Zouk: anyone tried it?

[MadamSamba]

Hi, folks. I had my first "zouk" (http://www.zoukarchive.com/index.shtml) lesson yesterday and am baffled.

It's not that I didn't like it, but it was strange...kinda like salsa, but also quite different.

Zouk isn't huge here, but it's getting bigger. Apparently it's huge in other parts of the world. Anyone else had any zouk experiences or are any of you regular devotees?

I'm not used to being ambivalent about a dance, I've never come across a style I didn't immediately like, but I can't stop thinking about zouk. It's weird, but attractive and the music is hypnotic as is the rhythm of the steps...my god, I don't have another day to learn another dance. Why aren't there eight days in the week?

[Sagitta]

No!! I actually never have heard of it. However you intrigued me and I found one website where there is a clip of people dancing zouk. Click on the link and tell me what you think:
http://www.tropicalny.com/clips/zoukstudent.wmv

And I also found this site with a couple clips:

http://www.tropicalny.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=home&page=description&menu=description

[danceguy]

MadamSamba,

Thank you for sharing...I had never heard of Zouk before. Sagitta, did you watch the long 9 MB clip from Japan?

I'm kind of at a loss for words...it was a very beautiful and elegant dance to watch...I almost felt like I was in a trance for a moment.... :shock:

I could see many elements from other dances in it...but at the same time something unique. I'll have to ask some people I know who speak Creole if they know more about it!

Wow...I really want to learn some of this now...hmm...I wonder if its even taught in my area... :?

[Sagitta]

I did. I liked that 9 minute clip better then the first one. Just wanted to share all that I got as I think that seeing a dance in action tells a person a lot more about the dance then simply talking about/describing it. I am intrigued by it. And this dance school is in NYC!! With reasonable rates for dance classes, on top of that!! If I didn't like the idea of living in a concrete jungle I would have wanted to move there. So many more opportunities compared to Ithaca!

[danceguy]

That was a beautiful clip...and the odd part is I'm not sure what exactly I find so beautiful about that dance... :shock:

It sort of reminded me of Tai chi...just very flowing and not super fast paced...yes I really want to try this too and see how it feels to do with a partner!

Hmm...I'll find a class somewhere.... :wink:

[salsachinita]

Ok, folks, I've resisted it so far but now I'm jumping in :wink: !

The zouk class MadamSamba is talking about was taught by the dance partner of UK guy who started the zouk scene in Melbourne. He is currently in London preparing to move down here.

There is apparently a big enough scene in London, known as Zouk/Lambada, sometimes running along side Salsa nights at clubs.

It's a relatively simpler dance compared to salsa, Most of the local salsaeros/as here (myself included) who have tried it found it easy enough to pick up. The trick is to STAY with the Zouk steps/timing/feel which can be hard to do, as it is similar enough to salsa yet different; so we tend to slip back into Salsa :oops: (in my opinion, it's NOT very similar to Lambada a la early 90s at all!) It's very laid back & tropical. Totally holiday music/dance :wink: !

The music is French/Carribean mainly, but the dance was mainly developed in Brazil, as I understand it. I am familiar with the music, as I've lived in France (you go through 10 Zouk cds before you'd find a Salsa one at music shops :shock: ). The music had been around for a long time, but the dance wasn't developed that long ago, so it's still eveolving.

The good thing about Zouk is that it is beginner friendly. The initiation process is nowhere as painful as Salsa (for some of us anyway). It's also dancable to most of the smooth commercial R&B tunes, so it can be marketed in conjuction with R&B at more mainstream clubs (thus attracting more followers).

The down side is, unlike Salsa, we don't have a community (who came from that culture) here to sustain it. So unless it's marketed/built to attract a supportive clientele, it runs the risk of being a 'fad' just as Lambada did in the early 90s.

All of you folks in UK/Canada (I believe there's a scene there, coz a lot of the music is in French) or anywhere, could you please share with the rest of DF what you know about your local Zouk scene?

[danceguy]

Sagitta - When are we going to Melbourne? :D :D :D

Not only would we get to try out Zouk, but we could also go Salsa dancing with Salsachinita!

SD, Boriken, Youngsta...anyone else? :P

[salsachinita]

:D All welcome, guys :D ! Maybe you can get a special group deal...?

Looks like I will be renting a mini van just to pick the lot of you up from the airport......not to mention the various Salsa clubs :lol: !

And don't forget about MadamSamba, she's my local girl as well :wink: !

[danceguy]

Hmm...I wonder what normal airfare would be....I've always wanted to visit Austrailia, I've even been working on my Vegemite tolerance! :P

[MadamSamba]

Yay! I'm so glad you liked it Sagitta and Scorpionguy...I'm still intrigued and desperately trying to chop 'n change my schedule to go for classes, but as yet am not having any luck.

The links were fabulous btw! Thanks for them, Sagitta (did you find out if there were any classes?) You know they're down here in Australia...maybe you should consider the trip!!! You could salsa with salsachinta and me (and Argentine Tango and ballroom and swing too!!!):)

Vegemite is YUMBO!!!!

But to be honest, the clips don't even nearly convey the gorgeousness of the dance...Scorpionguy, "trance" is exactly the right word!!!

[MadamSamba]

Salsachinita has sharp eyes and is spot on as usual (you should see her salsa!)

Yeah, the class was fab and the teacher great...again, I'm desperately trying to make it for her classes, salsachinita, wanna join me? :)

Seriously, as salsachinita says, it's easy to pick up if salsa is your thing, the only trick is trying to forget your salsa timing as zouk uses a completely different timing and has a totally different feel, like tai chi, as mentioned earlier. Your salsa legs tend to kick in automatically and. at first, you really have to fight 'em off, but it does happen eventually.

And the music, it's sooooo hypnotising...I've been listening to it just for the hell of it...very relaxing and calming.

[Sagitta]

I'm glad you enjoyed the clips madamsamba!!

No zouk in little Ithaca, but there are classes in NY city. This summer I'm going to try out long weekends, going there for perhaps a zouk or other lessons that aren't here, and trying out some of the salsa clubs... We'll see how my on 1 dancing goes over with the on 2 crowd?!! :)

[MadamSamba]

Oh, Sagitta, that's too bad...but the long weekends sound great...mind you, as mentioned, you could alwasy come down here...classes are on Tuesdays and Thursdays... :lol:

[casino]

Well, I watched the videoclips and the zouk they are dancing has nothing at all to do with the Zouk African people dance (in the African community in Portugal, mostly from Angola, Cabo-Verde).

I was surprised to see how they interpret the music and I am sure that if you show those video clips to a Martinican or to an Angolan they will be surprised too, because they interpret the music in a totally different way.

I prefer the Martinican/African way(s) it is more partner centered and laid back. The emphasis is in the closeness to your partner like in closed embrace Argentine Tango. Forget about fancy spins and styling, salsa style.

If any of you ever comes to Portugal I will be glad to show you.

[MadamSamba]

LOL, Casino...now I have to add Portugal to my list of "places to dance" :)

[danceslave]

Well, I watched the videoclips and the zouk they are dancing has nothing at all to do with the Zouk African people dance (in the African community in Portugal, mostly from Angola, Cabo-Verde).

.yeah i was pretty confused about that.. i thought about the African people when i first saw this

[danceslave]

umm where did you guys find the video clips

i love the music tho.. sounds like soca!

[matnik]

Hi, folks. I had my first "zouk" (http://www.zoukarchive.com/index.shtml) lesson yesterday and am baffled.

It's not that I didn't like it, but it was strange...kinda like salsa, but also quite different.

Zouk isn't huge here, but it's getting bigger. Apparently it's huge in other parts of the world. Anyone else had any zouk experiences or are any of you regular devotees? [...]
This is my first post on the forum, I've just registered and I'm glad I did.
At the risk of bringing back an old thread, I just want to let you know guys what my dancing background is made of : I've been "Zouking" ever since I was 13 (I've been listening to Zouk music since I was born), I feel very at ease with Haitian Compas, it's also a music/dance I grew up with, it's one of the foundation of Zouk. I'm also familiar with Mazurka, Quadrille and Biguine, even though I won't be able to dance those very well.
I've been living in the SF Bay Area for 3 years now, there are only 2 or 3 places where you can listen/dance to some Zouk or Compas ... However, there are good Salsa clubs in the area, so I'll get serious and I'll be taking Salsa lessons any time soon. I'll be posting from time to time to let you know how it goes,

--Pascal

[Sagitta]

Hi Pascal/matnik:

I'm glad that you have joined df, have posted straight away and will be sharing your experiences with us. It is sometimes good to revisit old topics again.

The best way to popularize a dance that you like is to teach and share that dance with others. Over here in Ithaca there are people working on spreading salsa, rueda, and also zydeco. The cool thing is that I really like all three so this is good for me too. :D

[SDsalsaguy]

Welcome to the DF matnik/Pascal, glad to have you with us! :D

Nothing wrong with reviving older topics either, especially as many newer members haven't always had a chance to see some of the less recent threads.

[matnik]

Thanks Sagitta and SDsalsaguy :D

[tintinnabula]

Where in Portugal can you see authentic zouk? I will be in Lisbon in late June and would be very interested in seeing this.

Thank ya!

[Sagitta]

Welcome to df tintinnabula! I know that MapleleafSalsero is from Lisbon, Portugal. You can ask him. I'm trying to think, and do remember that there was some talk a while back on visiting Portugal/Spain. Let's see if I can find it...or maybe it was France? :?

[Sagitta]

Okay this thread has some talk of the salsa scene (http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=3412&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0). Perhaps you can ask these df members from Portugal about Zouk, or a good place to check it out on the web.

[tintinnabula]

Thank you Sagitta for both the warm welcome and the prompt reply! That thread was very helpful. My friend and I will def. check out a couple of those salsa scenes mentioned. Now, if only we can find a hotel to stay in...everything seems to be booked due to the Euro 2004 tournament. Can anybody receommend a clean hotel with a room for two young ladies?? :lol:

[Gentemer]

Hello there,

In my searches for resources on the net on Zouk dance, I just stubled on this site. It looks great with a lot of participation from all over the world.
But before I start asking all kids of questions at the impropriate place on this board, could someone point me to discussions I should read first?

Thank you - Gentemer.

[pygmalion]

Hi Gentemer. Welcome. :D First, feel free to ask almost anything. If you want to know whether a topic has been covered, you can use the search function. There's a search button near the top of your screen -- actually, on the left bottom of the screen header/banner. Just type in your search terms, and any pertinent threads will pop up. Or, if you like, you can peruse the index threads that are at the top of most forums. That may give you an idea of what's already been discussed.

Thank you so much for asking. :D

[Istel]

hmm... just stumbled into this thread as there's a club with a huge following (however the club only play trances and such) with the thread name.

After watching the clip, it looks a lot like Casino style Salsa but with a very chill out feel to it?

So now I know what I should do when they play chill-out music in clubs... :D

But still prefer Salsa :p though the Zouk music really sounds nice and soothing imho :)

Btw, Welcome to DF Gentemer, u'll find that this is the most non-critical and coolest dancers forum u'll ever find. enjoy ur stay here :)

[Sagitta]

let me simply second why Pygmailion said, as she said it so well. And third the welcome since istel has welcomed you too. If you have problems with the search functionality do let us know and I'll be happy to help you out, further. :)

[salsachinita]

After watching the clip, it looks a lot like Casino style Salsa but with a very chill out feel to it?

Methinks that while there IS a timing difference, the two are definitely transferable, providing one knows the timing well, and execute each properly instead of doing a muddled version in between (like moi :oops: ).

[Gentemer]

Thanx for the warm welcome, Pygmalion, Istel and Sagitta, eh... some two weeks ago ;-)

It is really incredible, the amount of dancing discussions going on here, too much for me to read it all.
But let me add some contributions...

Zouk isn't huge here, but it's getting bigger. Apparently it's huge in other parts of the world. Anyone else had any zouk experiences or are any of you regular devotees?
Well, the Zouk community is certainly growing in the Netherlands as well. Most dutch Zouk dancers learned it from Claudio Gomes or Claudia de Vries, or from teachers that learned it from Claudio ;-)

No!! I actually never have heard of it. However you intrigued me and I found one website where there is a clip of people dancing zouk. Click on the link and tell me what you think:
http://www.tropicalny.com/clips/zoukstudent.wmv
And I also found this site with a couple clips:
http://www.tropicalny.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=home&page=description&menu=description
The style shown on the site of TropicalNY is a bit different from what I am used to. Much more static and choreographed. Try for instance the clips from the Zouk/Lambada congress in Barcelona at ZoukLover.com or the following clip from BraSaZouk.com the site of Claudia: http://www.brasazouk.com/images/movie.mov

The major difference with other dances like Salsa, is that it is extremely up close and personal, for some people even too much up close and personal :-). And not only the physical closeness, but also the partners looking streight into each othere eyes. In the physical aspect it resembles the 'close' bachata, though that lacks the eye-contact. And Bachata can be danced at some distance from each other, which is absolutely unworkable for Zouk.

Well, I watched the videoclips and the zouk they are dancing has nothing at all to do with the Zouk African people dance (in the African community in Portugal, mostly from Angola, Cabo-Verde).
As far as I know, people in Africa and African communities use the same kind of music (the toem... chick chick, toem... chick chick, etc.), but dance 'Kizomba' to it in stead of Zouk. Some CaboVerdian people don't even know the term 'Zouk', but call it CaboSwing ;-)

I was surprised to see how they interpret the music and I am sure that if you show those video clips to a Martinican or to an Angolan they will be surprised too, because they interpret the music in a totally different way.
I prefer the Martinican/African way(s) it is more partner centered and laid back. The emphasis is in the closeness to your partner like in closed embrace Argentine Tango. Forget about fancy spins and styling, salsa style.
This confuses me a bit, since I thought Kizomba was not a partner dance, and since you are writing about the closeness to your partner and the rest, I am thinking about Zouk again !?! Can anybody enlighten me about this?
(PS: the stuff of the Barcelona congress is what I know as Zouk)

After watching the clip, it looks a lot like Casino style Salsa but with a very chill out feel to it?
Methinks that while there IS a timing difference, the two are definitely transferable, providing one knows the timing well, and execute each properly instead of doing a muddled version in between (like moi :oops: ).
I think Istel is referring to the Rueda-like aspect of the performance, aren't you, Istel? This aspect in Zouk is new to me, I don't think it is typical for Zouk, at least not how it is danced in the Netherlands, as far as I know.
Is it more common in Australia, Salsachinita?

[Sagitta]

A lot to digest. Will try to do so at a later date as laundry is now calling me. :)

[Gentemer]

No haste! My post travelled for two weeks with me in my palmtop before I could find the time to upload it! :lol:

[salsachinita]

Is it more common in Australia, Salsachinita?

At the moment, no zouk at all....!!!

Zouksta (UK) was here a couple of years ago to teach/promote it actively, but as I predicted then, without a cultrual group who follows the music (ie salsa with Spanish speaking community), just having the dance alone would not be enough to make a thriving scene.......

[Istel]

Thanx for the warm welcome, Pygmalion, Istel and Sagitta, eh... some two weeks ago ;-)

You are very the welcomed :D


I think Istel is referring to the Rueda-like aspect of the performance, aren't you, Istel? This aspect in Zouk is new to me, I don't think it is typical for Zouk, at least not how it is danced in the Netherlands, as far as I know.
Is it more common in Australia, Salsachinita?

Yeah, you got my idea. Cause they're dancing around in a circle, exchanging partners and doing very ruedish things in general :D Timing wise, I agree it's pretty different since it's derived from Lambada if I'm not wrong?

However, the swaying of heads in circles makes the performers look a little like they're possessed... :P but that's just me :oops:

But all in all, I love the music... can someone recommend me a few good zouk albums? Those extremely chill out ones 8)

Thanks a lot! :)

[Gentemer]

Is it more common in Australia, Salsachinita?
At the moment, no zouk at all....!!!
This surprises me! Some time ago I was searching for information on a Zouk Congress, and all kinds of australean websites turned up.
http://groups.msn.com/GinGaBrasil
http://www.latindance.com.au/dancetypes/zouk.asp
http://www.labomba.com.au/special_events.htm
http://www.zouklover.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71
This made me think that there is a huge Zouk community in Australia.

In the Netherlands, there is only a small Creole community, but sufficient to produce some great Zouk artists (music), like Susanna Lubrano (http://suzannaonline.com) and Gil Semedo (http://GilSemedo.com). As for the Zouk (dance) to become popular in the Netherlands, it is mainly because of the Brazilian Claudio Gomes (http://www.claudiogomes.com/) and the Surinam Claudia de Vries (http://www.brasazouk.com/).

[Gentemer]

Timing wise, I agree it's pretty different since it's derived from Lambada if I'm not wrong?
You're right. The rhythem is the same, but it differs on which count you change your weight.

However, the swaying of heads in circles makes the performers look a little like they're possessed... :P but that's just me :oops:
Well, you could be right here as well :wink:

But all in all, I love the music... can someone recommend me a few good zouk albums? Those extremely chill out ones 8)
Thanks a lot! :)
Try the list at Claudio Gomes's site, and there are some great demos at the site of Suzanna Lubrano (urls in previous post).

[salsachinita]

Is it more common in Australia, Salsachinita?
At the moment, no zouk at all....!!!
This surprises me! Some time ago I was searching for information on a Zouk Congress, and all kinds of australean websites turned up.

This made me think that there is a huge Zouk community in Australia.

The sites are either once-off events, or in another city (other than Melbourne) so I can't really comment :oops: ..........but I know that there's none in Mel at the moment.

[Gentemer]

Mmmm... :? I'm sorry.

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

Welcome to df tintinnabula! I know that MapleleafSalsero is from Lisbon, Portugal. You can ask him. I'm trying to think, and do remember that there was some talk a while back on visiting Portugal/Spain. Let's see if I can find it...or maybe it was France? :?

Well just to confuse everyone more, this is what I know about Zouk.

It originated in the French Caribbean and if memory serves me right, in the Antilhes (not sure it´s this island). The Zouk I´ve heard is mostly sung in French. It´s very popular here in Portugal amongst the African community of the former colonies, Cape Verde, Angola, Guineu, etc. Sometimes, in salsa venues they play Zouk, however, most salseros think it´s Kizomba so they dance Kizomba to it.

On New Years Eve, I was at a private party hosted by a salsera and one her friends, who was originally from Cape Verde, brought some Zouk music with him and played it for us. It sounded just like Kizomba except it was in French and had a certain soothing/relaxing effect to it. Anyway, if I´m not mistaken, Kizomba originated Zouk that´s probably why it´s so similar.

I´m not sure however how you´re supposed to dance to Zouk.

Tintinnabula, if you decide to come to Portugal, let me know. I´ll try to find out where you can dance Zouk here. I´m assuming in clubs with essentially African music...

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

In the Netherlands, there is only a small Creole community, but sufficient to produce some great Zouk artists (music), like Susanna Lubrano (http://suzannaonline.com) and Gil Semedo (http://GilSemedo.com). As for the Zouk (dance) to become popular in the Netherlands, it is mainly because of the Brazilian Claudio Gomes (http://www.claudiogomes.com/) and the Surinam Claudia de Vries (http://www.brasazouk.com/).

Gentemer, I check out Gil Semedo´s site. At least 3 of the sample songs are played regularly in salsa venues here in Lisbon, "Nos Lider", "Dedicacion" and "Nha namorada". Everyone dances Kizomba to it. I´m actually curious to see how Zouk (the dance) is supposed to be. :shock:

[Lockstep]

hey there

was searching the forums for zouk and came across this thread. i kinda assumed it was pretty common, but apparently not.

here in utrecht, netherlands, we got a zouk night every second week, and my school has classes in it, occassionaly. at the regular salsa nights, they toss in a zouk song from time to time.

personally did a few workshops, and then they tried to dump me in 2nd level cuz they weren't teacher the first level, which didn't go too well :) it helps if you're good at salsa and stuff, but some of the moves I found pretty difficult to learn cuz of the pace, and especially since not that many people know it you don't really get the chance to practice a lot.

[Gentemer]

Well just to confuse everyone more, this is what I know about Zouk.
Thank you for adding to the confusement! :-D

Sometimes, in salsa venues they play Zouk, however, most salseros think it´s Kizomba so they dance Kizomba to it.
I am still very curious what Kizomba is. Is it a partner-dance or a solo-dance or a group-dance? I thought that I knew, but I am not sure now.

On New Years Eve, I was at a private party hosted by a salsera and one her friends, who was originally from Cape Verde, brought some Zouk music with him and played it for us. It sounded just like Kizomba except it was in French and had a certain soothing/relaxing effect to it. Anyway, if I´m not mistaken, Kizomba originated Zouk that´s probably why it´s so similar.
Are you referring to the dance or the music?

I´m not sure however how you´re supposed to dance to Zouk.
Perhaps it is just the same, but just two different names?

Gentemer, I check out Gil Semedo´s site. At least 3 of the sample songs are played regularly in salsa venues here in Lisbon, "Nos Lider", "Dedicacion" and "Nha namorada". Everyone dances Kizomba to it. I´m actually curious to see how Zouk (the dance) is supposed to be.
Did you have a look at some of the video-clips? Take for instance:
http://www.brasazouk.com/images/movie.mov or http://www.sambaworld.nl/sambaworld/online_lessons/rodrigo_june2004/june2004.wmv
This is what I think Zouk (the dance) is supposed to be. :-D

hey there
...
here in utrecht, netherlands, we got a zouk night every second week, and my school has classes in it, occassionaly. at the regular salsa nights, they toss in a zouk song from time to time.
Hi Lockstep!
Nice to meet another Dutch guy or girl on this forum! :-D
Do you go to Zouk parties outside of Utrecht as well?
This saturday, they have a great party at SalsAventura in The Hague, the Brazilian Night, I can certainly recommend it:
http://netherlands.braziliandances.com/index.php?option=com_simpleboard&Itemid=36&func=view&id=18&catid=12
Have fun here on dance-forums.com !

[Zouk_Sr]

The quote should also mentioned that CLaudia de Vries has learned everything about dancing from Claudio Gomes. The bigger question is: Whyis it no where mentioned? Nowadays People that do not really dance give clases in her school . So be carefull if you want to take zouk at her place.

[Zouk_Sr]

Try zouk in Amsterdam Claudio gomes he is one of the best I have seen and I have been dancing ozouk 7 years now. Also try Mallorca and barcelona, www.lambazouk.org. and london is know to most of you.

[Sagitta]

Thanks Zouk_Sr, and welcome to df! :D What other dances do you do?

[creolevibe]

Hello all! I just wanted to let you all know about our Zouk radio show in Toronto. The station is live on Thursdays nights in Toronto, Canada on CHRY 105.5 FM and called Experience Creole.

We post our show weekly for those who are unable to tune in to the live broadcast on line, so please feel free to visit our website anytime! http://www.experiencecreole.vze.com

To listen to our archived program just click on the dancing stereo set at the site!

And please drop us an email and let us know how you like the show!

[miro]

I red someone is coming to Lisabon so I vould like to recomend some places since I have spend 8 months there.For kizomba check out african discoteques Mussulo,ComVento,Luanda,Club Naval,Havana,for live african music- Ai Ue, Kandando,Lontra,B.Leza,EnClave.For zouk brasilian style I recomend brasilian disco bars Acores,Pantai,Armazem F,Sabor a Brasil but they are dancing mostly forro,samba,axe,lambada.

[pygmalion]

Thanks for the suggestions, miro. And welcome to the forums. 8) :D

[hopelessly_addicted]

Just watched a clip from sambaworld (I think this is the only one working now). Wow! Looks like a such a fun dance.. very sexy! It's a pity that zouk is non-existance in melb as far as i am concerned..

Looks a bit like bachata in that it's danced quite closely (with the knees touching, etc)... I wanna dance Zouk now! grrrrr... Doesn't seem like a very hard dance to dance. Just stepping on different beats from salsa...

[emsalsa]

Another way to dance to Zouk music is Zouklove, it seems this is how the African people dance.. Check out this video clip (the music is overlayed, not the original music when the video was shot)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpmSsViAtU4

[nikita]

In Kizomba we have 100% body contact all the time:tongue: . The music is very romantic ( a little bit more slowly than Zouk). That's a very explosive mixture. We say, that Kizomba "kills couples", because it's really dangerous, when you're dancin' it with the right/wrong:-) person.
In Brazil they are great actually dancing Zouk. They dance apart so that there is more space for all kind of styling. It looks amazing.
As fare as I heart, there is a Zouk congress in december in Amsterdam. One of the best songs: Ludo "An ke´Baw".