How far should you go?

[clubby]

I'm new to the dance scene, but I've been doing a lot of clubbing. I know girls like to feel sexy when they are dancing at a club... My question is, as a "nice guy" who is ready to get out and shamlessly flirt, what makes a girl feel sexy... and what makes her think you're a creep?

I realize this is different for every girl, but I was hoping to hear some of your thoughts on this.
:D ---> :twisted:

[NeoDevin]

Well, as a shameless flirt myself (even ask SK!!), and a student of seduction I must say it varies completely depending on the girl, you, and her initial reaction to you. If she's attracted to you to begin with, you can get away with a lot more than if she's initially put off by you. I've met girls who will reject almost everyone (myself included) straight up, no matter what, and some girls who will make out with (or even go home with) the first decent looking guy they see on the dance floor. Most girls will vary depending on the guy, and her feelings of attraction for him.

What makes her feel sexy is to be wanted by a guy she also wants, and what makes her feel you're a creep is to be wanted too much by a guy she doesn't want, and doesn't know well.

[Jmatthew]

I think this depends a LOT on what dance you're doing. It probably depends a lot on what part of the country you live in too.

In my experience, in Swing, you basically dance on the dance floor, flirt off it. Keep the two seperate and you always have someone to dance with, even if your flirting crashes. The guys who seem to use the dance itself to flirt seem to get bad reps pretty fast. Of course, how far you consider flirting changes a lot from person to person too, and girls seem to be able to smell out intent. My basic rule: If I'll say it to someone I WOULDN"T sleep with, I'm probably okay saying it to someone I would.

Salsa seems a lot more flirty and has a lot more sexual tension. You can kind of guage this by how close the girl gets during closed position stuff. If you're basically grinding, flirting is actually stepping back a bit I think. Salsa dances tend to be tied more to alcohol consumption too, so maybe that's another reason they're a little more sexually charged.

West Coast seems to fall in the middle for me, but with West Coast I almost flirt via the dance. That is, I don't say anything, just the attitude and movement and syncopations of the dance change a little to make the dance more flirty.

I don't ballroom enough outside of school dances to have any idea what they're like, so I won't comment on them. Same with Tango. :/ Both things I'd like to fix if I can find the time and bravery. :)

[SDsalsaguy]

Salsa dances tend to be tied more to alcohol consumption too, so maybe that's another reason they're a little more sexually charged.
Maybe this is so in your scene but, everywhere I've been, salsa dancers are the least imbibing social dancers...heck, half the salsa clubs that open end up closing because the bar isn't making enough off of them!

[Jmatthew]

Wild.

That's actually what the Swing scene is like here. Clubs have trouble making money because people don't drink, so they stop having swing nights and start having more Salsa nights, because they're big money.

[Sagitta]

Salsa dances tend to be tied more to alcohol consumption too, so maybe that's another reason they're a little more sexually charged.
Maybe this is so in your scene but, everywhere I've been, salsa dancers are the least imbibing social dancers...heck, half the salsa clubs that open end up closing because the bar isn't making enough off of them!

Ditto!! Same here.

Welcome to the forums clubby!! :D

I've flirted in: Latin dancing(salsa, merengue, cha cha, bachata...), tango -It's obvious how far they want you to go. For instance last week I asked a person to dance to a song where a lot of grinding was going on (though not something I'm particularly in favor of as I don't think you need to grind to be sensual), she said no grinding before we got on the dance floor. And some followers just don't know any better, about flirting. And then I get their attention, so they come around to my way of doing things.

I've never really flirted doing: swing, waltz, foxtrot, contra, folk dancing

Zydeco...not really as it has more of a laid-back attitude...

[Vince A]

Dancing is considered some of "the best sex that you can have with your clothes on." Flirting while dancing IS considered normal. I do it a lot!

However men, first, know your limitations . . . remember you are on a dance floor - keep your hands where they belong! Even if she takes your hands and places them anywhere . . . you are on the dance floor and others are there right beside you. Have courtesy for them as well.

Second, if you are grinding, and this griding causes the "blood to flow" to certain places . . . you probably need to back off . . . most "real women that you'd like to take home to meet your parents" will probably knock your socks off if you didn't back off.

Flirting and sex begin with the eyes . . . learn to speak with your eyes . . . learn to read their eyes to see if they are"interested in you." I guarantee you that you won't get your face slapped if you do!

[pygmalion]

Second, if you are grinding, and this griding causes the "blood to flow" to certain places . . . you probably need to back off . . . most "real women that you'd like to take home to meet your parents" will probably knock your socks off if you didn't back off.

Flirting and sex begin with the eyes . . . learn to speak with your eyes . . . learn to read their eyes to see if they are"interested in you." I guarantee you that you won't get your face slapped if you do!

I've had this happen to me a few times. So, and I'm asking this seriously, what's the right way for the woman to handle this? Pretend it didn't happen, if the guy's obviously not being rude or intrusive, but just carried away with the moment? Pretty embarrassing, for me at least. So what to do? What to say? Nothing? *shrug*

[Vince A]

I've had this happen to me a few times. So, and I'm asking this seriously, what's the right way for the woman to handle this? Pretend it didn't happen, if the guy's obviously not being rude or intrusive, but just carried away with the moment? Pretty embarrassing, for me at least. So what to do? What to say? Nothing? *shrug*
I would think that would be up to each individual lady. Everyone has their own level of comfor - "or how much or what they can take."

Remember that your are there to dance . . . have fun . . . maybe meet someone . . . and for many, to have a one-night stand.

If you enjoyed the intrusion, smile and stay there? I don't know. It is fairly natural thing you know . . . and hell, he may really "be happy to see you!"

However if you didn't . . . you can always back off, slap his face, never dance with him again . . . leave and go home frustrated . . . I really don't know. If I didn't like it, I would probably would not say a thing, back off, and not dance with him again - not causing further problems.

It's your call . . . and only yours if it happens to you!

[dragon3085]

Subtly works best. Unsubtle cretins are a dime a dozen in any club. But if you make the girl feel like a lady and not a piece a meat- and don't hang around like a puppy dog she is gonna show more intrest in you. We tend to want what we can't have and if you can pull of that intrested in you but not desperate persona then you will get there attention.

[Sagitta]

What to do when an incident happens, or you don't want to grind? Back off! I think that ones reaction should depend on 1) intention 2) what you feel up to at the moment. I think it is fairly obvious whether the person is a sleazy person or not. I usually let the follower decide and go with the flow, but that's me. Sometimes, however, I'm not in a mood for any grinding and if the follow does it I back off!!

[peachexploration]

Subtly works best. Unsubtle cretins are a dime a dozen in any club. But if you make the girl feel like a lady and not a piece a meat- and don't hang around like a puppy dog she is gonna show more intrest in you. We tend to want what we can't have and if you can pull of that intrested in you but not desperate persona then you will get there attention.

Definitely agree with you, Dragon. SUBTLY works best. :D :D

[dragon3085]

makes a girl feel sexy- ok things I've noticed on average (meaning most of the girls I know or have flirted with agree) Be polite,
Face loops, Make eye contact, Smile, moves where you can lightly caress parts of the body that are socially acceptable to caress in public places- meaning no butt or chest grabbing. Eye Contact with her eyes. Moves that bring attention to her but don't put her on the spot. Lots of compliments. Your undivided attention for the dance. Confidence

What makes her think your a creep- Trying to be a teacher on the floor- critizing her or her friends dancing. Eye contact with her butt or chest- Eye contact with others girls butts and chests that are dancing near you while your supposed to be dancing with her. Trying to get a better angle to see down her shirt or the shirt of girl dancing near you or at least getting caught :twisted: . Cursing. Heavy Alcohol breath/consuption. Flirting with her and then with her friends. Pick one out the group and stick to it by god .:D Arrogance.

Ok thats all I can think of right now, I've pretty much observed all the above behaviors, good and bad, in action and I am sure other here have too.

I'm new to the dance scene, but I've been doing a lot of clubbing. I know girls like to feel sexy when they are dancing at a club... My question is, as a "nice guy" who is ready to get out and shamlessly flirt, what makes a girl feel sexy... and what makes her think you're a creep? :twisted:

[Sagitta]

Eye contact with her butt or chest

Hey if she is tall what am I supposed to do? I don't discriminate because of a person's dimensions!! :shock: :)

Flirting with her and then with her friends. Pick one out the group and stick to it by god .:D I flirt with all whom I dance with, when I dance with them. No flirting off the dance floor, unless it is in pure jest, as I know the people in the group etc...e.g. Oh, you've danced a lot with "Y" tonight, while Y is dancing with someone else. My response: So? That should tell you something, right? [g rated for df]

Trying to be a teacher on the floor I do that when appropriate. Never had this backfire on me, yet!! :)

[dragon3085]

Eye contact with her butt or chest

Hey if she is tall what am I supposed to do? I don't discriminate because of a person's dimensions!! :shock: :)
Ok I should have said no Leering then. :P

Flirting with her and then with her friends. Pick one out the group and stick to it by god .:D I flirt with all whom I dance with, when I dance with them. No flirting off the dance floor, unless it is in pure jest, as I know the people in the group etc...e.g. Oh, you've danced a lot with "Y" tonight, while Y is dancing with someone else. My response: So? That should tell you something, right? [g rated for df]

Trying to be a teacher on the floor I do that when appropriate. Never had this backfire on me, yet!! :)

Yeah put have you made her stop in the middle of a dance and stood there and 'taught' her while everybody else is watching and dancing around you. Thats what I'm talking about.

[turtle]

and don't hang around like a puppy dog .
Ummm.. i don't have this problem.. heehee...

I WILL BE ASSERTIVE. I WILL BE ASSERTIVE. I WILL BE ASSERTIVE. :evil:

[pygmalion]

However if you didn't . . . you can always back off, slap his face, never dance with him again . . . leave and go home frustrated . . . I really don't know. If I didn't like it, I would probably would not say a thing, back off, and not dance with him again - not causing further problems.

It's your call . . . and only yours if it happens to you!

I wasn't talking about ME getting over-enthused, I was talking about a couple guys I could name but won't. Since I'm not into picking up guys in bars, I generally pretend it never happened, unless the guy gets rude, intrusive, or nasty. At that point, he deserves whatever he gets. And I don't slap. Physically. But I know how to strategically stage a scene. :twisted:

And to answer clubby's original question, for me, at least, subtlety is key. Make sure you get her attention, but once you've got it, play it cool. Irresistable. :wink:

[Vince A]

Thanks Jenn for "clearing" that up.

I also want you to know that if any lady wants to "shamelessly flirt" with me or get rude and downright nasty with me . . . I let them!

[Sagitta]

Trying to be a teacher on the floor I do that when appropriate. Never had this backfire on me, yet!! :)

Yeah put have you made her stop in the middle of a dance and stood there and 'taught' her while everybody else is watching and dancing around you. Thats what I'm talking about.

Never!! Usually at the edge of the dance floor is best for a beginner. I've even taken people completely away from teh danec floor, but where the floor is okay and the music can be heard. I don't mind the middle of the dance floor with everyone watching if it's fairly empty and she doesn't mind.. I've done that. I would ask first though while dancing. Always ask if you are breaking a convention. If a follow is pretty bad, but she is not interested in learning anything, or correcting a problem that should be respected.

[Jmatthew]

I've had this happen to me a few times. So, and I'm asking this seriously, what's the right way for the woman to handle this? Pretend it didn't happen, if the guy's obviously not being rude or intrusive, but just carried away with the moment? Pretty embarrassing, for me at least. So what to do? What to say? Nothing? *shrug*

Okay, first thing to remember is that this reaction isn't voluntary. Slapping a guy because he got a little excited is a bit over the top in my opinion. We don't have to be grinding away to find ourselves "happy," it happens in class, church, any random time it feels like doing it, not just when we're aroused.

BUT, the odds are pretty good if we're getting some nasty blues or salsa on that it's the dance. Unless it's someone I'm dating, my response is to break off the contact as quickly as possible. If my follow resists and I'm comfy with it, then I'll hang, but usually it's time to do some open moves.

If he isn't breaking and you want some space, just push away a little. Any lead worth his salt will get it and lead some open stuff. If he continues to grind away, then you can slap him. :)

Guys who teach on the floor should be shot. Unless a follow asks you to teach someone or you're "borrowing" someone you know to try something out, there's just no reason to be doing it. It makes a clog in the flow of the dancing while you're standing there trying to explain where her foot is supposed to go, it breaks the social atmosphere, and it puts every girl on guard about how well she's dancing. Leave the teaching at home! Oh, and every girl I know HATES it with a passion. There's a notorious "teacher" here and we're constantly having to intervene to save our follows from him.

Eye contact with her butt or chest

I have this bad habit (which I've ALMOST got broken now) of not looking at my follow. From my follows Point of View it looks like I'm looking down or behind her. A good friend of mine pointed out that from the side of the dancefloor it looks like I"m looking at her chest. :( Talk about incentive to learn to look at your partner.

[turtle]

hey on a related note..

first a little background, lol...there's a girl i am trying to get to know :wink: better... and she's really into dancing. I've only danced once, but i wanna "put some moves on" i guess...

I am planning on going to a club by myself this weekend, and just trying to see what works and what doesn't... so, keep that advice coming, it's been a big help already!

[brujo]

Face loops, Make eye contact, Smile, moves where you can lightly caress parts of the body that are socially acceptable to caress in public places- meaning no butt or chest grabbing.


Interesting, here are some of the more subtle things that you can do to make her feel like a queen.

- Use the tips of your fingers as percussion and lightly and playfully tap her in the shoulders or as your hand is sliding down her back when appropiate, nobody but you and her notice it.

- Don't just stare at her with your eyes. Do the evil eye, the shocked and awed facial expression, smile, be sad, pretend you're chewing gum, sneer, use the other muscles in your face to convey how you feel, and be funny and play with it.

- you know that area between the elbow and her wrist? You can get a ton of contact in that area without looking like a creep and make her feel fantastic by just doing a small caress-like stroke going from a close position to an open position.

- let your personality shine through your dance. I like to improvise and be silly depending on the song. Why have the same conversation every time? Why dance the same way every time?

- You know dips, you can do big ones where she can feel very safe and can trust you. Or you can do the little ones where you are holding her tightly and safely, and just move her down a little. It is almost like giving her a hug.

- Forget the crowd. If you are really interested, dance like it was only you and her in the room. Let the music flow through you, and don't rush it or make her feel like she is going to be bumped into a wall or someone else. Make her feel safe in your arms.

Any more tips out there? Ladies?

Man, I feel like such a dirty old man now.

[peachexploration]

.....you know that area between the elbow and her wrist? You can get a ton of contact in that area without looking like a creep and make her feel fantastic by just doing a small caress-like stroke going from a close position to an open position.......

Uh oh. You found out one of the secrets! :shock: :lol: :oops: Agent 99, back to the lab.... :car: :wink:

[Vince A]

.....you know that area between the elbow and her wrist? You can get a ton of contact in that area without looking like a creep and make her feel fantastic by just doing a small caress-like stroke going from a close position to an open position.......

Uh oh. You found out one of the secrets! :shock: :lol: :oops: Agent 99, back to the lab.... :car: :wink:
That move does work, and it can be attributed to the movie "Dirty Dancing."

[pygmalion]

Yes, that move works. :oops: 8)

Brujo, you've been keeping your senstive nature hidden all this time, you manly-man you. :wink: :D