the worst tango class you ever had?

[rui resende]

tell your story!!

[bordertangoman]

Only four people turned up 3 men and one woman! ( and I was the teacher- not doing too well on the popularity stakes)

actually we had some fun as the leaders got to lead me (like trying to move the proverbial brick out-house)

[TangoTricia]

I'd been dancing for about a year, talking tango at every opportunity, travelling quite a bit to get to classes. Friends at work pointed out a new AT class opening locally. I caught up with them in what would have been week seven of a beginners class. I was on my way back from London, called and left a message for the teacher to apologise that I was running late. When I got there, he was quite cross, and ranted for a while that no-one esle had turned up. The signs were there from the start, but i was new, and keen, so when he suggested a private lessson, at ten pounds more than I was paying at my usual club, I thought he must be great.

It wasn't a good experience, being more about what a great dancer he was than anything about me. Towards the end, though, he said that he would accept a question from me. I had nothing i wanted to ask, so said, politely, i thought, that I had already leaarned so much that I had no questions left. He pressed the point, this was the point in the lesson when a questionw was to be asked so I had better ask a question. Yes, it really was like that. So i fell back on a question that has worked well for me: "given what you have seen of my dance, what do you see as the next thing for me to work on".

He then went on to demonstrate how much more considerate his style of dancing was, than many i would meet. The example he used was of leading me to a cross (the one I would describe as follower's left leg cross infront of right and change weight onto left) This he called "the cross" and then he showed his consideration by pushing with his thigh against the fleshy part of my thigh, rather than with the shin bone as he said many others would do to move me into a cross.

All this from a male, AT leader, with many CD/DVDs on how to learn AT on his website. The lesson I learned was to wait for personal recs. T xx

[Heather2007]

All this from a male, AT leader, with many CD/DVDs on how to learn AT on his website. The lesson I learned was to wait for personal recs. T xx

Hmm - very much the same way as a lawyer changes career believing he will one day become a great corruption-free political leader...It is so easy to become an AT teacher but a whole lifetime to keep your student's enthusiasm.

Newcomers: first thing to spot in over self-indulgent ego-driven teacher never mind their stage performances, websites, flyers. Is if they are speaking at you rather than for you - Move on.

[etp777]

Only four people turned up 3 men and one woman! ( and I was the teacher- not doing too well on the popularity stakes)

actually we had some fun as the leaders got to lead me (like trying to move the proverbial brick out-house)

Heh, had a class like that just yesterday. first class was 3 guys and one girl (though we borrowed two other female teachers for part of the class), and second was 2 guys and one woman. Both times it was a guy teaching. I'm actually more used to the other way though, generally I'm only guy and rest of students are women. Had one a couple weeks ago that was me and four women. I made claim (joking ;) ) that they all signed up for class after I did just because they wanted to dance with me. :)

[nucat78]

I do not do well with sacadas and the last class I had was virtually nothing but... sacadas. Good material but I was struggling.

[opendoor]

When I was dancing for 2 years, a real famous argentinian tango teacher came to town: [RB]. Thought I was ready for a real TA lesson with a real TA teacher from BAs.

What I did not knew, his style was stage tango. My former teachers told me to focus on grounding, emotion, interpretation, authenticity. What I saw then was hopping, spinning with tremendous speed and without any (!) emotion. Furthermore he treated the class like little children and the expression on his face spoke volumes.

That demoralized I returned to the self-appointed .. .. self-indulgent, ego-driven teachers ...

.. of my home town for the next years.

[Me]

Easily the worst class I've ever had was when I was a beginner. The class was taught by a dancesport instructor with absolutely ZERO training in AT. He insisted on not cancelling classes while the AT instructor was out of the country teaching. The AT instructor didn't have much choice - the dancesport instructor owned the studio he taught out of.

Even though the AT instructor provided the dancesport instructor with notes and a video of him demonstrating a simple walking exercise with ocho and molinete, the class was an hour long mess. The dancesport instructor locked the exercise into a pattern, which he kept getting confused, and sometimes ended on count 15, othertimes on count 14. He had called in another (skilled actually) dancesport instructor to demonstrate with him, but her only knowledge of AT was the backwards pattern he had attempted to show her before class. She turned molinete into a foxtrot-ish grapevine, ochos into international Rumba-ish swivels... Neither instructor was familiar with crossed system so they kept ending the pattern differently and couldn't figure out why. What a mess.

Worst class EVER!

What made things funny was when the AT instructor came back, he asked us what we had worked on while he was away. So, we showed him... I couldn't tell really if he wanted to laugh or cry. After we all finished swirling around and getting lost and ending on different feet, he demonstrated what we were supposed to have worked on... It was completely different and it made complete sense! It was an early lesson in just how badly things can go wrong if you try to learn a new dance (and then try to teach it) from a video tape.

[dchester]

I've been at two different workshops where they had the same problem. There was a specific move they were trying to teach (while tricky, it wasn't too hard). However, leading up to the move, they came up with some ridiculously complicated pattern that none of the leaders was able to figure out. We wasted over 1/2 hour before the teachers figured out to just teach the move.

As an aside, I don't know why more teachers don't just use the 8CB (like the Argentines teachers I've had), if they really need to use a pattern to introduce a move/step.

[pascal]

It was three years ago at the Biganos (very small town, near Bordeaux, France) all-dance festival. I came without a partner. It was an AT out-of-axis class and the only available follower was a 80 kg, blue-dyed haired lady without any technique as far as out-of-axis was concerned, and always very tense. Very heavy to handle. And I am not that strong. And nobody ever traded partners during the whole class.
Two days later during this festival I found a partner, somehow hijacking her from her salsa classes. What a difference! No technique either but young, light and not afraid of anything ("If they're teaching this, then it must be possible.")
On the last class of the last day I saw that the blue-haired lady was there too, I (very) quickly nodded, then hurried to the opposite corner of the room with my new, improved partner. I saw the lady rushing toward the festival organizer. Two minutes later they bothcame to me.
"Ok Pascal, this lady is without a partner. What you will do, is you will share your time fifty-fifty between her and your partner."

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

On the last class of the last day I saw that the blue-haired lady was there too, I (very) quickly nodded, then hurried to the opposite corner of the room with my new, improved partner. I saw the lady rushing toward the festival organizer. Two minutes later they bothcame to me.
"Ok Pascal, this lady is without a partner. What you will do, is you will share your time fifty-fifty between her and your partner."

This is outrageous. When people registered as a couple, and do not wish to rotate, they have the right to stick to each other. The teacher can ask or suggest, but order you around like that?
In my opinion, you should have asked for monetary compensation, if you were to be recruited as a taxi dancer for that lady :)

Your post reminded me of one class I took with my partner, with no intention to rotate. There were about a dozen spare followers present, and some ladies got verbally agressive with me for "not willing to share". I told them the guy was injured (which was true, he had a back pain at the time), to stop their attacks. It was very unpleasant, to say the least.

As I already mentioned, I take random group lessons very sparingly. I tend to be careful about who from, where, when and with whom, and curb my expectations accordingly. (I know, I probably miss out a lot of great ones). So, I haven't had that many "classes from hell" that I can think of. When it happened, it mostly was a case of rudeness or flagrant disrespect of some sort to others or to the instructor(!) from fellow class goers.

[Angel HI]

Hey guys, thie thread can be fun, and actually educational. But posts like OpenDoor's http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=595997&postcount=7 is really close to breaking the rules. Let's be careful with the names, yes? Thanks. Enjoying the thread, though.

[newbie]

What does the rule say?

[Heather2007]

Easily the worst class I've ever had was when I was a beginner. The class was taught by a dancesport instructor with absolutely ZERO training in AT. He insisted on not cancelling classes while the AT instructor was out of the country teaching. The AT instructor didn't have much choice - the dancesport instructor owned the studio he taught out of.

Even though the AT instructor provided the dancesport instructor with notes and a video of him demonstrating a simple walking exercise with ocho and molinete, the class was an hour long mess. The dancesport instructor locked the exercise into a pattern, which he kept getting confused, and sometimes ended on count 15, othertimes on count 14. He had called in another (skilled actually) dancesport instructor to demonstrate with him, but her only knowledge of AT was the backwards pattern he had attempted to show her before class. She turned molinete into a foxtrot-ish grapevine, ochos into international Rumba-ish swivels... Neither instructor was familiar with crossed system so they kept ending the pattern differently and couldn't figure out why. What a mess.

Worst class EVER!

What made things funny was when the AT instructor came back, he asked us what we had worked on while he was away. So, we showed him... I couldn't tell really if he wanted to laugh or cry. After we all finished swirling around and getting lost and ending on different feet, he demonstrated what we were supposed to have worked on... It was completely different and it made complete sense! It was an early lesson in just how badly things can go wrong if you try to learn a new dance (and then try to teach it) from a video tape.

I could almost see this as a one-off comedy sketch - ha, ha, ha. Very funny.:p

[Heather2007]

Hey guys, thie thread can be fun, and actually educational. But posts like OpenDoor's http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=595997&postcount=7 is really close to breaking the rules. Let's be careful with the names, yes? Thanks. Enjoying the thread, though.

What does the rule say?

I'm assuming it states something about "naming-names". Which then could end up in litigation proceedings against the site for defamation of character blah, blah, blah.

The best tactic with no risk of a Defendant v Claimant situation would be for the student to draft a small note straight after the class with his feelings expressed in it. That way, nobody gets the blush (or the bullet) and the teacher knows then exactly how you feel.

[Dave Bailey]

I'm assuming it states something about "naming-names".

Yes, from the guidelines (http://www.dance-forums.com/guidelines.php), I assume it refers to this rule:
4. Please do not engage in name calling, attacks on a person's character, deliberately inflammatory remarks, group stereotypes, or profanity (no matter how subtle – we take all such activities seriously)

Unfortunately, this thread is very difficult in that regard because you can't be specific - unlike the "Best class" one of course.

[Heather2007]

Unfortunately, this thread is very difficult in that regard because you can't be specific - unlike the "Best class" one of course.

Yes you can you use words like "the one with the forehead" or "the one with the Jimmy Hill chin" etc etc. Ha, ha, ha.

[dchester]

Yes, from the guidelines (http://www.dance-forums.com/guidelines.php), I assume it refers to this rule:

Unfortunately, this thread is very difficult in that regard because you can't be specific - unlike the "Best class" one of course.
At the risk of looking foolish, I don't see that Opendoor did any of the following: name calling, attacks on a person's character, deliberately inflammatory remarks, group stereotypes, or profanity.

He said the guy's class was bad, and he explained why.

:confused:

[Me]

dchester,

You don't look foolish. ;)

I'm no mod, but I've been around for a bit. I've seen these types of discussions limited in the past in the spirit of fairness. In this case, [the person] was named in full and he is not here to respond. That is my interpretation, though Angel might have other reasons, and we mere mortals are not to question them, as.... generally, open discussion of moderation is discouraged. I suspect this is because people have been known to hit the all-caps button and scream about freedom of speech. (I've seen it happen.)

Hope that helps. :-)

[Zoopsia59]

All you have to do is add the words "in my opinion" and its no longer much of an issue. "So and so's class really sucked in my opinion. I got nothing out of it. I needed x and it was all y. I'll never take another one of his classes. blah, blah, blah".

Now its a statement about the poster and the poster's experience, not a statement about the teacher presented as an absolute fact.

Just like any relationship... make "I" statements rather than statements about the other person.

Angel said Opendoor's post "came close", not that it DID violate the rules.

[opendoor]

.. posts like http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=595997&postcount=7 is really close to breaking the rules..

So, could you please change the bold characters to normal and edit the name to RB form BAs, ok?

Sorry for this, always have the feeling of talking to family members, not of being on air :oops:

[Me]

I don't think it is a problem with anybody here reading it. I think the problem might be with search engines. For all we know, a potential student could Google the full name and find this board. The DF ranks very high in Google searches. :)

[Peaches]

Also, it doesn't seem quite fair if the person isn't around to defend themselves IMO.

[Angel HI]

Sorry for the delays, and thanks to Dave http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=596368&postcount=16 for listing the rule, and to Me http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=596449&postcount=19 for explaining the situation.

[Dave Bailey]

Sorry for the delays, and thanks to Dave http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=596368&postcount=16 for listing the rule, and to Me http://www.dance-forums.com/showpost.php?p=596449&postcount=19 for explaining the situation.
"Thanks to Me" always sounds a bit strange :)

[Angel HI]

"Thanks to Me" always sounds a bit strange :)

Yeah :uplaugh: