Structure of a good private lesson

[pygmalion]

How do you know when you've had a good private lesson -- really your money's worth? Is it drills? Homework? New patterns? New technique? Does it differ by student, or by goals? What do you like to see in your private lessons? Anyone?

[tsb]

How do you know when you've had a good private lesson -- really your money's worth? Is it drills? Homework? New patterns? New technique? Does it differ by student, or by goals? What do you like to see in your private lessons? Anyone?

to me, any private is good when you learn something you wouldn't likely learn in any other setting, which may be a consequence of getting individualized attention or just getting something from an instructor that they would not be likely to discuss in a group class. i also videotape my private lessons, so i get value in that i can go back and review a visual record in terms of a particular move. but every once in a while i also like to schedule a private just to have someone advise me on where i might be getting sloppy.

[ShyDancer]

Good question pygmalion!

For me a worthwhile private lesson is one that I come away from feeling like Ive acheived something.
Whether it be a new move, Finding a beat I could never find (espescailly in salsa!) making any sort of improvement on something I was finding tricky, putting my routine together a bit better.......even getting thru a routine without missing a step.

It doesnt matter how small my acheivement is , its one more step(even if its tiny) to becoming a better dancer........what more could I ask?

[bordertangoman]

I've never had a private lesson. The thought fills me with dread. Getting all that attention, being assessed. i find it terrifying

[ShyDancer]

I forgot this one......

I feel good whn I come home and my feet are literally burning!
I feel like I have worked really hard and Im proud of myself :D

[pygmalion]

I've never had a private lesson. The thought fills me with dread. Getting all that attention, being assessed. i find it terrifying

You get over the terror. The first few lessons are generally tough for me, too. But after a while, it gets better. Then you can benefit from the personalized attention.

[dancin_feet]

I would consider for me, a good private lesson would involve at least one of a number of things.

New steps
Work on and fine tune and problems with existing steps
New technique or ironing out problems with existing technique

Basically I want to finish a private lesson feeling that I have either learnt something new, identified something that I need to work on, or have worked towards ironing out an existing problem.

Oh ....... and had fun in the process! :wink: :D

[Bronzestudent]

A bad lesson can make you feel very discouraged. Personally, I like to review ahead of time what I've learned in the past couple lessons, so my teacher won't have to take time reteaching that again. That's really the main thing. I don't like to spend precious time going over the same thing she taught me last week, or 2 weeks ago, or whatever.

As far as what the teacher can do, hmmm.... Ask me occasionally if there is a particular dance I want to work on that may not be in her plan for the day. If I was a teacher, I would appreciate my students showing enthusiasm for learning more, and even asking questions on old steps, it shows they take it seriously and enjoy dancing. Give your students time to warm up on a dance before expecting them to move right into new material. And use a variety of music from lesson to lesson.

[DanceMentor]

As a teacher, Bronzestudent

I really appreciate your response. I promise to start using a wider variety of music and make sure my students are warmed up before I get into new stuff. Anything else you might suggest?

Thanks,
David

[dancin_feet]

I don't like to spend precious time going over the same thing she taught me last week, or 2 weeks ago, or whatever.

Do you not briefly review what was covered in the last lesson? I find it invaluable to go over what we did (briefly) to make sure that I remember it and build on it.

[etchuck]

I'm pretty much a novice at these things since I'm really used to small group lessons (no more than 4 couples) and focus on my leading by changing partners at my insistence. For me it's cost effective and I wanted to focus more on technique while racking up steps. I avoided private lessons because I didn't feel like it would help me without a partner.

So now, I have one. Yesterday I and my dance partner had a two-hour session of private lessons, which was for me just my second time to have a private lesson (the first time was only two weeks before, but it was with a different instructor and only one hour). In my case, we're preparing for a local competition next month.

Just to state it, I went into this lesson convinced that because I really didn't have more than maybe 4 hours of GOOD lessons in samba that I sucked at it. Every time I tried dancing to it, the usual bad problems would come up and it never felt right. It was at my partner's insistence that we compete in samba because it was her favorite and more accomplished dance. If we're competing in samba, I wanted a routine (having never had one before). [In return, she agreed to compete in rumba, with which I'm more comfortable but she was not.]

That being said, our instructor [Dan Calloway FYI] went through his standard routine (slightly abbreviated for me) for bronze samba and tried to point out to me what to do. Technique and all that was incorporated into learning the steps in the routine. Went through it each phase, and then the entire routine of 24 figures at least a couple of times.

In the end, he said, I have my homework (as does my partner), there's lots of potential, he wants to see it as polished as possible the next month he comes back. And we had 15 minutes left :!:

No one could have predicted that to me. Essentially a lot of steps that I have seen but had not done because I just didn't feel comfortable doing them... well the routine helped to get them out of subconscious storage (which since I guess they were associated with "painful" were really in deep storage).

And I'm practicing my own set of figures tonight solo; we're both getting together tomorrow to go over it all again and see how much I retained. She also said she'd give me a DVD with yesterday's lesson on it so I can watch it whenever I'm on the road this month.

So in my case, I needed a confidence boost as much as I needed a routine. I didn't quite expect that much of a boost, but I dare now say... I'm pretty excited to practice samba. You'd never hear me say or type that before the lesson. And I mean "never."

And I hadn't even gone over the previous hour when we did rumba.

[cl5814]

I don't like to spend precious time going over the same thing she taught me last week, or 2 weeks ago, or whatever.

Do you not briefly review what was covered in the last lesson? I find it invaluable to go over what we did (briefly) to make sure that I remember it and build on it.

I also like the idea of *******ing my memory on the last few lessons. I learn by repetition so, i need to hear concepts repeated, even just briefly. It also gives you a confidence boost as you feel like you really learned and retained the information from previous lessons.

Another thought on private lessons. I hate it when an instructor wants to cover 6 dances during the 50 minute lesson, each with a new point for me to remember. He used to say that he gets bored easily and so needs to do something different every few minutes. So, the stuff he teahes me might be boring to him by now, but to me it is new material. Rather teach me 2 dances each with 2 new points each, i am more likely to retain the material. At home i would recall the lesson and all the thoughts, write it on paper on my refrigerator to stare at every time i open it, but there is no way i can practice and remember all the concepts in the space of 1 week, so i would pick 2-3 thoughts and think / practice that during the social parties.

[etchuck]

Another thought on private lessons. I hate it when an instructor wants to cover 6 dances during the 50 minute lesson, each with a new point for me to remember. He used to say that he gets bored easily and so needs to do something different every few minutes. So, the stuff he teahes me might be boring to him by now, but to me it is new material. Rather teach me 2 dances each with 2 new points each, i am more likely to retain the material. At home i would recall the lesson and all the thoughts, write it on paper on my refrigerator to stare at every time i open it, but there is no way i can practice and remember all the concepts in the space of 1 week, so i would pick 2-3 thoughts and think / practice that during the social parties.

Your teacher gets bored? What do you pay him/her for? To help you dancing I hope... you don't pay him to entertain him. If you have trouble with one dance, he should be able to help hack out the problem for you. After all, you're the customer, and if you do anything that looks badly, it reflects on his capacity as an instructor... especially for private lessons.

[Bronzestudent]

I don't like to spend precious time going over the same thing she taught me last week, or 2 weeks ago, or whatever.

Do you not briefly review what was covered in the last lesson? I find it invaluable to go over what we did (briefly) to make sure that I remember it and build on it.

Great Point, Dancin Feet!

Kudos for my teacher, she does plenty of review (dancing with her and honing in on School Figures), I was more picking on myself with that statement. Meaning that I don't like to have to relearn something that I could do 2 or 3 weeks ago. However, some moves are more involved, like anything in Quickstep, or WCS Swivels, and things like that, and you need to spend more time on them, spread out over a few lessons. There's so much to get right - timing, position, direction, heel or toe, you can't expect to learn it all at once.

* Dance Mentor, thanks for letting me know my input was helpful! I often think I would like to be a teacher, so I try to catalog things I appreciate from my teacher. She's good at throwing new things on, telling me she's preparing me for more advanced moves later on by teaching me something simple ahead of time. For instance, staying up on my toes on the QQ count of Foxtrot basic, and making the Waltz basic more elegant by adding to what I first learned in the group class I started in. Updating the Basic steps at opportune times is exciting!

[delamusica]

Learning steps and coreography doesn't really make a lesson good for me - that's mostly just a matter of memorization and taking time to get used to the new movements. Even though I compete in the open gold category, I find that the most helpful lessons are going over the absolute basics of good technique and really perfecting the basic movements, as it makes all the new moves so much easier and faster to learn!

[D-spot]

For me a good private lesson is one that give me the value for my money and then taking my instructress out on a hot date (yeah, right - that'll never happen).

Seriously though, as a teacher I try to do my best for the student. I talk with them and make notes as to where they want to go in dance and then try to structure the lesson to THEIR requirements. Sounds good? Okay, now beware. An ethical instructor will do as I have discussed, however many are more interested in the buck than the bang and will use personal information against you in order to sell you more lessons.

Once I have a good idea where want to go I ask them (at the start of each lesson) how they feel that day and then try to match the lesson to their mood The student is the more important person, not the instructor. The instructor should be prepared to chnge their approach and not to impose upon the poor student. Imagine if you go to a restaurant and you get what the chef wants you to eat. Not acceptable.

My experience as a student is to take control of each lesson and ask for what I want. Although I often say 'Surprise me' and allow the teacher to instruct what they want. (I also do this in restaurants occassionally, interesting food appears sometimes). Acting like this with one instructress did get me into trouble with her, so be warned. She took a strong dislike to me. The reason? I was in control of the lesson not her and she couldn't use her vaunted selling techniques to make more money from me.

With the right instructor who works WITH you are the best way to get the best learning experience and value for money.

D-spot.

[bordertangoman]

Learning steps and coreography doesn't really make a lesson good for me - that's mostly just a matter of memorization and taking time to get used to the new movements. Even though I compete in the open gold category, I find that the most helpful lessons are going over the absolute basics of good technique and really perfecting the basic movements, as it makes all the new moves so much easier and faster to learn!

I had my first private lesson two weeks ago and although the stucture was a round a particluar step configuration, the focus was on balance, weight posture, leading/following and the teachers splitting us up and bringing us back together as a couple so I would practice with the woman teacher and my partner would practice with the male teacher and also vice versa. This was really helpful as I am slow to learn steps, but once I have absorbed them mentally I can keep practicing them.

[bordertangoman]

Though i was nervous - it did feel like an exam at first - the teachers were really nice and encouragin.

[Genesius Redux]

Good for you guys overcoming your nervousness and taking a private, btman!

I've never felt the private lessons I've had were evaluative--but maybe that's because I do so much teaching of writing myself that I know there is a difference between evaluation and teaching. To me teaching is more about helping students do what they're trying to do--evaluation is just that, evaluating their skills from a more objective perspective.

That means to me that students need to proactively think of their goals before they arrive at their lessons. Review steps, practice technique, be ready to start work on dancing. I think that becomes easier the more you've studied in dance. At first you haven't got the slightest idea what to ask, and it's largely up to your teacher to take charge of the lesson.

But as you learn more, I think you need to go to lessons with questions, not rely on your teachers to have a whole "lesson plan" drawn up for you. I make distinctions in my own teaching between freshmen, seniors, graduate students. I will structure the freshman classes heavily--but I'll expect my seniors to come to class having thought about the work, which I may supplement with critical material. My graduate students should be supplying most of the material on their own, and my job is to help them sift through it and plan their own extended projects.

That's just to say that the relationship between students and teachers will change during the association--this may sound a little odd, but it isn't the teacher's job to constantly entertain the student. Nothing ticks me off as a teacher more than a student who shows up for class ill-prepared, not thinking about what s/he's doing, and sits with arms crossed, a scowl on the face, with an air of "Teach me."

Today my lesson went like this:

1. April Fool's joke. Had a little sound maker that made gorilla screams from a toy my dog had chewed up. Taped it to my right hip and started by asking my teacher a question about closed position in tango. Could she show me?

2. Gossiped about "Average Joe."

3. Worked on technique stuff in foxtrot/waltz

4. Worked on technique stuff in Cha Cha (I had emailed her telling her that I was having trouble seeing myself in the dance because I just didn't do flirty/sexy, so she wanted to work on it just technically)

5. Most of what we worked on were exercises that I could take home with me and practice.

When I go in, I go for 1-1/2 to 2 hours, since we've found we can get more done than we can in an hour format.

I do not, by the way, count the minutes. And we do often spend time goofing and acting silly. To me, it's about doing what you plan to do while you're there, not having everything on a time clock. The first studio where I danced (a franchise, which later became an independent that was run like a franchise), one of the managers said something to my teacher in front of me that put me in a fury.

She was playing with the music machine, and being all of 20 years old, was cycling through a bunch of songs that were just not up to snuff--and just couldn't make up her mind. So while I'm waiting for her to find a tune that she'd be okay to dance with, the studio manager walks up to her (in front of me) and makes a comment about how much a lesson costs per minute and tells her to get a move on. Undercuts her in front of her student. I almost cut him off at the knees, and the only reason I kept my temper was that I knew if I didn't she'd pay for it later.

So I just took her aside and said, "I'm not counting."

A good private lesson is one in which you learn something, regardless of how much of the time is spent learning and how much is spent fooling around. It's offensive, I think, to approach a professional as if s/he's an hourly worker.

The "hour," for me, is simply a matter of scheduling. What you pay for is the movement instruction--and most of my teachers cram a whole lot of stuff into the time we spend. A great teacher will teach a lot in an hour, even if you spend 15 minutes of that hour being goofy. A lousy teacher will teach nothing, even if the hour lesson stretches 25 minutes overtime. Like those profs that keep their classes past the scheduled time to leave, because they just have to cram in one more thing. That's not teaching.

Don't quite know how I got off on that tangent--maybe because I know a lot of students tend to have their eyes on the clock, when IMO they should have their heads in the dancing.

Will shut up and cease pontificating! :wink:

[dTas]

i try to tailor my lessons to what the student wants to learn. often one of the first thing i ask them is "so... what are we going to learn today?"

i worked for several years teaching for several studios that were only interested in "making a buck". i had to follow a set lesson plan and convince the student that this was the best thing for them. in some cases it was true but in others, more often than not, it was just to set the student up for more lessons.

so now i'm independant and very much student focused. most of my students have been dancing for 5+ years if not 10+ and they know what they want. they all walk away knowing that they learned what they came to learn.

its a nice feeling for me to know that i've helped someone with their dancing and a good feeling for them to have their questions answered and things to work on. its a very nice arrangement one that's taken me seveal years to develop.

when i get a coaching personally i want to walk away knowing what it is i need to work on and how to work on it. i work on it for a month or two or more and then revist the coach to see if i have improved. i take a group class to learn a new "move" or combination of moves and hopefully i'll learn to move my body in a new way.

the best thing i can say is... PLAY! play with your dancing and you'll find out how your body wants to move. you find out that a lot of these moves are there for a reason, how else would you do an underarm turn? a cross body lead? etc etc. the better your body understands these fundamental move the better it will be able to do more advanced complex combinations.

i think people take this all too seriously and try to chisel out a dancer.. the dancer is in you, let it just come out. don't restrict it with apprehension and doubt. MOVE! and move naturally... your body will figure it out. :D

[pygmalion]

Wow dTas! You sound like a great teacher. 8) :D

Do you think there are situations in which you, the teacher, know what's best for the student, even when they don't? Meaning, are there times when you prefer your students to just have faith in you and your methods, or do you just go with what the student asks you for?

Just curious. 8)

[dTas]

pygmalion: what i have found is that the body knows when it is ready to move on to something else. it depends on whether or not youre a male or a female but the cycle is the same.

if you are a male the first thing you usually want to learn is patterns. you learn a handfull (about 5-10) and then all of a sudden the question comes up "it just doesn't feel right", or "it just doesn't look right" and then the lessons switch to technique. after a while the mind becomes full of technique and the student hits a plateau where they feel they don't know anything... that's when patterns kick in again and the cycle starts over.

for ladies is the opposite. usually ladies want to looks good on the dance floor first and then worry about patterns and control. i figure this is because they are being lead and don't worry so much about where they're stepping as to how it feels to be lead there. but the same cycle occurs.

couples are a little different since its the male wanting to learn patterns and the lady wanting to learn technique. originally the lady wins and technique is the lesson (men are gentlemen of course) but then the couple realizes that you cant dance your technique without patterns so the male gets what he wants/needs.

it all works out in the end. :D

there are times when the student asks for something that they are not capable of doing at their level of dance. i advise them that what they are asking is a very advanced technique and give them the base exercises to train their body to begin learning what they want to achieve. if they believe they are ready then i go ahead and show them the technique and they realize that they are not ready for it and agree to practice the fundamental technique to build their skill.

the hardest lesson is when a student wants to dance but does not want to learn how to dance. "just show me the step and i'll get it" is what i hear. but the problem is... to be able to do that step you need a certain level of technique. "i don't want to learn technique, i don't need to". :x

but if i work with that student long enough they find out that technique is a good thing and very necessary for balance and grace. 8)

[Jack]

Currently I have one teacher for private lessons. She is also at the group classes I go to. She teaches the other teachers. Enough of this, but she watches me dance and when we do private lessons she goes over things she has noticed. At this time in private lessons we go over timimg leading , stating on beat. Id have to say a teacher who knows what you need , not just new moves.