The three-dance rule

[MadamSamba]

There's been plenty of discussion in other branches of DF about how many dances is the norm, but in Argentine Tango the norm is quite different. Here in Australia, it's a set of three dances with a fourth one give as a "tip", so to speak.

I was very surprised by this when I first started AT. I'm kinda used to it now, but it still gets to me sometimes when I'm dancing with someone who I find I don't wish to continue dancing with, for whatever reason.
Having said that, three dances isn't enough with someone you enjoy dancing with! :lol:

Is three dances the norm for AT everywhere else?

Also, is dancing more than three dances (in a row) with a guy or gal considered a social no-no in your neck of the woods?

[bordertangoman]

Well if you're a bloke and there's a shortage of you it seems only diplomatic to share yourself around. I do have my favourites who I would have more than three dances with but I can have three now and three later so whats the difference (Two actually if one is pedantic))

if its feeling very uncomfortable I will end after one dance. There are some dancers who you don't click with and that's just life. They can dance fine and so can you but together.......... the proverbial cow with a gun.

[MadamSamba]

LOL, indeed BorderTangoMan! :) So I'm guessing that's "yes" to the three-dance rule in the UK. Is that the case throughout the UK or just in England?

Hey, what's the AT scene like in the UK?

[bordertangoman]

I don't honestly know if it is universal in the UK or whether as a code of behaviour it is adhered to, more of a guideline I think. I know a few women-hangers who will glue themselves to a pretty partner for the evening or it may be vice versa.

[JonD]

Between 3 and 5 dances is the guide both in Totnes (the epicentre of AT in Devon!) and Bristol. Sometimes, at a practica, I'll dance most of the night with my favourite partner and just enjoy improving the way we communicate and move together. That is rare though and I do feel guilty as there are normally more followers than leaders. Mind you, some of the ladies are probably very relieved - I haven't danced Tango enough to be at all proficient.

[pygmalion]

Huh? I guess that just goes to show that different cultures are different. Coming from the American ballroom scene where one dance is the rule, dancing three seems a bit much. Five? :shock: Oh my goodness! What if you get stuck witha creep, or a sweaty person, or one with B.O.? *shudder*


That said, my question is, what is the etiquette around getting out of the three to five dance custom? Is there a polite escape? Or do you just have to grin and bear it?

[JonD]

It can be a problem! I remember the "smelly sisters" only too well!!! Short of being rude it is difficult to avoid doing less than 3 dances although the old "Sorry, but I've really got to go to the toilet - must have been the curry I had last night" technique is always there for use in extremis.

The three dance tradition has its benefits though. A couple of times I've had the first dance with a new partner and not found any connection with them at all. I've stood there thinking "Oh no" but by the third dance I'm hoping we'll stay on the floor. The connection in Tango is so intense that it can take a while to develop - you just sort of key into each other after a while and sense the connection building. That's a fantastic feeling!

[Sagitta]

The thing about having a newcomer to AT come along is that all the old threads get revived, and new ones created. :wink: :)

Anyway, it is common for people to dance more then one song with a particular follow. It depends on the dj. If the dj will play similar songs from the same orchestra for an entire tanda then leaders often choose their favorite follow to dance these songs to. Or anway, this is what I've been told. With my second milonga tonight I don't think that I really know enough to have a definitive answer. :)

[MadamSamba]

That's pretty much it, Sagitta, but it varies depending on where you go.
Here in Australia, where the dancing is primarily taught by Argentinians, that's definitely the rule, but it can be uncomfortable, particularly when you don't want to dance an entire tanda with someone.

There's one chap I can think of who I don't like dancing with. It has nothing to do with his skill level, but he is very rude (without realising it, I suspect) and spends the dance re-assuring you that you're doing well "for a beginner". I've been dancing longer than him and don't feel that I'm giving off "sorry, I'm terrible" vibes. With him, I always say yes, but I generally only do one dance with him, two max. At the end of the final one, I'll simply stop, smile and say "thank you". That ends it there and then without being too rude. It feels odd, but not as bad as continuing... argh

[Cortado]

How do leaders generally start a dance with an unknown follower or even a known follower? Do you keep it very simple for most of the first dance or do you go into "normal" mode as soon as you feel there is a connection?

In other words, do you aim to you keep the best till last or do you try to get to the best level fairly quickly and try and stay there for the remainder of the tanda?

What are the followers opinions on what work best for them?

[Chris Stratton]

Huh? I guess that just goes to show that different cultures are different. Coming from the American ballroom scene where one dance is the rule, dancing three seems a bit much.

AT and ballroom are both social partner dances, but by no means the same - in traditions as well as dance details.

[Peaches]

How do leaders generally start a dance with an unknown follower or even a known follower? Do you keep it very simple for most of the first dance or do you go into "normal" mode as soon as you feel there is a connection?

In other words, do you aim to you keep the best till last or do you try to get to the best level fairly quickly and try and stay there for the remainder of the tanda?

What are the followers opinions on what work best for them?As a follower...

With an unknown leader, I much prefer things if they keep it very simple at first. Walk, change weight, an ocho or two, a couple of crosses. Let me feel how you ask for these things, because every man feels different. Done well, those things can be wonderfully expressive of the music.

You have a whole tanda...let things build.

[Cortado]

You have a whole tanda...let things build.

Thank you. I always appreciate your comments Peaches.
You are saying, build your house on good foundations and gain trust. If the music gets difficult later or something goes wrong in the dance connection later, you can revert to first dance mode and regain it again.

[Peaches]

Thank you. I always appreciate your comments Peaches.
You are saying, build your house on good foundations and gain trust. If the music gets difficult later or something goes wrong in the dance connection later, you can revert to first dance mode and regain it again.That, and don't overlook how wonderful simple moves can be.

I'm still a beginner of sorts. It takes me a while to get to know and understand a new guy's lead. If he starts off with complex stuff, I mess up, and get flustered, and get nervous, and it just starts a downhill spiral. I feel horrible, and apologetic, and insecure...all of which makes my following worse. It's just a bad scene all around.

But if a guy starts off with simple things, and lets me get used to it, and learn how he feels...then I can relax to him, and be more receptive to the lead...and then things can become wonderful. And, there's nothing wrong with simple steps. I recently danced a tanda with a guy who did little other than simple walking steps, changes of weight, pauses, and maybe an ocho cortado or two...and it was...amazing? sublime? I can't even begin to describe it. It was heaven.

Maybe it's just me, but it makes me feel like the guy is willing to take the time to make sure that I, as his partner at the moment, am comfortable. And that is just such a special feeling. It makes me feel...taken care of, almost. Like he's content/happy to be doing basic things, like I don't have to feel bad because I'm a beginner and am restricting him. Removes the guilt.

[Ampster]

How do leaders generally start a dance with an unknown follower or even a known follower? Do you keep it very simple for most of the first dance or do you go into "normal" mode as soon as you feel there is a connection?

In other words, do you aim to you keep the best till last or do you try to get to the best level fairly quickly and try and stay there for the remainder of the tanda?

What are the followers opinions on what work best for them?

If you're dancing with a total stranger, keep it very simple for the first song. This is the "feeling out" part. The first song is also when you earn your partner's trust and respect. In the second song, start introducing some more stuff gently, but only to the extent that both of you are comfortable. You can guage this by the number of "flubs" that start happening. When that occurs, stay at that limit, and have fun for the rest of the tanda.

Besides, simple is beautiful, so don't worry. Master the musicality, the passion, and the connection, and you'll be fine.

[Ampster]

Huh? I guess that just goes to show that different cultures are different. Coming from the American ballroom scene where one dance is the rule, dancing three seems a bit much. Five? Oh my goodness! What if you get stuck witha creep, or a sweaty person, or one with B.O.? *shudder*


That said, my question is, what is the etiquette around getting out of the three to five dance custom? Is there a polite escape? Or do you just have to grin and bear it?

There's been plenty of discussion in other branches of DF about how many dances is the norm, but in Argentine Tango the norm is quite different. Here in Australia, it's a set of three dances with a fourth one give as a "tip", so to speak.

I was very surprised by this when I first started AT. I'm kinda used to it now, but it still gets to me sometimes when I'm dancing with someone who I find I don't wish to continue dancing with, for whatever reason.
Having said that, three dances isn't enough with someone you enjoy dancing with! :lol:

Is three dances the norm for AT everywhere else?

Also, is dancing more than three dances (in a row) with a guy or gal considered a social no-no in your neck of the woods?

Re: Number of dances:
The norm here in the US (at least in all of the milongas in the US I've been to) is to dance one tanda of four songs (sometimes five, depending on the DJ). It gives you the opportunity to enjoy dancing with someone for the whole tanda (set). That's normal in AT.

Re: Sweaty people:
In a milonga, you will be sweating all over each other. It's what happens when you dance for 10-15 minutes continuosly (one tanda) in close embrace. AT people pay VERY particular attention to their hygiene because of this. Again, that's normal in AT.

Re: Cutting the tanda short:
If you must cut the tanda short, it is for a very, very good reason (eg. bad partner, bad breath, bad dancing, bad vibes, need to go to the bathroom, etc, etc.) give the signal to cut. Its a bit rude, but if you must...

Re: How to Cut a tanda short:
The polite signal to cut a tanda short is to say "THANK YOU" after the song when you want to quit tis partner. Then you take your leave.

Normally, the "Thank you" is reserved ONLY for the end of the tanda. Not anywhere in the middle. If you do say "Thank you" anywhere in the middle of the tanda, then you just told your partner that your done. In AT, this is the social no-no. But, if you have to...

[Angel HI]

In AT, this is the social no-no.

Re the 3 dance rule;

My post from another thread is..."This has nothing to do with AT. It is cultural to BsAs, or Argentina. Many Americans speak to this, but, we, in the U.S., do not have to do it. It is not cultural to us. I do not mind it, yet, I believe copying it because it is "...what they do in BsAs..." but has nothing to do with the dance, is ridiculous." I have frequented many milongas where there was a severe shortage of males. Everyone was okay with an unspoken 2 dance norm (rather than "rule"), enabling us to partner more persons.

Re beginning a dance;

It is just courteous to not take one out for the first dance, and unload your entire last year of lessons on her. Men like to believe so, but she is not impressed. Begin slowly, meaning simply, and progress...add complexities accordingly.

[tangotime]

Simple answer--- no matter the dance genre--- Comfort zone

[Heather2007]

There's been plenty of discussion in other branches of DF about how many dances is the norm, but in Argentine Tango the norm is quite different. Here in Australia, it's a set of three dances with a fourth one give as a "tip", so to speak.

I was very surprised by this when I first started AT. I'm kinda used to it now, but it still gets to me sometimes when I'm dancing with someone who I find I don't wish to continue dancing with, for whatever reason.
Having said that, three dances isn't enough with someone you enjoy dancing with! :lol:

Is three dances the norm for AT everywhere else?

Also, is dancing more than three dances (in a row) with a guy or gal considered a social no-no in your neck of the woods?

On Saturday, I did the usual "thank you" and made to walk away and the guy pulled me back and said, "you're not going to escape that quickly". In total, we danced 3 x 3. He was a brilliant lead so I was flattered. I guess the only "no-no" as it were, were echos emanating from the ladies queuing to dance with him. When I lead a woman in a dance, I'll limit it to 2 dances maximum as I am aware that they maybe wanting now to dance with a man. If I don't want to continuing following (usually due to bad personal hygience) after one track, then I'll politely do a second and then say my "thankyous". But yes, 3-dance rule tends to be the norm here too.

[Ampster]

To be clear, when I talk of dancing several songs with a single partner, I am talking about the norm in AT that you dance ONE WHOLE TANDA with your partner. You break away at the Cortina.

A tanda can be anywhere from 3-5 songs of the like tango types (Tango, Vals, Milonga), separated by a Cortina (something non-tango danceable for about ~1 minute), so you can find a new partner to dance the next tanda with.

In some places they don't organize it into tandas and cortinas. In this case, then you dance a set mutually agreed upon by you and your partner (three songs?), or do whatever (one song?). This is not as much fun IMO. It doesn't have a feel of a milonga, but that depends on the ideosyncharsies of a particular demographic.

[Angel HI]

Was rereading the thread, for some reason, and absolutely loved this...

You have a whole tanda...let things build.

And, this priceless, and FAR to overlooked gem can never be discussed enough.....

...and don't overlook how wonderful simple moves can be.