Finding love and romance on the dancefloor?

[pygmalion]

Okay. So we've talked at length about no-go dance romance scenarios. Generally speaking, no romance between teachers and students. Often, no romance between practice or performance partners. But I'd be willing to bet we all know successful and even thriving dance romances. So all this lack of romance begs, at least for me, a question. What are the situations in which dance romances are okay, or even ideal?

(I'm not asking for myself, btw. I've got my bases covered. LOL)

[Swing Kitten]

have a big enough scene so when things go sour you still have plenty of other people to dance with ;)

[tsb]

have a big enough scene so when things go sour you still have plenty of other people to dance with ;)

and large enough dance floors where you can avoid watching your ex-SO tearing up the floor with their new SO - or vice versa, should it be unavoidable to continue patronizing the same venues.

of course, that didn't keep one ex-partner from leaving if i showed up (she wanted a relationship, i didn't)

[salsachinita]

This is a potentially tricky, but sometimes unavoidable situation......given the amount of time & energy we social dancers spend in the scene, with each other.

Love & romance happen all the time. You see people pair off, then they either disappear, or still show up as couples.

As SK said, the scene needs to be big enough to be healthy. But very often it's not the case....so it almost becomes a fine art in dealing with your ex SO being active on the scene.

As mature adults, these skills shouldn't be hard to develope 8) .

(I have many thoughts on this topic, but I want to hear what others have to say :wink: . So go on, guys.......and experiences? We love good stories :wink: )

[Sagitta]

(I have many thoughts on this topic, but I want to hear what others have to say :wink: . So go on, guys.......and experiences? We love good stories :wink: )

Too new to dance to have experienced any dance romances. :) I'm a terrible flirt on the dance floor, but I'm not much of one off the floor, when I go dancing. (It's a frame of mind issue for me.) I can see how romances can bloom in dance, though. I look forward to being regaled with tales for near and afar. :)

[dancing_moogle]

(I have many thoughts on this topic, but I want to hear what others have to say :wink: . So go on, guys.......and experiences? We love good stories :wink: )

Hehe... I was gonna share you my experience, but it's too long. But the result was not very positive. :cry:

If there's anything else I can say about this, I feel there's too big a mixture of feelings in the ballroom - happiness (having fun to dance with your guy/girl-friend), jealousy (with partners), hatred (you just don't like someone's face), and sadness (when a guy/girl you meet dumps you to befriend another). So how can it be possible to find love in a ballroom?

[tsb]

(I have many thoughts on this topic, but I want to hear what others have to say :wink: . So go on, guys.......and experiences? We love good stories :wink: )

i'm going to hazard a guess and say that the most... interesting stories, if any, will come from the argentine tango and the salsa crowds.

[TheArchon]

When i find a girl i like, i dont really care where i've found her, and i love to flirt(even if im not gonna ask the girls out, mostly because of age problems).

Where i dance there are alot of ppl(sometimes 400), and always new ones come.

[pygmalion]

Come on, people! What's a little self-disclosure between mostly anonymous cyber friends? You'd think I asked for your bank balance! :shock: :lol:

Okay. Here goes. I have very limited experience with ballroom romance, because, well ... not sure why. Things just never seemed to gel in that department. Besides, when I started dancing, I was going through a fairly protracted non-dance related breakup, so I wasn't up for romance.

That didn't stop me from developing a mild crush on a guy I used to dance with fairly often. We were partnered in a bunch of formations, to the point where people would start asking us about each other's whereabouts. We exchanged lots of emails, had an occasional drink. Friendship stuff. You know the deal. But all that dancing in body contact, and a friendship/mild flirtation started feeling like more. Plus, he and I have similar backgrounds in corporate America, and similar world views, and we were both unattached.

You know what saved me from utter foolishness? Another woman at the studio developed a serious yen for him, and, believe it or not, warned me off her "man." What a hoot! I suddenly got flashbacks to seventh grade fistfights over "boyfriends," and withdrew. It just wasn't worth it, particualrly since he was developing into a good friend. So why blow it by pursuing a romantic relationship that was misguided and would be short-lived at best? (btw, he and she still aren't an item, a year and a half later! :twisted: :lol: )

He and I are still friends, by the way. But I'm sure we probably wouldn't have been, if things had gone the other way.

Okay. Now does anybody feel more comfortable telling their tales of woe? :wink:

[TheArchon]

pygmalion, I don't see the point, in what way the dance floor differ from any other romantic situation :? :?:

[pygmalion]

In my view, dance romances are similar to office romances. A total non-issue for some, but for others a huge issue.

The problem is that, like offices, dance communities tend to be small, gossipy and closely interconnected. So what happens if/when the romance ends becomes a major issue for some people. Also, even if the relationship is just fine, there will be ups and downs. Observers can't help but see what's going on and speculate.

People are pretty gossipy creatures, I think. And having people gossip about me doesn't bother me much. But knowing that people are talking about you compounds the pain of any breakup. I hope that makes sense.

I'll give a couple examples.

When I had my little crush on my friend/dance partner, I had more than a few people ask me about it, subtly, or make references to my relationship with him. I brushed off the sideways requests for info, and lightly told people we were "very good friends," which was true, then and now. But people were curious.

When a local dance couple broke off their partnership/relationship last year, there was all sorts of speculation behind their backs about a romance gone sour.

When a gentleman at my former studio was going through a rocky patch in his marriage, everyone speculated behind his back about potential outcomes. When he divorced six months later, ladies literally fought for the poor guy's attention, and it got really ugly, until one lady "won" him for herself.

So I guess my answer is that it's not different from any other romance, but because of the fishbowl effect, any ramifications are magnified. If you break up from the girl you met by chance on the train, you never have to see her again. But if you break up from your dance partner, chances are you'll see her again, lots of times.

[HothouseSalsero]

I don't feel I can afford to avoid dance-related romances, since I would really prefer that my partner be a dancer (and a salsera, at that) and dancing is one of the most comfortable ways I have found for meeting women.

I've had some experiences that relate to the question. There was someone I wanted to date, who initially seemed to be flirting with me, but it turned out that she was only interested in a dancing relationship. She and I were practice partners for a little while, but when it became clear to me that she wasn't interested in more, I dropped her--I wouldn't even dance with her any more, at least partly because I didn't need to torment myself. She has left the dance scene, but we have ended up keeping in touch and the bad feelings have been ironed out. I would dance with her now, but I would keep my distance (emotionally). I don't think spending a lot of time around her would be a good idea, at any rate.

Two summers ago, I met someone at a couple salsa events (though it turned out we had met before that--and she had probably scoped me out before we even met). We started dating. Ironically, although we were both dancers, I ended up dancing less after I met her, because our dates didn't just revolve around dancing (and I couldn't stay up dancing until 2AM on Friday and be ready for a date with her on Saturday). I intentionally wanted to do other sorts of things, so that we could learn more about each other, and to have a more well-rounded relationship.

She broke up with me near the beginning of last summer. I have not seen her since. Although it would have been nice for me if she had been more of a salsera and less of a smooth ballroom fan, in the long run that difference has been helpful. She will not automatically be showing up in the same places I go salsa dancing. As it turns out, she also moved out of state at around the time we broke up. On top of that, she was planning on visiting Europe some time this year, to stay with her mother and brother who have been there for about a year. So, she is conveniently out of my way, and I don't have to deal with the potential emotional jolt of seeing her.

[pygmalion]

Emotional jolt. That's a great description, Hothouse Salsero.

And, considering the overwhelming "no" response to the question "Would you date or marry someone who's not a dancer?" in another thread, I guess a lot of us are in your shoes. Dance romance is unavoidable, but really hurts when it ends.

I don't know that there's a good way to work around the issues. :?

[Sagitta]

And, considering the overwhelming "no" response to the question "Would you date or marry someone who's not a dancer?" in another thread.... Dance romance is unavoidable, but really hurts when it ends.

I don't know that there's a good way to work around the issues. :?

And you remind me of what is said!! :oops: I would say that I have felt mild attraction to a couple people, but nothing more developed out of it out of my own choosing. :wink: How can it not if you dance latin with someone time and time again, and you get that special connection of music/partner/yourself as one? Specially when it's a lot harder to achieve that with others!

[dr_fuzz]

I wonder about it all the time and being an overly romantic sod I often used to think it would be great to have a more intimate relationship with a dance partner. However I also worried about having a nasty breakup which might ending up causing waves in the small local social dance scene.

Funnily enough these days I find that the feelings that I have for different partners really varies between different dance styles. I dance with a hell of a lot of girls in Lindy and yet I've never been even remotely attracted to any of them. Yet in A.Tango I found myself maddenly attracted to several of the lasses there. I suspect that its due to the fact that both dances tend to attract a different crowds and so I may find more of an affinity with one group over the other.

However I wonder if it isn't more due to the different emotions of the dances. In A.Tango I feel a more intimate, deeper and sensual connection with my partners while for Lindy the connection is more fun but not really so ..... emotional.

Oh and since I'm married I prefer to keep the level of intimacy with my dance partners to 'maddenly attracted'.

Fuzz

[pygmalion]

Oh and since I'm married I prefer to keep the level of intimacy with my dance partners to 'maddenly attracted'.

Fuzz

Hey dr_fuzz. :)

I think you make a good point that a lot of people miss. Just because you feel attracted to someone, doesn't make it love. And you don't necessarily have to act on your feelings of attraction.

I had a sometimes feeling of attraction to one of my former dance teachers, but, early in the game, decided that it was not something I intended to pursue. Ever. And that worked out just fine. He was cute, I enjoyed his company and our lessons, but it never went any further than that. I just never allowed myself to go there mentally. Works for me. :wink:

[foursquare]

I'll weigh in. My girlfriend and I go out 2 -3 nights a week swing dancing. We only dance with each other thus avoiding situations like jealousy, etc. It might not make us better dancers, but it does make a better relationship... and that's really the important part.

We've been together a year and a half, and dancing together since last September.

foursquare
(Oh, and did I mention the 14 year age difference? Surprisingly, we're very happy and still going strong!)

[pygmalion]

Hi foursquare. Long time no see. Glad to see you back in the forums. :D

[foursquare]

Oh, I never left. :D I read DF every day, and people far more eloquent than I usually post opinons I more or less agree with so I keep my big yap shut.

When one strikes home though, I feel compelled to respond. This thread, for instance.

I find it odd that people find it odd that we want to go out dancing with each other and not just meet back at the table every now and again to compare notes.

I like taking a pretty girl for a whirl on the floor as much as the next guy; since I have one that likes to dance, why spend the time we're out away from her?

For example: I like to cook. If I were to go out 4 nights a week and cook for another girl, I am SURE that it would make me better when I come back and cook for my girlfriend on the 5th night. But is the good (better cook) really balanced well against only cooking for her 1/5 of the time? Which is better for the relationship? A good she can experience all the time or a better she can only experience some of the time?

We chose the former.

foursquare
(I still love your posts, Pyg! Hm. That abreviation doesn't sound very good, but it's meant in the most endearing way!)

[pygmalion]

It's good to know you were here all along, foursquare. :D I'm glad you were here. 8)

And it's good to know your dancing with each other policy is still making you both happy. Good deal.

(I still love your posts, Pyg! Hm. That abreviation doesn't sound very good, but it's meant in the most endearing way!)
:oops: :oops: Thanks. And I guess, if I didn't want to get called Pyg, I should have spent more time thinking about the ol' username. LOL. No problem. I can feel the affection from here. :D

[youngsta]

This is such a double edged sword! On one hand I actively try to avoid falling for any woman in my dance scene. When I go out to dance that's all I want it to be about. On the other hand I REALLY want my next relationship to be with a dancer. I just think that would be amazing (and it doesn't hurt to have a practice partner for when those flashes of dance genius occur!)

I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

[tsb]

This is such a double edged sword! On one hand I actively try to avoid falling for any woman in my dance scene. When I go out to dance that's all I want it to be about. On the other hand I REALLY want my next relationship to be with a dancer. I just think that would be amazing (and it doesn't hurt to have a practice partner for when those flashes of dance genius occur!)

I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

amen.

[Sakura]

:) Somehow, I get the feeling that I'm a bit young to be commenting here, but, :) hey, it's all good between friends, eh?
To begin with, I've never had good relationships (romantically speaking.) Any guy that has every really wanted to go out with me was one of my really close guy friends, who I didn't like in that way. After that, I've lost two very good guy friends in loveless relationships. The first I lost thanks to school atmosphere. Everyone said things like, "Oh, you two should go out!..... You'd be so cute together!..... Etc..." to us, so we'd say that we were going out to get people off of our backs, but it never really helped, and I think that he really had wanted the relationship, but I didn't. In the second case, band romance gone bad. I met guy number two over the summer in marching band, and at State Fair, since we'd made it into the night show, it was about 11:45, I'd done a lot of walking, and I was tired, so I was resting my head on his shoulder, and he gave me a piggy back ride. More of the "You should go out," ensued, he asked me out, and I suppose I didn't want to hurt his feelings, so I said yes. In the end for both of them, I realized that I didn't want the relationship, I didn't want to be trapped in a loveless relationship, and I didn't want to delude the guys I was in them any longer... I still feel bad because I know I broke their hearts and I can't do anything to help with that... :cry: Ha, so there's my sob story! :wink:
Now that I'm dancing, things are interesting.......

Generally speaking, no romance between teachers and students.

*laughs* There's no romance between myself and my teacher, but I gotta say, he's probably the best guy I've ever met! :D :oops: He's sooo nice, very charming, funny, smart, paranoid of being mean or rude (when he's correcting), a very gentle but strong lead, and quite a looker! I know that he's gotta be much older than I, but I really don't know. Mum and I estimate him to be in his mid-twenties. =^_^= Also, his competition parter and he seem to be close; I still don't know their relationship. *laughs* :D But it's okay. I'm sure everything on my part is one-sided, but I don't mind. I just think that I'm lucky to have such a great guy as a teacher!
So, that's my show-and-tell for the day! Night everybody!
Sakura Kitty :kitty:

[salsachinita]

This is such a double edged sword!
I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

Tell me about it!

[salsachinita]

it's not different from any other romance, but because of the fishbowl effect, any ramifications are magnified.

:shock: Fishbowl effect! :shock:

:lol: :lol: :lol: how true!

[danceguy]

Yikes, can I relate to this right about now... :?

As I'm getting more involved in my local dance scene, I'm starting to wonder about dating any of the women that are regulars. On one hand, I'd like to have a girlfriend who danced Salsa, but on the other I'm finding myself hesitant to get to know anyone too personally.

I simply hate gossip, and I'm extremely private about my personal life, so I'm left with a lot of questions that I don't have answers to yet. But as dance has become such a big part of my life (already been out three times this week!), I also consider that this could become an issue if I date someone who doesn't dance.

On a side note, those of you who do have a partner that dances as well, how do you set your boundaries with the other people you dance with? For instance, where is the line drawn for how sensually you dance with others?

I ask this as I've found that I'm really unattracted to women who do a lot of bump and grind in their Salsa dancing. I recently had my first experience at a more "meat market" type of club and I didn't like the energy there at all. I don't know how much "dirty dancing" I would do even if was dancing with someone I was involved with, or also if I would be able to cope with my partner doing this with someone else.

I love the sensual side of Salsa, but to me there's a very fine line between being sensual and being sleazy. Or maybe I'm just old fashioned?

Thoughts anyone?

Best,

SG

[salsachinita]

Sharing time 8) ............

Most of m relationships in the past 15 years are somehow salsa-related. Even with the salsa-hating one (whom I lived with for 3 years :shock: ).... I went out with him coz I was FED UP with going out with salseros :roll: ..

I think a balanced relationship is the one that WILL survive in this scene. Both parties have to be extremely secured within themselves, and have a solid foundation with a great deal of trust.

It is best for both parties to have the same level of enthusiasm/energy/proficiency. Otherwise willingness to work through these issues. These are just a few things.

Just because your SO is in the dance scene (even a pro) doesn't mean that you will be doing just as much dancing pre-relationship.

Examples.....? No worries...

Last year I've dated this dance instructor for a short time. At first everything seemed to work. Until he wanted to start 'the couch potato couple' thing :shock: instead of going out dancing :x ! There were other non-dance-related issues too, but NOT wanting to go dancing (& wanted ME to be his potato partner) was the real killer.

Difference in proficiency level could also be a stress factor. My mentor/ex was already a well-known salsero when we met, so I was constantly feeling inadequate (especially difficult when there would always be a line of women waiting to dance with him :roll: ).

The reverse also (didn't) works. In recent times newbie salseros who might have potentially be interested in me often chickened out (way before I knew that they are interested). I would find out ages later :roll: !

DJ/musicians can work, but they often want you to sit there while they play. Absolute torture :evil: ..........

Dance partners are tricky. If the feeling is one-sided, then the partnership also tends to suffer (I've been on both ends :roll: )

As Pygmalion said, with the 'fishbowl' effect, any new blood into the scene initially causes a bit of 'feeding frenzy', until somebody got him/her, when balance is restored.

These are my thoughts without getting into great details :wink: ......

[salsachinita]

how do you set your boundaries with the other people you dance with? For instance, where is the line drawn for how sensually you dance with others?

I know what you are talking about......been there.......

Ultimately it's up to the two of you. We all have different comfort level of how sensual with dance with others. Not to mention watching your SO doing the same.........

CarpricornDancer was right when he said (to a group of us over coffee): "You know you are doing alright when you can actually enjoy watching your SO dancing with someone else....."

Easier said than done, but we can work on ourselves. It's all about being secured within yourselve & your relationship 8) .

[danceguy]

Thank you for sharing salsachinita. As I am still "new blood" I've yet to have dated a dancer, although the fact that I got into salsa in a failed attempt to impress a lady that I was courting. :wink:

I do enjoy that dancing allows you to get a feel for someone's personality...I've been amazed at how many women I've met and felt an attraction, only to dance with them and find that the attraction faded quickly once I got to know them a bit.

I have enough trouble dating to begin with, but then again I don't like to get into my head too much about romance. I prefer to just let things develop naturally, and if it feels right, well then by all means go for it.

Usually, a little heartbreak is worth wondering "what if" the rest of your life...well sometimes that is... :?

[TheArchon]

Yesterday I've asked a girl out, from the dancefloor i go to, its about time, it been 6 months since my ex... I do hope i will be intersted in her for more then 2 weeks(more then one date would be a great improvment).

But as it truned out, I've never noticed her on the dancefloor, when i got out, she asked me for a ride home, a being a gentelman... :wink: :shock: .

[SDsalsaguy]

Dance partners are tricky. If the feeling is one-sided, then the partnership also tends to suffer (I've been on both ends :roll: ):
Yeah, I've been on both sides myself as well... always a sticky situation. :(

CarpricornDancer: "You know you are doing alright when you can actually enjoy watching your SO dancing with someone else....."
This is soooooooo true :!:


TheArchon... good luck... and keep us posted! :wink:

[tsb]

As I'm getting more involved in my local dance scene, I'm starting to wonder about dating any of the women that are regulars. On one hand, I'd like to have a girlfriend who danced Salsa, but on the other I'm finding myself hesitant to get to know anyone too personally.

i've come to compare dating most serious salseras to eating fish caught out of santa monica bay (the mercury levels are....).


On a side note, those of you who do have a partner that dances as well, how do you set your boundaries with the other people you dance with? For instance, where is the line drawn for how sensually you dance with others?

i try moves early on in the dance that both let my partner set boundaries and let me establish my own, usually by doing a "head comb - body wave" type move. if she doesn't want to be touched she'll usually give me enough resistance. and in keeping with my midwestern upbringing, i may move my hands down her back but i don't make actual contact until i reach the sides of her hips.

(this assumes that your partner is able to set their own boundaries. if they can't, they have no business dancing salsa - more on this below).


I ask this as I've found that I'm really unattracted to women who do a lot of bump and grind in their Salsa dancing. I recently had my first experience at a more "meat market" type of club and I didn't like the energy there at all. I don't know how much "dirty dancing" I would do even if was dancing with someone I was involved with, or also if I would be able to cope with my partner doing this with someone else.

I love the sensual side of Salsa, but to me there's a very fine line between being sensual and being sleazy. Or maybe I'm just old fashioned?


how do they say it? "i can't define obscenity but i know it when i see it". while certain standards are different for everyone, no one should never feel like they have to apologize when something makes them feel uncomfortable.

on the other hand, people who may be hyper-sensitive should not be able to hold others emotional hostage. and i submit that folks in this category should not dance salsa. i stepped on a land mine emotionally speaking once that almost made me quit salsa as someone who had a history of sexual abuse acccused me of being inappropriate (if you ask anyone who knows me you'd know how absurd that is as well as how an accusation like that would really bother me).

[danceguy]

on the other hand, people who may be hyper-sensitive should not be able to hold others emotional hostage. and i submit that folks in this category should not dance salsa. i stepped on a land mine emotionally speaking once that almost made me quit salsa as someone who had a history of sexual abuse acccused me of being inappropriate (if you ask anyone who knows me you'd know how absurd that is as well as how an accusation like that would really bother me).

Yikes, that must have been really uncomfortable.

I really pay attention to how the women react when I lead them to the floor...how they hold my hand, and then how they hold themselves with you. I'm not a touchy feely type (except with someone I'm dating, I'm a trained massage therapist, heh), and I am somewhat reserved about intense body contact during dancing. I have very large personal boundaries, so I extend to others what I would hope to receive from them in return.

Who knows how things may change for me as I get more into dance. Its kind of like seeing public displays of affection...it tends to bother me most of time I see it...but I also happen to be one of the worst offenders!

Ahem...I better shut up now. :wink:

[salsachinita]

Its kind of like seeing public displays of affection...

Now you are getting somewhere, SG!

Salsa is exactly that. Public display of affection (for each other, for the dance, for the music, or all of the above :wink: )!

Why are we uncomfortable with public display of affection? What are we afraid of?

It's one thing to be playful/flirtatious while dancing with non-SO. When you are dancing with your SO, somehow it's different.....everybody can sense it! I am sure Boriken can describe it better than I can....... I am speaking from experience, so you are just gonna have to take my word for it :wink: ............

[Swing Kitten]

Why are we uncomfortable with public display of affection? What are we afraid of?

I think those feelings come from times when we didn't have it and seeing others who do. It can hurt to watch.

What do you all think about this?

[SDsalsaguy]

Why are we uncomfortable with public display of affection? What are we afraid of?

I think those feelings come from times when we didn't have it and seeing others who do. It can hurt to watch.

What do you all think about this?
I so very, very much agree with you SK! Couldn't agree more in fact.

[Sagitta]

Its kind of like seeing public displays of affection...

Now you are getting somewhere, SG!

Salsa is exactly that. Public display of affection (for each other, for the dance, for the music, or all of the above :wink: )!

Why are we uncomfortable with public display of affection? What are we afraid of?


There's nothing to be afriad of!!! :) I actually am not uncomfortable with that at all. I used to be, but that was because I wasn't personally very affectionate in public. That has changed now, and my personal space is now nonexistent, as long as that person does not have bad breath etc...

[danceguy]

I think those feelings come from times when we didn't have it and seeing others who do. It can hurt to watch.

What do you all think about this?

You hit the nail on the head SK, and I agree with you 100%. When I'm involved with a lady, seeing another couple together will usually make me think "man, I sure miss my sweetie right now, I better give her a call"...but if you're single...its usually a reminder of something you've had, lost, or wish you had again. Depending on your mood, it can inspire you or cause a lot of old emotions you thought you were over to come back to haunt you!

I have to put my own ego aside and admit that its the same with dancing...while on one hand I'm not into really sensual "dirty" dancing...when I see others do it, what I feel is a mixture of disgust, fear and jealously. I'll admit it here as I'm sure others can relate. :?

But as I mentioned before, while I am very private about my personal life, most of my friends are shocked when I tell them about some of my public displays of affection. I'm not the type to do it on purpose...but if the mood is right...well the passionate side me of comes into play and to hell with whoever happens to be watching! :twisted:

Ok, I'm shutting up again. :wink:

SG

[salsachinita]

I have to put my own ego aside and admit that its the same with dancing...while on one hand I'm not into really sensual "dirty" dancing...when I see others do it, what I feel is a mixture of disgust, fear and jealously. I'll admit it here as I'm sure others can relate. :?

Hmmm......we are getting somewhere with this.

So the feelings evoked when watching a couple dancing salsa with sensual connection is the same as watching a couple displaying affection in public.

Very interesting 8) ...........

[pygmalion]

Very interesting. I hadn't connected sensual dancing with physical displays of affection. But maybe you're right and they are connected, since I'm into both. :twisted: :lol:

[salsachinita]

maybe you're right and they are connected, since I'm into both. :twisted: :lol:

:lol: Me too 8) !

Just a thought :? , is one form more acceptable than the other......?

[danceguy]

Salsachinita - Yes indeed. Its even worse if the person you're watching is someone you've got the hots for...this is still a new world to me but I'm learning little by little. :?

Very interesting. I hadn't connected sensual dancing with physical displays of affection. But maybe you're right and they are connected, since I'm into both.

Pygmalion! You remind me of Sagitta, another wild person in disguise. :shock:

I'm surprised that I admitted things about myself in this thread...for me its all about how I feel with the particular person involved.

So far I haven't reached this level of expression in my dancing...I've still got too many walls around myself...but who knows what the future may bring. :wink:

[Swing Kitten]

Depending on your mood, it can inspire you or cause a lot of old emotions you thought you were over to come back to haunt you!

I agree... it's not always a negative thing -- even when you're single.

good to know somebody's gettin' the lovin' ;)

[danceguy]

I agree... it's not always a negative thing -- even when you're single.

good to know somebody's gettin' the lovin'

Yup, sometimes it can make you smile to see two people who look very happy together, dancing or otherwise. :)

[tsb]

on the other hand, people who may be hyper-sensitive should not be able to hold others emotional hostage. and i submit that folks in this category should not dance salsa. i stepped on a land mine emotionally speaking once that almost made me quit salsa as someone who had a history of sexual abuse acccused me of being inappropriate (if you ask anyone who knows me you'd know how absurd that is as well as how an accusation like that would really bother me).

Yikes, that must have been really uncomfortable.

i'd rather go see a proctologist named dr. hook than go though that again. <sigh>

the punch line is that the person in question is a therapist.

[danceguy]

i'd rather go see a proctologist named dr. hook than go though that again. <sigh>

the punch line is that the person in question is a therapist.

Good lord. :headwall:

Well, my best advice for anyone in college was simply "never date Psychology majors!". I took a lot of Psych courses and my stars did I meet some real crazy people! :oops:

I've found that there are two kinds of people who study Psychology - the ones that really sincerely want to help people, and the others are bonafide nut cases who are trying to figure themselves out!

I made the mistake of dating a few of them...never again!

So remember, if you are in college and meet a Psych major, RUN! :shock:

[tsb]

i'd rather go see a proctologist named dr. hook than go though that again. <sigh>

the punch line is that the person in question is a therapist.

I've found that there are two kinds of people who study Psychology - the ones that really sincerely want to help people, and the others are bonafide nut cases who are trying to figure themselves out!


i've become leery of social workers too; redeemer tendencies.

but i also know of folks who use dance to 'medicate' some serious emotional needs, too, generally in latin based dances. scary.

[dancin_feet]

Not a dancing romance story, but relevant nonetheless.

I became aware of a guy being really interested in me at dancing, and he was a great guy to dance with, but for me that's as far as it went. He however, one night after a dancing social function tried to do the old "quick peck" thing. I saw him coming and ducked, so he got my cheek instead. :oops:

Ever since then I just don't feel comfortable dancing with him (he comes looking for me). Just gives me the creeps as he just doesn't seem to get the hint. I tend to grab the nearest guy when I see him coming or go to get a drink, so that I'm otherwise occupied. :?

[tsb]

Not a dancing romance story, but relevant nonetheless.

I became aware of a guy being really interested in me at dancing, and he was a great guy to dance with, but for me that's as far as it went. He however, one night after a dancing social function tried to do the old "quick peck" thing. I saw him coming and ducked, so he got my cheek instead. :oops:

Ever since then I just don't feel comfortable dancing with him (he comes looking for me). Just gives me the creeps as he just doesn't seem to get the hint. I tend to grab the nearest guy when I see him coming or go to get a drink, so that I'm otherwise occupied. :?

i don't know what passes for typical behavior 'down under' but it sounds like you feel trapped within a misunderstanding of the "never say 'no'" guideline. but if you take a closer look at the original premise:

"A lady cannot refuse the invitation of a gentleman to dance, unless
she has already accepted that of another, for she would be guilty of
an incivility which might occasion trouble; she would moreover seem to
show contempt for him who she refused, and would expose herself to
receive an ill compliment from him."
--The Gentleman and Lady's Book, Mme. Delnart. 1833

the point is that you accept an invitation to dance so as to avoid giving offense. but in this case we're talking about someone who has given offense and disrespects you enough to continue to try and force himself on you even though you've made it clear you're not interested that way. so the next time he approaches you, just tell him no. if he's rude enough to ask why, say what you said to us that he now gives you the creeps after his attempt to kiss you and that he seems to refuse to take your hints that you're not interested. if he still persists, start telling him no and then dance with someone else. if he refuses to take "no" politely...

IMHO. YMMV.

[Jmatthew]

Well, my best advice for anyone in college was simply "never date Psychology majors!". I took a lot of Psych courses and my stars did I meet some real crazy people!

Hey, I'm a psyche major. :(

I'm gonna go cry now :(

But seriousely, back to the question at hand. I don't think I could date a non-dancer. I'm not sure I could date a non-lindy hopper. She certainly doesn't have to be as addicted as I am, but if she doesn't ever Lindy, then we're not going to be spending much time together.

As for watching your SO dance with other guys, I havne't had a serious girlfriend during my dancing career, so I can't speak personally, BUT, in general I think it's a trust issue. I've dated some very flirty girls, some of which really frustrated me (because I knew she was shopping for back-ups) and some of which just amused me (because I knew she loved me and the flirting stopped there.)

I think dancing is a lot like that. Do I trust my girlfriend? Is she getting down and dirty with that guy because she likes the dance or the guy? If his hands are wandering am I worried that she likes it, or am I confident that she's just trying to let it go to avoid a scene? Is she coming to me and bitching about it afterwards and wanting protection from the creep? I'm not gonna sweat it if my SO is kissing in a play, why would I sweat it if a dance gets a little romantic? Unless she's collecting numbers I can't imagine anything to worry about. I have to assume I offer her hot dances AND other things, these guys just offer her hot dances. They can't compete. ;)

Another comparison: When I see friends getting hot on the dance floor I don't assume they're getting ready to go home with the person. Or even likes the person. I certainly don't think about hooking up during actual dances (between dances maybe, but during the dance the dance kind of consumes me). Since I know my friends well enough to know they're not going to run off with random-guy or -girl after a hot dance, why would I assume differently of my girl?

And if it's just an issue of "She's mine, she shouldn't be dancing with him like that" then you just have different issues entirely and need to re-examine exactly what you're looking for out of this relationship (I.E. a partner or a possession.)

[salsachinita]

Ok, one more post before I go get ready for salsa :wink: ......

Reading JM's post, two things came to mind:

1. Dancers involved in a dance = Actors engaged in a scene.

I had a conversation not so long ago about this. I think if you can watch your SO acting in a passionate scene, you can also watch him/her during a sensual dance.

2. TRUST.

I will give a model example here. This couple are pretty well-known locally. He is a percussionist playing for one of the famous Australian artists (not Kylie Minogue) & tours a lot. She is a hot R&B dancer always seen at our hippest clubs. They each respect the other's independece/career, and often go out separately, then try meet up when possible, to have the last dance of the night together. While they are not able to spend a lot of time together, they have a very solid bond.

So few people I know can obtain that level of trust..........

[foursquare]

Jmatthew wrote:
>>>
“I think dancing is a lot like that. Do I trust my girlfriend? Is she getting down and dirty with that guy because she likes the dance or the guy? If his hands are wandering am I worried that she likes it, or am I confident that she's just trying to let it go to avoid a scene? Is she coming to me and bitching about it afterwards and wanting protection from the creep? I'm not gonna sweat it if my SO is kissing in a play, why would I sweat it if a dance gets a little romantic? Unless she's collecting numbers I can't imagine anything to worry about. I have to assume I offer her hot dances AND other things, these guys just offer her hot dances. They can't compete.”
>>>

I trust my girlfriend very much, but that’s really not the issue as far as my girlfriend and I are concerned. When we go out dancing, we have dinner, we get a bottle of wine, we chat, we snuggle, we get all smoochy faced, and we dance. For us, it is a romantic evening out on the town. We’re not dancing to become a better lead and follow, we’re not perfecting new moves; we’re enjoying each other’s company for a few hours. When I am out to romance my girlfriend, why on earth would I be romancing another girl on the dance floor? Romance is romance, and that it occurs under the magic umbrella of dancing is, to me, a weak argument to be enjoying that romance with someone other than your significant other. It smacks of loopholes that you can enjoy an evening of fun and romance and “hot dances” with women you don’t have to buy dinner and drinks for. :wink:

Oh, and wandering hands? Does it really matter if she enjoys it or not if that’s occuring? Trust me, there would be scene (and likely a pushy, perhaps punchy one.) :x

Jmatthew wrote:
>>>
“Another comparison: When I see friends getting hot on the dance floor I don't assume they're getting ready to go home with the person. Or even likes the person. I certainly don't think about hooking up during actual dances (between dances maybe, but during the dance the dance kind of consumes me). Since I know my friends well enough to know they're not going to run off with random-guy or -girl after a hot dance, why would I assume differently of my girl?”
>>>

When I am getting hot on the dance floor, I am doing it SPECIFICALLY to go home with that person (you know… my girlfriend)!

Jmatthew wrote:
>>>
“And if it's just an issue of "She's mine, she shouldn't be dancing with him like that" then you just have different issues entirely and need to re-examine exactly what you're looking for out of this relationship (I.E. a partner or a possession.)”
>>>

She IS mine and she shouldn’t be dancing with him like that. Nor I some other chick. Dancing (IMNSHO) is courtship and love and romance and intimacy. Brother, she’s not my possession (Hoo-boy, not even CLOSE. Yikes! :shock: She would pound me good if I started acting like that!), but are you really suggesting that it shouldn’t be troublesome to have an SO that’s looking for romance and intimacy in someone other than me? How often do you send your girlfriend off to dinner and a movie alone with your best friend? It would seem that if you’re trusting, it shouldn’t be a problem. How about long walks holding hands with Other Guy? Is that permissible in a trusting relationship? What about snuggling on the couch watching TV with Other Guy? Is that all right as long as there is mutual trust? Am I missing something here? Am I to rate the quality of our relationship based on the times we are not engaged in sharing it?

I think we can agree that there are lines that really shouldn’t be crossed in a committed and loving relationship but perhaps our lines are drawn further apart. Mine is drawn at romance and intimacy that doesn’t involve me. Hers too, as evidenced by the girl walking up to our table last night for a dance and my girlfriend’s fingernail marks in my forearm this morning. :wink: To each is own, and you gots to dance with them what brung you.

[pygmalion]

Hmm. I guess it's all a matter of personal preference, and what each of us is comfortable with.

I'll give a non-dance example. Myself. :lol: My former SO LOVES women. I mean, he really loves women. He has more girlfriends than I do, all of them platonic, but lots of girlfriends everywhere. Lunches, dinners, emails, phone calls, instant messaging. You name it. None of it bothered me at all, because ... I don't know. It just didn't. I had many a friend, my mom, and others tell me I should stop him from having all those relationships with other women. But, to me, those weren't "relationships" in the loaded sense we Americans like to use the word. They were friendships, and perfectly okay with me. Hey. I have friends who are straight women, friends, who are lesbians, and lots of friends who are guys too.

So, to me, there's no absolute right or wrong, here. There's only what works for the couple, on and/or off the dance floor. Every relationship is negotiated between the people in it isn't it?. And that goes for dance relationships, too, I think. *shrug*

[Sagitta]

Very interesting hearing from you foursquare, as always. YOu definitely bring a completely different perspective to the idea of sensuality and dance. I personally will flirt with anyone on the dance floor. Actually, let me correct myself. I will even shake my booty or shake theirs. There are those whose husbands don't dance, and come out dancing. I flirt with them, and no-one else does!! :shock: :? There are those young ones who dance with a blank face, and I make those features crack!! :) And you know what? I never have a problem with it. I believe that my intentions are always clear, and that's what counts!! :D

[foursquare]

My former SO LOVES women.

Former? :wink: This kind of made me chuckle in the context of the remainder of your post. :)

I personally would have found the extent to which your previous SO kept up with those chicks a bit crazy-making. Dinner? Lunches? Email? Phone calls? Yikes. But that's just me.

The desire to couple between men and women (and others, but that's a different thread) is hard-wired in our brains. We seek companionship with each other; we can't help it. And keeping this in mind, consider the numerous studies that show that a high percentage of people that have an affair never set out to have one. It happened because of mutual attraction exacerbated by proximity and time spent together.

"It just happened" is usually a process with a lengthy history that started with mutual attraction, proximity and time together.

If it's all about the dance, then why are there so many posts over on Yehoodi about the hottest (not most competent) follows? If it's all about the dance, why aren't we all out there getting sensual on the floor with our mothers or grandmothers (Ew)?

I agree with you though, Pyg (I use the abbrevation because I keep forgetting how to spell "Pygmalion,") a relationship is whatever the pair of people involved make of it, and if it makes them happy, who are we to pooh-pooh the details of it?

Still... a guy with lots of girl friends that he stays in active contact with? And it didn't bug you? We are very different people, you and I. :wink:

foursquare

[Jmatthew]

I think, and do forgive me if I'm being presumptious Foursquare, but I think the difference for Foursquare and the rest of us is that Foursquare thinks of the dancing as a "package deal."

Let me see if I can explain what I mean by that.

I don't take dates to dances. If my current GF is a dancer, then we can go dancing, or I'll drag a girl I'm interested along if a group of us are going dancing, but I NEVER have a "date" that involves going dancing.

Dancing is pretty much my favorite thing in the world, why wouldn't I have dates that involve dancing?

For me, when I dance, I'm DANCING. It's me and my follow and the music alone in the universe for 4 minutes, and then it's over, and gone and there's no looking back, and all that matters is how fun the dance was.

If I take a date to that, I'm ditching her over and over again. That's not what I want a date to be like. GFs, if they're dancers, understand and are doing the same thing. If I take a GF to a dance they know what to expect. We're both at a dance, we're not so much at a dance together.

For Foursquare dancing is part of his dates with his GF, so it would be horribly rude to bail on her for four minutes to dance with someone else. That seems logical to me. And for the two of you, the dance is part of your relationship, instead of something outside of it, which is cool too.

For me, I could no more get upset with my GF for dancing with a guy than I could get upset with her for chatting with a guy for four minutes while she waited for the bus. Neither one has anything to do with "us." If we were on a "date" and waiting for our table and she started to chat with the guy beside us and ignore me... I think there's a difference there.

Does that make sense?

[foursquare]

Does that make sense?

Perfect. And I think you really hit the nail on the head concerning our different views concerning dancing. You put it far more eloquently than I could muster as well. :wink:

Our views are not a zero-sum game. If one is right, the other does not have to be wrong. They're just different.

But Pyg putting up with Girl Friend Guy? That's just nuts. :wink:

foursquare

[pygmalion]

My former SO LOVES women.

Former? :wink: This kind of made me chuckle in the context of the remainder of your post. :)

I personally would have found the extent to which your previous SO kept up with those chicks a bit crazy-making. Dinner? Lunches? Email? Phone calls? Yikes. But that's just me.

I agree with you though, Pyg (I use the abbrevation because I keep forgetting how to spell "Pygmalion,") a relationship is whatever the pair of people involved make of it, and if it makes them happy, who are we to pooh-pooh the details of it?

Still... a guy with lots of girl friends that he stays in active contact with? And it didn't bug you? We are very different people, you and I. :wink:

foursquare

Actually, the fact that he's former came from a totally different place that probably belongs in a different conversation, but since you ask, it was about power and control, cultural differences, gender roles and division of labor, i.e. I had to do all the labor. Nothing to do with his girlfriends or my guy friends. (And incidentally, there were two times when I drew the line, because I perceived a threat. And he was smart enough to back off. I can be evil! :twisted: :lol: )

And yes, our relationships are up to us to define. For me, being in a romantic relationship where I never danced with anyone but my life partner would feel very restrictive. But for you and your girlfriend, it works. To each his own. :D

[tsb]

I think, and do forgive me if I'm being presumptious Foursquare, but I think the difference for Foursquare and the rest of us is that Foursquare thinks of the dancing as a "package deal."

Let me see if I can explain what I mean by that.

I don't take dates to dances. If my current GF is a dancer, then we can go dancing, or I'll drag a girl I'm interested along if a group of us are going dancing, but I NEVER have a "date" that involves going dancing.

Dancing is pretty much my favorite thing in the world, why wouldn't I have dates that involve dancing?

For me, when I dance, I'm DANCING. It's me and my follow and the music alone in the universe for 4 minutes, and then it's over, and gone and there's no looking back, and all that matters is how fun the dance was.

If I take a date to that, I'm ditching her over and over again. That's not what I want a date to be like. GFs, if they're dancers, understand and are doing the same thing. If I take a GF to a dance they know what to expect. We're both at a dance, we're not so much at a dance together.

For Foursquare dancing is part of his dates with his GF, so it would be horribly rude to bail on her for four minutes to dance with someone else. That seems logical to me. And for the two of you, the dance is part of your relationship, instead of something outside of it, which is cool too.

For me, I could no more get upset with my GF for dancing with a guy than I could get upset with her for chatting with a guy for four minutes while she waited for the bus. Neither one has anything to do with "us." If we were on a "date" and waiting for our table and she started to chat with the guy beside us and ignore me... I think there's a difference there.

Does that make sense?

it's now dawned on me that i probably confused a lot of women i was interested in when i invited them to go dancing because i would still adhere to dance etiquette standards and while we'd spend time chatting during songs invariably one of us would get asked to dance. <sigh>

[salsachinita]

If I take a date to that, I'm ditching her over and over again. That's not what I want a date to be like. GFs, if they're dancers, understand and are doing the same thing.

:!: That's kinda why I havn't really been able to date non-dancers :!:

If I take a GF to a dance they know what to expect. We're both at a dance, we're not so much at a dance together.

8) Well said, JM! Apart from saving the "important" songs for each other :wink: !

[Jana]

It can be tricky and disappointing. The crowd in my area that comes for social dancing is either very young (under 25) or much older (50+). It's hard to find people in their mid-thirties to mid-forties who dance. Also, the group tends to be nerdy, computer programmers, engineers, etc. The product of living in Silicon Valley. Plus, I tend to be fussy about people I want to get romantically involved with. I'm not one to go out on a date, just to get out of the house. The man has to have something special to offer. So, for me, social dancing is pretty much out. I simply take private lessons with my teacher and do the comps. But no social interaction with anyone at the studio. In fact, outside of taking lessons, I don't interact with anyone at all. It's simply work, dancing lessons and practicing at the studio, and that's it. I'm pretty much a loner and am comfortable with that. Don't feel that the dancing world is going to produce any men that I haven't come in contact with in other situations. People are pretty much the same no matter what social activity one engages in.

[dancing_moogle]

It can be tricky and disappointing. The crowd in my area that comes for social dancing is either very young (under 25) or much older (50+).

Also, the group tends to be nerdy, computer programmers, engineers, etc.

Plus, I tend to be fussy about people I want to get romantically involved with.

It's simply work, dancing lessons and practicing at the studio, and that's it. I'm pretty much a loner and am comfortable with that.

YES!! Thank you, Jana! That's exactly my observation and my feeling about the ballroom community. In any studio I go to, there's either lots of good-looking guys who are already coupled OR guys who are just too old. Makes me feel out of place. And I, too, am quite selective on who to be romantically involved with.

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking it. You're my hero! :D :wink:

[bordertangoman]

Emotional jolt. . :?

Yep a statutory requirement to dance AT. If you ain't suuffered .......
you can't dance AT.

I think I've felt it all:
the unrequited advances..... :(
the requited and a few months later dumped.... :( :(
the misery of seeing the femme in question going off with someone else.. :( :( :( :(
the thrill of possibility with someone who makes your heart do somersaults :D
the schizo woman who is nice to you when you're alone together but ignores you completly at the milonga.

just keep dancing

I've danced through it all.

[TemptressToo]

Myself...I can't help it. I love the attention and am quite a flirt. I enjoy dancing with lots of people and being "in demand" as a dance partner. There are men I admire for their skill, intellect, and looks...but it goes no further than some innocent flirting. I'm totally committed and hopelessly in love with my non-dancing boyfriend. A boyfriend I'm been with for over 6 years now... :kissme:

[Jana]

But, isn't it sad when it should be the most ideal place to meet someone? Bottom line: if you have high morals and values, no matter where you socialize, its really tough to meet the right kind of people.

[pygmalion]

Yep a statutory requirement to dance AT. If you ain't suuffered .......
you can't dance AT.


Then sign me up. How about the guy/gal who loves you but holds you at an arm's length, so everybody gets to be miserable? Or how about the cute cute guy/girl who's just too young or too old (or thinks he/she is)? Or the hunk who freely admits he "has issues" and won't even try? And so on...

Sign me up.

[danceguy]

Hmm, maybe I should learn AT...I think I'd be quite good at it. :?

I get kind of riled when women flirt excessively and they aren't available...I just don't see the point of it. I danced with a woman a while ago and she was quite a dancer and a bit of a flirt...and I then I found out she's married. Hmm, I understand the sensuality thing...but I don't go for the 'tease an go'...or the "I've still got it" thing that people like to do. Being led on is certainly something that earns little respect from me.

I enjoying dancing with just about anyone...but I've already "gray listed" several women who flirt too much for my tastes. It can be special if you're only one receiving the attention, if they do it to everyone then it becomes something else...

SG

[etchuck]

[quote=Jana]It can be tricky and disappointing. The crowd in my area that comes for social dancing is either very young (under 25) or much older (50+). blah blah blah]/quote]

YES!! Thank you, Jana! That's exactly my observation and my feeling about the ballroom community. In any studio I go to, there's either lots of good-looking guys who are already coupled OR guys who are just too old. Makes me feel out of place. And I, too, am quite selective on who to be romantically involved with.

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking it. You're my hero! :D :wink:

Over here, I think many of the women with whom I dance are already coupled or have issues. Or at least it seems that way. Of course, maybe more of them are single than I perceive, but none of them are asking ME out. What's up with that?

My two cents because I've been in discussion with the other single men who are part of our club. Okay, the one other good friend who is also single. He's of the opinion that he wants a dancing romantic partner (he currently has neither), while I'm of the opinion that you have to separate the romance from dancing. I've been with too many situations in college dance clubs (or clubs in general) where that age demographic doesn't or cannot separate them, causing real problems with team chemistry. (And as a club advisor, I watch out for things like that.)

I suppose for me, I would not mind having a romantic partner who dances. The one condition is unless we have a competition or a routine we must practice, whenever we're on the social floor, we dance with anyone we want (except for the last dance, which I would prefer is a waltz). Especially having gone to dance classes before where everyone else is coupled up (believe it or not, there were extra men), it feels really awful to feel left out. And it's not like any "good" women are going to ask me if they don't know me. That's at least one factor I have in judging a dance... I know how good I am (I've been dancing about 10 years, though have been taking classes again after years of neglect). I observe how cliquish people are, and couples who insist on just focusing on dancing with themselves or their friends rather than dancing with everyone really impresses me in a very negative way. At least that's one reason why I hesitate to continue learning lindy (just using it as an example); I like dancing the steps, but I don't like the people here who dance it because they seem to be so snobbish.

I have walked out of a salsa dance which had a "mixer". Basically there were 3x as many women as there were men. All the men were on the floor, and all the women could choose a partner to dance with (preferably someone they didn't know). Now, I knew the group I was with, and I insisted on not dancing with my friends in socials. But after having had NO PARTNER AFTER THREE SOCIALS, I left and I'm very hesitant to ever go back to that dance venue again. (P.S. I'm not THAT good, but I can do intermediate steps albeit ballroom-style I think.)

Back to romance: I do ballroom, swing, salsa, and contra dancing. I am not sure what sort of romantic partner I'd get in the dancing community because each of these groups is different and don't mix that well. I'm afraid I'll wind up with someone who likes hip-hop and then I'm hosed :).

--
NB: SM, early-30's, and with a dance partner in international Latin (for 3 weeks now). Still looking for swing (EC, WC, L), American smooth and rhythm. Holding out hope for this one L dancer... :wink:

Edited:
Oh, I forgot to mention, the aforementioned salsa dance is featured in today's local newspaper. Read about it here: http://newsobserver.com/features/story/3348355p-2982006c.html .

[etchuck]

But, isn't it sad when it should be the most ideal place to meet someone? Bottom line: if you have high morals and values, no matter where you socialize, its really tough to meet the right kind of people.

From one of my professors (who actually told this to two girls I knew as I was walking into the classroom):
You can date anyone you want if you set your standards low enough.

[Sagitta]

You can find love and romance on the dancefloor!!

I actually found my current gf that way. But to me what was important was the way we clicked off the dance floor and the bond we felt.

It can be complicated, but all relationships are. I'm not sure if my current gf completely understands my passion for dancing and how I'm of the "dancing is liking making love" group. But we are at the start of something good and I'm willing to take the risk of suffering the consequences of a relationship torn assunder rather then a life not lived at all!! :)

[Jana]

Though we are referring to dancing and romancing, this same scenario could apply to any social organization (sports, religious affiliation, political, etc.) One is always going to have cliques no matter where one socializes. I feel sorry for those people because they cut themselves off from meeting new people and learning new things. But, I've come to accept it and figure its their loss. If a person is in a particular organization where its not just a matter of socializing but competing and/or a business-type venture (as say taking dance lessons is), then there will always be some sort of "conflict of interest". That's not the best situation to meet people for friendship or possible romance. But going to regular dance clubs is not attractive to me as there's always alcohol and drugs to contend with, along with men who feel you are there to find a sleeping partner.

[Sagitta]

I'm not there to find a sleeping partner, though perhaps I'm not representative as my gf says that I am the first asian guy who she has met who is not that sort of person!! And the places I frequent are not into alcohol and drugs. So, I'm lucky?! :)

[tsb]

Hmm, maybe I should learn AT...I think I'd be quite good at it. :?

I get kind of riled when women flirt excessively and they aren't available...I just don't see the point of it. I danced with a woman a while ago and she was quite a dancer and a bit of a flirt...and I then I found out she's married. Hmm, I understand the sensuality thing...but I don't go for the 'tease an go'...or the "I've still got it" thing that people like to do. Being led on is certainly something that earns little respect from me.

I enjoying dancing with just about anyone...but I've already "gray listed" several women who flirt too much for my tastes. It can be special if you're only one receiving the attention, if they do it to everyone then it becomes something else...

SG

i would file that under the category of emotional integrity. while everyone has their own standard or limits, i can think of at least one example of someone who flirts not from personal choice but because she was conditioned to it - she used to be married to a macho rich guy and she had to play the part of charming hostess for almost 20 years. now that she's divorced, when she still flirts people get confused. she knows this and wants to stop, though.

[tsb]

[quote=Jana]It can be tricky and disappointing. The crowd in my area that comes for social dancing is either very young (under 25) or much older (50+). blah blah blah]/quote]

YES!! Thank you, Jana! That's exactly my observation and my feeling about the ballroom community. In any studio I go to, there's either lots of good-looking guys who are already coupled OR guys who are just too old. Makes me feel out of place. And I, too, am quite selective on who to be romantically involved with.

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking it. You're my hero! :D :wink:

Over here, I think many of the women with whom I dance are already coupled or have issues. Or at least it seems that way. Of course, maybe more of them are single than I perceive, but none of them are asking ME out. What's up with that?

1) having baggage is average. just not normal.
2) LOL


My two cents because I've been in discussion with the other single men who are part of our club. Okay, the one other good friend who is also single. He's of the opinion that he wants a dancing romantic partner (he currently has neither), while I'm of the opinion that you have to separate the romance from dancing. I've been with too many situations in college dance clubs (or clubs in general) where that age demographic doesn't or cannot separate them, causing real problems with team chemistry. (And as a club advisor, I watch out for things like that.)

it's different if your primary reason for dancing is competition/show, then if you are dancing socially.


I suppose for me, I would not mind having a romantic partner who dances. The one condition is unless we have a competition or a routine we must practice, whenever we're on the social floor, we dance with anyone we want (except for the last dance, which I would prefer is a waltz).

this is pretty much how i feel about it, except that i want a romantic partner who dances. my problem is that i also seek someone who shares the same spiritual convictions. recently, a close friend who is one of the best follows (and leads) i know suggested that it should be easier for a guy who dances as women are more inclined to want to learn how to dance if they don't. she even accompanied me to a church dance and pointed out a few women who she thought would make good dancers & told me why. (i now use these tips when i'm at some outdoor event where a band is playing. even if they don't dance the people i select still end up being fun and some has been very intuitive followers). as i think more about it there's a certain amount of appeal in the idea of using dance as a means having a partner become more in tune to my personal nuances of movement and communication as she develops her technique.



Back to romance: I do ballroom, swing, salsa, and contra dancing. I am not sure what sort of romantic partner I'd get in the dancing community because each of these groups is different and don't mix that well. I'm afraid I'll wind up with someone who likes hip-hop and then I'm hosed :).


another advantage (as a guy) of starting with someone who doesn't dance: as a general rule (so i don't get all you exceptions chiming in) women are more into being with the people they care about over the activity, as evidenced by how women can spend a whole day shopping with someone, not buy anything and still consider it a good time) the fact that it's dancing with the guy she wants to be with would just be an added bonus IMHO.[/u][/i]

[tsb]

my gf says that I am the first asian guy who she has met who is not that sort of person!!

she could meet me and know two then!

[etchuck]

it's different if your primary reason for dancing is competition/show, then if you are dancing socially.

I agree with that. But some people who I know do compete together cannot seem to separate the two. Believe me... if you want to practice your routine, find some floor space. (Heck, I can even help with that. :) ) But there is one couple who has placed very high in the amateur USABDA ranks, and when it comes to social dances, they ask other dancers routinely.


this is pretty much how i feel about it, except that i want a romantic partner who dances. my problem is that i also seek someone who shares the same spiritual convictions.

Yeah... that's why I've been holding out for this one L dancer. :) I won't go into details about my friend who also dances, but let's just say his particular convictions are... well... different than mine. At any rate, he has gone out with two dancers over the past year with both relationships not working out.

[volleybgrl]

This is such a double edged sword! On one hand I actively try to avoid falling for any woman in my dance scene. When I go out to dance that's all I want it to be about. On the other hand I REALLY want my next relationship to be with a dancer. I just think that would be amazing (and it doesn't hurt to have a practice partner for when those flashes of dance genius occur!)

I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

Ditto!!!! (Except it's a guy in my case)

[Sagitta]

This is such a double edged sword! On one hand I actively try to avoid falling for any woman in my dance scene. When I go out to dance that's all I want it to be about. On the other hand I REALLY want my next relationship to be with a dancer. I just think that would be amazing (and it doesn't hurt to have a practice partner for when those flashes of dance genius occur!)

I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

Ditto!!!!

Why? I don't see why you can't have it all... :wink: :)

[tsb]

this is pretty much how i feel about it, except that i want a romantic partner who dances. my problem is that i also seek someone who shares the same spiritual convictions.

Yeah... that's why I've been holding out for this one L dancer. :) I won't go into details about my friend who also dances, but let's just say his particular convictions are... well... different than mine. At any rate, he has gone out with two dancers over the past year with both relationships not working out.

i have a friend who probably has a lot in common with your friend. the worst part is that the people he's been with are now probably less likely to be of like mind... <sigh>

[bordertangoman]

Chinese proverb: be careful what you wish for ; you might get it :twisted:

Beware of laughing women
(this isn't a proverb especially, just my own experience that they spell trouble if you date them but fine as friends)

Dogs and walnut trees.......

[pygmalion]

Uh oh! I am a laughing woman. :shock: :lol:

[Vita Rara]

I'm new here, so I'm catching up. This has been a very interesting read. Hopefully I'll have time to reply to some of the very thoughtful comments here.

Mark

[peachexploration]

Hi Vita Rara. Welcome to DF! :D

[youngsta]

Why? I don't see why you can't have it all... :wink: :)
I wish it were that easy Sagitta, but for some reason it makes me hesitant. It's like I don't want to spoil my one haven. I don't know...still soooooo confused! :lol:

[Swing Kitten]

Beware of laughing women
(this isn't a proverb especially, just my own experience that they spell trouble if you date them but fine as friends)

:shock:

care to explain this a little further?

why would anyone want to be in a relationship with someone who doesn't laugh!?

[Neil]

my gf says that I am the first asian guy who she has met who is not that sort of person!!

she could meet me and know two then!

Then, we might as well make it three!

[Sagitta]

Well I would like to think that the people at df are a unique bunch!! :)

[pygmalion]

Hi Neil! Welcome. :D

[Neil]

This is such a double edged sword! On one hand I actively try to avoid falling for any woman in my dance scene. When I go out to dance that's all I want it to be about. On the other hand I REALLY want my next relationship to be with a dancer. I just think that would be amazing (and it doesn't hurt to have a practice partner for when those flashes of dance genius occur!)

I'm soooo confused!! :lol:

Ditto!!!!

Why? I don't see why you can't have it all... :wink: :)

I see the wink, so you were just kidding, right? I've been married over twenty years to a great dancer who would like to partner with me for more serious training, but I've found that I much better tolerate a girl being frustrated and irritable when I know that it's going to be over soon and I wont see her again until the next day. By then, I'm happy to see her.

Don't you find that people are more polite to complete strangers than they are to the people they care about most in the world? Once you know somebody well enough, you feel like you can dispense with the pleasantries and formalities, and just be yourself.

Thanks for the welcome guys. I agree that the people here seem to be unique.

[pygmalion]

Hmm. There are a couple older threads on that -- dance partners to whom you're married. I'll see if I can find one. There were different views -- some people who are both dance and life partners, and some who prefer to keep the two separate. It was interesting to see both views. To each his own.

[Neil]

Do you guys feel that this thread doesn't apply to married couples? I think that married couples need to find love and romance on the dance floor too. I can only speak for my wife since I don't know other women that well, but she needs to be seduced to get in the mood for the kind of love that I want. That means, I need to take her out dancing, talk to her, flirt with her, pay lots of attention to her, and then gradually work things toward the bedroom where the intensity can build. It's kind of like the movie Fifty First Dates.

As far as jealousy goes, I would be very happy if another guy is willing and able to do some of my work for me and get her warmed up for my benefit. :) I'm even willing to return the favor if he has a wife who would like some attention on the dance floor too. I don't think it takes anything away from our relationship, to the contrary, I think it enhances it. A lot of men who find this inappropriate for married couples don't see anything wrong with having strippers at his bachelor party or looking at porn. Dancing is like porn for women, and if I give the girl the right lead and attitude, I'm her porn star. ;)

[Neil]

If I take a date to that, I'm ditching her over and over again. That's not what I want a date to be like. GFs, if they're dancers, understand and are doing the same thing.

:!: That's kinda why I havn't really been able to date non-dancers :!:

It might not help if he dances too. My wife is a dancer, but that doesn't mean that I can ditch her to dance with other women. That used to be a problem because, at dance venues other than Salsa clubs, there are a lot more women who dance than men, and the women are very aggressive about asking men to dance. I don't want to be rude, so I say yes, but my wife doesn't ask men to dance, so she ends up just sitting all night. So, now when women ask me to dance, I ask them if they have somebody to dance with my wife, or at least entertain her with good conversation.

[Sagitta]

I know quite a few married couples where the guy does not dance and the wife does and there is no problem with that. The husbands even sometimes come to the dances and just sit most of the time. I'm not too sure why I haven't seen the opposite situation. I can see how it can get frustrating for the wife is she loves dancing and does not get asked and her husband is out dancing with others a lot.

[Neil]

...those of you who do have a partner that dances as well, how do you set your boundaries with the other people you dance with? For instance, where is the line drawn for how sensually you dance with others?...

We started off dancing Lambada and then ballroom where the dance position consists of the women's crotch riding the man's right thigh the entire dance, so I can't think of anything I've ever seen on the dance floor that would be off-limits.

On the other hand, there are girls who are off-limits. It's the girls who flirt with guys a lot to get dances, but then ignore the guys' wives. The married women in our group hate that. If the girl has a husband who is a great dancer and dances with all the wives, then the girl is forgiven, but, if she shows up empty handed, then the wives forbid their husbands to dance with her.

I do enjoy that dancing allows you to get a feel for someone's personality...I've been amazed at how many women I've met and felt an attraction, only to dance with them and find that the attraction faded quickly once I got to know them a bit.

Amen, brother.

[Estella]

I think that love and romances are ALWAYS ok... if you really fall in love with someone.
In this case it doesn´t matter who is this person... a teacher, a performers or anybody else...
If two people feel the same, who cares about who they are? :roll:
Sorry I haven´t read all the previous pages...

[danceguy]

I agree with you Estella...if both people are feeling it strongly, then go for it I say. That's what life is all about! :D

[pygmalion]

I have an admission, Estella. I don't always go back and read the whole thread, either. And I'm a moderator, so I should be ashamed. :oops: :lol:

I agree. If both people feel it, they should handle the potential problems, then go for it.

[Swing Kitten]

I agree with you Estella...if both people are feeling it strongly, then go for it I say. That's what life is all about! :D

I would like to add: as long as you're not hurting others in the process

[pygmalion]

True. I should have said that, SK. I guess I just don't think like that. Breaking up marriages or families is never okay in my book, so it never crossed my mind that my words might be interpreted that way.

So, if both people are free to pursue a relationship and both want to, go for it. :wink: :D

[Swing Kitten]

the play I'm working on deals with the issue so I suppose I have a heightened awarness of it.

... it's funny how the movie, "Shakespeare In Love" doesn't really touch on the fact that he abandoned his wife and three children!

-- the play I'm working on is fiction... yet that fact remains

[Sagitta]

Thanks for the permission!! :)

[Swing Kitten]

it's all opinion Sagitta :P

people are going to do what they will

[Sagitta]

Oh!! :( :) :wink:

[Sarah]

... it's funny how the movie, "Shakespeare In Love" doesn't really touch on the fact that he abandoned his wife and three children!


The writer of `Shakespear in Love' has stated in at least one interview that I have seen that he really didn't know anything about, nor did he do much research into, the life and times of Shakespear, so this inaccuracy is, shall we say, hardly surprising.

Cheers
Sarah

[Swing Kitten]

... it's funny how the movie, "Shakespeare In Love" doesn't really touch on the fact that he abandoned his wife and three children!


The writer of `Shakespear in Love' has stated in at least one interview that I have seen that he really didn't know anything about, nor did he do much research into, the life and times of Shakespear, so this inaccuracy is, shall we say, hardly surprising.

Cheers
Sarah

I suppose so... but they included a small role of a somewhat obscure future playwright ... his name escapes me at the momonet.... in the movie his the kid that lets the cat out of the bag-- he mentions his name and that he really like Titus Andronicus-- the exact type of play that he would nearly exlcusively write. ... there's some dramturgy there!

[danceguy]

I would like to add: as long as you're not hurting others in the process

Yes, you are right SK. As long as both people are free to pursue the relationship without any strings attached...hurting others or being involved with others is not a relationship in my book...rather, a convenience. :?

It amazes me just how people think of themselves as "single"...yet they have no true concept of the word. To me, its being both physically and emotionally unattached to anyone in particular, and free to allow someone new to get to know you and perhaps develop into more.

I'm pretty strict when it comes to dating...if someone shows an interest to become romantically involved with me...there better be no strings attached. If not, then they get the boot and that's it, I have no time to get caught up in "emotional spaghetti"...been there, done that, not for me! :shock:

Of course, there are exceptions to everything...

Ok, off the soapbox. :D

SG

[tsb]

I agree with you Estella...if both people are feeling it strongly, then go for it I say. That's what life is all about! :D

I would like to add: as long as you're not hurting others in the process

and if they're brother and sister - or one of them is michael jackson? ugh.

[pygmalion]

:lol: :lol: Both of those scenarios seem mighty hurtful to me. LOL.

[tsb]

:lol: :lol: Both of those scenarios seem mighty hurtful to me. LOL.

i bet that in either scernario both people say "but we're not hurting anyone!". using just feelings is generally not a good barometer because feelings are transitory and completely subjective to boot. who's to say that both people feeling good isn't due entirely to the dessert they both just had? :lol:

[Christina75]

I'm afraid I might be deviating from the direction the thread has taken or maybe just putting a new spin on the topic...but I can't help but throw my two cents in.

This topic reminds me of when I first started taking dance lessons during my junior year of college. My roommate and I would go to this local ballroom that had group lessons and open dances because we couldn't afford private lessons. Also dancing at this studio was a guy who I thought was absolutely adorable. I remember he was from eastern Europe (Russia I think) and he used to take my breath away with his dancing (the accent got me too) :wink: Best of all was that he always seemed to flirt and chat with me. I probably would have sold my textbooks if necessary just to keep going to those dances. Now here's the problem: He was 18 and a senior in high school. (I was 21) I remember everytime I would start gushing about him, my roommate would roll her eyes and say "but he's in HIGH SCHOOL!" She eventually wore me down and I let the idea drop and moved on from taking lessons and dancing at that ballroom.

So mine's not a tale of romance but rather a shoulda, woulda, coulda. He could have been prince charming, or then again he could have turned out to be a jerk...but I'll never know :?

Christina

[pygmalion]

What a pity. He sounds like a heart throb. And a three year age difference, doesn't make that much difference. Although, in all fairness, it makes much more difference at 21/18 than at 31/28. Who knows why these things happen the way they do?

[Sabor]

[quote="pygmalion"] What are the situations in which dance romances are okay, or even ideal?

for me .. romance is key.. but i view/do it different than that..

i love the dance and romance the lady ..

for the few minutes in the dance its like a love story and short weet romantic date between the couple.. that is when i'm dancing my best.. not necessarily look my best in dance terms but where i feel best... the dance is over .. the romance episode is over ..till it sarts again with another and so on.. the wheel turns.. till now it hadnt stopped for any lady in particular.. but if/when it does then..

i'll love the lady and romance the dance :wink:

[pygmalion]

Yup. Romance, or its illusion, is part of the dance itself, whether or not there's any further relationship.

[Sabor]

si.. life is about the illusion of control.. therefore life is illusion.. therefore romance is illusion.. que no?

pls. dont ask me what that means cause i have no idea! :lol:

[bordertangoman]

si.. life is about the illusion of control.. therefore life is illusion.. therefore romance is illusion.. que no?

pls. dont ask me what that means cause i have no idea! :lol:

"The course of true love never did run smooth"
W. Shakespeare.

There is enough written here for a short romantic novel..... so I'll kick it off with...

Once upona time there was a beuatiful princess who lived alone in a castle. More than anything else she longed to dance, for she had watched the Court Balls since she was a child and loved to watch the figures glide and pirhoueete in their splendid costumes.


What happens next? I'll leave that to you....

[tsb]

si.. life is about the illusion of control.. therefore life is illusion.. therefore romance is illusion.. que no?

pls. dont ask me what that means cause i have no idea! :lol:

"The course of true love never did run smooth"
W. Shakespeare.

There is enough written here for a short romantic novel..... so I'll kick it off with...

Once upona time there was a beuatiful princess who lived alone in a castle. More than anything else she longed to dance, for she had watched the Court Balls since she was a child and loved to watch the figures glide and pirhoueete in their splendid costumes.


What happens next? I'll leave that to you....

plagarizing what is probably an urban myth....

Meanwhile, hundreds of miles above the castle, a squadron of alien battle cruisers powered up their weapons and prepared to vaporize the planet below.....

[salsachinita]

:idea: you guys have just given me an idea for a new fun thread..... :idea:

[pygmalion]

It better not be in salsa! :shock: :tongue:

[danceguy]

Did someone say Salsa? Yes....:D

Boriken - we should start one there too! ;)

[Genesius Redux]

Also dancing at this studio was a guy who I thought was absolutely adorable. I remember he was from eastern Europe (Russia I think) and he used to take my breath away with his dancing (the accent got me too) :wink:

Christina

So what is it with the Slavic thing? Why is it that guys can say the most incredibly inane things, but if they do it with a Russian (or English, or Irish) accent, the girls start to swoon? Being an unregenerate New York Italian boy, I don't understand these things.

Anyway, how can you possibly fall in love on the dance floor? Especially in smooth? You're not even supposed to look at each other!

Which reminds me of another urban legend. Did you hear the one about the smooth dancers who competed for years together? Then one day they met in a coffee shop and fell in love.

Cheers,

Genesius

[Christina75]

So what is it with the Slavic thing? Why is it that guys can say the most incredibly inane things, but if they do it with a Russian (or English, or Irish) accent, the girls start to swoon? Being an unregenerate New York Italian boy, I don't understand these things.



I confess! I'm one of those girls that gets drawn in by what I percieve to be exotic. LOL :D There's not a lot of culture in my little town, (which is why I live vicariously through the dance adventures of the DF folks) so anything "different" I've always loved. Also, maybe it's because I still remember the cold war era when a Slavic accent was suspicious. Some girls just love the "bad boys" LOL!

Oh and speaking of different, if you're a New Yorker in Tennessee, I'm sure you're familiar with the phrase "you ain't from around here areya?" Remember, that's just us southerners being friendly with a little curiosity mixed in. :lol:

Christina

[Genesius Redux]

Oh and speaking of different, if you're a New Yorker in Tennessee, I'm sure you're familiar with the phrase "you ain't from around here areya?" Remember, that's just us southerners being friendly with a little curiosity mixed in. :lol:

Christina

LOL! Well, at this point I qualify as a "damn Yankee," which means one of those Yankees who comes down here and doesn't go back home! One of my friends from Chattanooga says I'm a "reformed Yankee," which means I've acquired the rudiments of civilized behavior--must be all that ballroom dancing!

Anyway, it's not terrible being a NY Italian in Tennessee. That way, when they need someone for an independent film--mobster, drug dealer, nasty lawyer, corrupt politician, greasy porn dealer, I get the call! And on some occasions, I can even play a good old boy--like Gooper in "Cat on a Hot Tin Roof"! :wink:

[SDsalsaguy]

"The course of true love never did run smooth"
W. Shakespeare.
Guess that means my love has been true... :?

[salsachinita]

"The course of true love never did run smooth"
W. Shakespeare.
Guess that means my love has been true... :?

:roll: story of my life.......... :roll:

[SDsalsaguy]

"The course of true love never did run smooth"
W. Shakespeare.
Guess that means my love has been true... :?

:roll: story of my life.......... :roll:
Makes two fo us salsachinita, makes two of us... :?

[decadec]

:!: "Dancing is the vertical expression of horizonal desire"

How true!! I'm new here and new to dancing in the ballroom and latin sense, but I have noticed a very strange thing. When I used to go out dancing in clubs or wherever I could walk onto the dancefloor and strut my stuff with not a care in the world and man, did it make me feel sexy! Then I started learning ballroom and latin and that was even sexier.

Now, however I am about to be married and when I go out dancing with my girlfriends I found didn't know what to due as I no longer have the desire to on flaunt myself. On the other hand when I dance with Simon sparks fly all over the shop and it is the most romantic, sexy wonderful thing ever!

[Sagitta]

Welcome decadec!! I'm glad that at least for some of your dancing it becomes a magical experience. :)

[SDsalsaguy]

Welcome to the Forums decadec! :D

[Phil Owl]

To be completely honest, the idea of it scares the crap out of me.

[cupojoe2]

Then I started learning ballroom and latin and that was even sexier.


Funny, for me it was exatly the opposite -- when I "didn't dance" I wouldn't let a women drag me anywhere near a dance floor unless there was a strong sexual interest...

Now, I dance with a lot of women just to dance -- it's always fun, but often not all that sexy...

In a way, it makes me a little sad -- I think holding a woman should always raise your blood pressure at least a tiny bit. :(

[Genesius Redux]

I'd been wondering about this thread lately, and thought I might resurrect it. As a performer, I'm very careful to separate professional from personal life, the intimacy of the stage from a genuine attachment betwen two people.

A few recent posts have made me wonder about all this again. It seems to me that dancing with someone can be such a physically intimate thing that one would need to take measures to keep it safe. That is, you should be safe to feel you can be physically expressive on the floor without having it taken for something else off the floor. Just as you should be able to feel safe that physical closeness doesn't have another agenda.

Certainly a shared passion for dance can be a good basis for a stronger relationship that extends beyond the floor. But it would behoove us to be careful not to interpret dancing as anything more than dancing.

Dancers and other performing artists tend to be more physical and open emotionally--and hence subject to misinterpretation. I've been in that boat myself, finding what I thought was harmless, good-natured flirting taken as a sign for something more. And having to pull back because of that, with hurt feelings and everything else.

I think before we start ascribing feelings where none may be, we should take care to examine other things--other shared interests, phone calls and emails. Always worth looking into some kind of a neutral thing like lunch or coffee, where genuine feelings can be a little more clear. Extremely helpful I think in distinguishing potential friendship from potential romance and both from strictly dance relationship.

Since my characteristic stance is detached and ironic, I'm breaking out from having put forward an actual serious post. I'm gonna go buy me a bottle of Yoo Hoo and spend the rest of the day in unstructured silliness.

[tsb]

I'd been wondering about this thread lately, and thought I might resurrect it. As a performer, I'm very careful to separate professional from personal life, the intimacy of the stage from a genuine attachment betwen two people.

A few recent posts have made me wonder about all this again. It seems to me that dancing with someone can be such a physically intimate thing that one would need to take measures to keep it safe. That is, you should be safe to feel you can be physically expressive on the floor without having it taken for something else off the floor. Just as you should be able to feel safe that physical closeness doesn't have another agenda.

Certainly a shared passion for dance can be a good basis for a stronger relationship that extends beyond the floor. But it would behoove us to be careful not to interpret dancing as anything more than dancing.

Dancers and other performing artists tend to be more physical and open emotionally--and hence subject to misinterpretation. I've been in that boat myself, finding what I thought was harmless, good-natured flirting taken as a sign for something more. And having to pull back because of that, with hurt feelings and everything else.

I think before we start ascribing feelings where none may be, we should take care to examine other things--other shared interests, phone calls and emails. Always worth looking into some kind of a neutral thing like lunch or coffee, where genuine feelings can be a little more clear. Extremely helpful I think in distinguishing potential friendship from potential romance and both from strictly dance relationship.


yeah. but i got into trouble despite my communicating up front that i would not get involved with somone who didn't share my level of spiritual commitment. in retrospect, i was pretty naive - as my teacher told me later that it was pretty clear to him that she was really into me. he actually told me by observing how she was responding to me (tango lessons) he thought we'd be having sex as soon as he left (i have a studio in my home & he taught me my private lessons there). i really was clueless about that. and i made it worse back doing a lot of stuff with her outside of dance because i really did enjoy her company and i thought i'd made it clear that our relationship was platonic. i thought it was just guys who could agree "let's just be friends" and have that hidden agenda!

everyone has different experiences and therefore different expectations. while i find it good practice to anticipate that even the most basic assumptions can get you into trouble, i have also found that i have to make certain assumptions or all my activities would come to a grinding halt! the thing is, i've been brought up to consider it dishonorable to provoke emotional feelings you can not reciprocate so i do try to be careful. as a consequence (besides coming across like spock as a first impression) i had to struggle with basic boundary issues when i started learning certain dances, which would have been a lot easier if not for an experience during one of my first salsa outings & i danced with somone who'd been sexually abused & she thought i had been inappropriate. i almost gave up salsa at that point but i decided that everyone else has a level of responsibility for their own expectations/limits and i now assume that the other person understands that an offer to dance is just that and if it's a dance that has a lot physical contact it's my partner's responsibility to set/communicate her limits or go line dancing instead.

i also understand that going dancing with someone i meet through dance may not be perceived as a date which is why nowadays i suggest a non-dance activity if i am interested in them as a means of getting to know them (good thing i've stopped going dancing every night) and after talking about this with a psychologist of mine, i set a personal limit of about once a month in terms of making plans to get together with someone outside of dance so they have any little reasons to get the wrong idea - on top of what i will tell them verbally.