Dancing on television and in movies

[KevinL]

I watched "Confessions of a Teenage Drama Queen" with my daughter yesterday, and it was pretty good.

There was actually a fair amount of dancing, which was nice. There was a mixture (at different times) of hiphop and partner dancing.

The problem that I had with the partner dancing was that the hold was a very relaxed guys right hand on girls left hip, guys left hand holding girls right hand close to body/face. Another time a couple was dancing and the guy had his right arm wrapped all the way around the girls waist. Not at all what I think of when I teach people to dance.

It struck me as odd, but I let it pass, since they at least showed people (teenagers, even!) dancing together.

What do you think about the way dance is depicted on tv and in movies (when it is depicted at all)? Why do most people on screen dance like that? If that is what is considered good dancing by most of the population, shouldn't we all dance like that?

[tsb]

What do you think about the way dance is depicted on tv and in movies (when it is depicted at all)?


what you're going to see is what an average member of the audience expects to see. and unless the people dancing are a major part of the plot/scene, they're going to be background and not do anything flashy to take away from the dialogue, etc.

Why do most people on screen dance like that?

because they don't know any better?

If that is what is considered good dancing by most of the population, shouldn't we all dance like that?

all forms of social interaction work more smoothly when there are common standards and conventions. IMO partnered dance requires an above average level of standards & conventions because:
- the degree of social interaction is quite high;
- the level of physical contact is higher than average;
- the physical requirements are higher in terms of motor skills;
- the level of non-verbal communication is greater;
- the degree of impact is greater - everything you do influences both your partner (in terms of balance, etc.) as well as everyone else (floorcraft);

if people were required to dance, they would be more inclined to be more familiar with concepts of frame & connection, etc.

to me, it's not different than watching people play volleyball. i played in college (for those of you who play, we ran a 6-2, i set & hit strong-side & at 6' tall, i used to be able to reach about 10'4"). to most people volleyball consists of slapping the ball back and forth over the net. i understand that & i know that most people are perfectly happy to play like that. fine, just don't ask me to play in a game like that. it's not as much that i woudn't be able to utlize most of the skills i've developed as much as i'd be deathly worried of getting hurt due to colliding with someone else; according to a study i saw, a common cause of serious (permanent) knee injury is your typical backyard volleyball game. IMO volleyball is most enjoyable when your side plays together as a team. but you can't do that without agreeing to employ specific conventions and developing your own individual technique(s) for the role(s) you play.

[Genesius Redux]

What do you think about the way dance is depicted on tv and in movies (when it is depicted at all)? Why do most people on screen dance like that? If that is what is considered good dancing by most of the population, shouldn't we all dance like that?

Because the yahoos who are producing and directing don't give a good darn what it looks like--they want the seen shot as quickly and as inexpensively as they can.

In general, though, film and television is a little better--because the camera doesn't lie, producers try to make it all look a little better, and will often take the time to cast actors who already dance or make sure the actors get plenty of coaching before and during the scene to be shot, while hiring some top dancers as extras.

The chief offender here is live theatre--particularly the classics. I had to see a rather bad version of Romeo and Juliet last summer. It was put on by an Equity company. In the scene at Capulet's masquerade ball, where R & J first meet, the director chose to introduce some dancing.

First was some really bad hip-hop with some swing-jive steps thrown in for good measure. Looked like a bunch of non-dancing actors trying to follow choreography. But even worse was a featured waltz between Juliet and Paris--and the actors couldn't even do a decent-looking box. Falling when they should be rising, footy, choppy, and awkward. An embarrassment.

And right now I'm doing "The Cherry Orchard," this one a freebie. But I'd told the director on day 1 of a 6-week rehearsal schedule that I could get good choreographers who knew ballroom and theatre to work for free if he wanted to do something with the important dance in Act 3. Instead, John waited until the last minute to ask me to find someone (about a week before opening)--of course my choreographers couldn't do it. But his idea was that you could just pull someone in to show the actors some basic steps maybe 15 or 20 minutes before rehearsal, and that would be fine.

Other shows I've seen--like "A Doll's House," where the dance is an integral part of the action (I'd argue the same for "The Cherry Orchard")--the dance is regarded ancillary, or something to be added after the more "important" work of "acting" has taken place. Of course, it never occurs to these guys that maybe performing the tarantella (for Nora) or dancing the waltz (as in "The Cherry Orchard") *is* in fact, the action that the actors are supposed to be engaged in performing.

The problem is that in many acting classes and theatre programs across the country, students are engaged in exactly the sort of time-wasting nonsense that is so justly parodied in "A Chorus Line":

Every day, for a week,
We would try to feeeel the motion,
Feeeel the motion
Down the hill....

There are some bright spots among acting theorists out there, foremost among them David Mamet, who actually have respect for skills such as dancing, singing, juggling, that ought to be part of every actor's repertoire but instead have been (relatively recently in theatrical history) separated from the more "dramatic" wing of the theatre and relegated to the world of musical theatre and comedy. A shame, but it's typical.

I can't tell you the number of supposedly "serious" classically-trained actors I know who have no training at all in any kind of dance, or stage combat, or any physical training other than self-indulgent "find yourself" exercises.

That's why the dancing you see represented on stage or sometimes in film or television is so bad. The actors never bothered to learn to dance, because they frankly don't care.

Oooooooooh boy, thinking about this gets me steamed! :x

Gotta go have a Coke and a smile--does this drive anyone besides me so crazy?

[LindyQuest]

What gets me is when the characters in a movie or TV show, who according to the script have never danced a day in their lives, are suddenly able to perform complex dance moves! I'm thinking of an episode of Everybody Loves Raymond, when after the first or second dance the characters are doing aerials and whatnot. :shock: Hmmm.... I guess that's the point, though, to suspend reality...

[tsb]

What gets me is when the characters in a movie or TV show, who according to the script have never danced a day in their lives, are suddenly able to perform complex dance moves! I'm thinking of an episode of Everybody Loves Raymond, when after the first or second dance the characters are doing aerials and whatnot. :shock: Hmmm.... I guess that's the point, though, to suspend reality...

i worked on an episode of gilmore girls where they had a 24 hour dance marathon (i'm in a purple zoot suit). i got to meet kenny ortega (he actually complimented my tie & i didn't have the heart to tell him i'd borrowed it from costuming as i'd inadvertently left my tie at home that day) as he spent a lot of time with us background dancers during meals. he talked about how in the scene in dirty dancing where jennifer grey kept making mistakes it was entirely real - she was actually learning at the time and we were getting her actual frustration. that kind of organic approach prompted him to recruit people who dance at the derby in hollywood to come and be background dancers in the episode. the people at the derby come in all shapes, sizes, & experience levels.

granted, the stuff appearing in the opening scene is completely choreographed, but for the rest of the episode, everyone (after being blocked) was pretty much dancing according to their experience level. but then, kenny dances (was doing mainly salsa) and is probably an exception as a director. and no, none of the main cast could dance a lick, which is why most of the shots are above the waist.

[Sagitta]

What do you think about the way dance is depicted on tv and in movies (when it is depicted at all)? Why do most people on screen dance like that? If that is what is considered good dancing by most of the population, shouldn't we all dance like that?

As long as I don't get to dance with those actors / actresses I don't mind. Anything that attracts more people to dance is a step in the right direction for me. Most people don't know what good dancing is and so their opinion should not guide how those in the community of people who "know what good dancing is" dance.