to support them. Everybody wins.

If you're after titles and such then you need to cast your net in a larger pond. And there is nothing wrong with that!

[reb]

... they're just sanctioned by somebody else ;)
That's good!

[Laura]

The US has two governing bodies that sanction dancesport competitions. One is the NDCA, which sanctions Professional, Pro/Am, and Amateur competitions. You can get a list of all competitions in the NDCA system at the NDCA's web site ( www.ndca.org ). The other body is USA Dance, which sanctions Amateur competitions. You can get a list of all competitions in the USA Dance system from their web site ( www.usadance.org).

Collegiate competitions are pretty much their own thing, although competitions put on by teams that are members of USA Dance's Youth College Network (which has been pretty much non-functional for several years now) have a sort of implicit USA Dance sanction.

Closed Chain competitions (i.e., Fred Astaire and Arthur Murray) have an implicit NDCA sanction, since FA and AM are member organizations of the NDCA. However, usually only FA students and teachers can participate in FA events, and similarly for AM events.

The "unsanctioned" competitions people are talking about here are things like the Pro/Am events put on by World Promotions ( www.worldpromotionsinc.com ), the so-called "United States Pro/Am Ballroom Dance Championships" put on by Tom O'Dell (I started a thread (http://www.dance-forums.com/showthread.php?t=15505) asking about them recently), and inter-studio events like Cornutt described.

[Joe]

As an aside, I just can't get myself to call the new .org USADance. And my fingers are just so used to typing USABDA that I'm glad that address still works. :)

[dgcasey]

I've attended a non-sanctioned competition located just north of us each year (well for the 2-3 years or so the comp has existed) and it's a blast. It's so cheap and it's a great way to get some floor time in. The organizers are super sweet and it's a nice way to support them. Everybody wins.

That's what I'm looking forward to this spring. The university here in Las Vegas hosts a one day event that is open to anyone and the cost is minimal. From what I was told, one entry fee and dance all the dances you want.

[Sagitta]

That's what I'm looking forward to this spring. The university here in Las Vegas hosts a one day event that is open to anyone and the cost is minimal. From what I was told, one entry fee and dance all the dances you want.WE are having something like that in our area too and it makes me happy. :-) Still haven't decided if I should do it though as I don't favor competing, but am more excited about meeting/seeeing different people.

[reb]

That's what I'm looking forward to this spring. The university here in Las Vegas hosts a one day event that is open to anyone and the cost is minimal. From what I was told, one entry fee and dance all the dances you want.
Is this the comp?

usadance.unlv.edu/desertchallenge

Date still shows from last year . . .

Desert Challenge
Intercollegiate Dancesport Championships
2006
April 21 & 22

[SPratt74]

That's what I'm looking forward to this spring. The university here in Las Vegas hosts a one day event that is open to anyone and the cost is minimal. From what I was told, one entry fee and dance all the dances you want.

That is a great idea even just to meet people! ;)