From Studios to Clubs

[ShyDancer]

How do you make the transition smoothly from a social ballroom venue to a club??
Or is it never a smooth transition?
Are there things you should know before making the big move?

I ask this because I think I may have brought new meaning to "throwing yourself in the deep end".

Last night I took myself and a group of non dancing friends (maybe that was my first mistake) out to a dinner and floorshow, which turns into a Salsa club afterward.
I thought I would be ok knowing a few basics....boy was I wrong! It was so different to the ballroom scene I dont even know where to begin.

I gave it my best shot, tried my best to just go along with it, trying to use what I know ....didnt work very well and I didnt enjoy the experience much at all. And Im in no hurry to go try it again!

It wasnt supposed to be like that! It was supposed to be the best night Id ever have dancing Salsa....like I read about in here!

And to make matters just that little bit worse, our "host" openly criticised ballroom salsa when I told her I had been taught in a studio, saying "Oh we only teach the proper stuff here, not how to keep your body straight and point your hands" :evil: :evil:

So tell me all you club dancers out there..how did you do it? Did you learn straightt from the clubs?

[youngsta]

Nope, threw myself in the deep end just like you! :lol: I took my first lessons at Arizona Ballroom Company. Loved it, fell in love with the music and dance, and didn't go to my first REAL salsa spot until I'd been taking lessons for about 2 1/2 months. BAD, BAAADDDD idea!! Boy did I get a wake-up call. And don't get me started on the first time I dared step in an LA Club...mortified. But thousands of hours of going out and practicing have turned the drowning salsero into a very capable swimmer! :wink:

[ShyDancer]

Thats what they were dancing last night Youngsta...LA Style Salsa.
Me I was seeing snippets of Mambo, Merengue and my ballrrom Salsa all mixed in :shock: :shock:
Although that may have had something to do with the mojito I had sampled earlier in the evening........

[borikensalsero]

Nothing to worry about ShyDancer, even those who go to club salsa schools end up feeling just like that when they hit a club for the first time. Mortified to say the least, even if they are OK dancers, they will sweat just by looking at the awesome dancers every where. God, I used to be like that when I had to dance with the top dancers, but now, I don't even see them.

I'm there doing my own thing worried only about me, the music and my partner. Hang in there, if you don't go back, it will take even longer to get used to it, you might even never go back. It is up to you know, it isn't about being the best dancer nor looking good. It is about feeling the good ol' soul soothing rhythm that makes us go crazy out there. break out of all fear, and all expectations, and go have fun! :D

[Genesius Redux]

Well, funny you should mention it, ShyDancer. I went out to our local club on Friday night. The owner is a really good LA-style dancer, originally from Guatemala, dancing all his life. He loves dancing, and he offers free lessons before the music every night. And when he knows people know a little bit, he'll take them into a private room and give them an advanced lesson--free of charge!

Last night, a bunch of people from the studio where I do ballroom came out to dance at the club as well--teachers and students. I was already there, a warm body for the beginner class. But I saw some of the ladies from the studio, mostly older, widowed, sitting in the back, waiting for the music. And I went back to say hello, and just casually asked, "So you guys aren't going to join the class?" And someone I didn't know, a competitor (I think amateur) I recognized but never spoke to, who just happened to be in the vicinity (i.e. not whom I was talking to), says, rather icily, "We already know how to dance salsa."

You have to understand--I know these ladies very well, and they're all quite nice, and some of them have been taking lessons for years. But I'm not sure I'd say that they really "know" ballroom, let alone salsa.

The club owner, on the other hand, is the very picture of graciousness. He not only welcomes the students and instructors, he openly admires them, especially some of the teachers, whom he has seen dance many times in the past. Both he and my teacher have mutually good things to say about each other, other instructors are very happy to see him. It's all quite friendly.

So what's up with the club owner you describe or the amateur competitor who was at our club I've described? Ignorance and pride, pure and simple. Really good dancers, in my experience, don't denigrate the work of other dancers. People who dance mostly in ballroom know that they have to learn something different when they get to a club. People in clubs know how hard ballroom competitors work.

Humility is a style, not something that can be learned. And there's plenty of arrogance floating around in the dance world, both at the club level and at the ballroom level. Mostly, when I see that kind of arrogance, I see in it a coping strategy--an attempt to cover an inadequacy.

The comment that you've described is thoughtless and uncalled for--no wonder you were ticked. You'd at least expect that even if they're going to teach you different things, something of what you've put into this dance already would be honored. After all, this is a salsa club, not basic training, right? But this host has probably also seen dozens of similarly arrogant ballroom dancers show up with all sorts of feelings of superiority. I think you may have run into that.

Is this the only salsa club in town? If it is, you might just have to grin and bear it--surely after you've gone a few times, the attitude will disappear. If not, you can always learn something from even someone as arrogant as this. Take the wheat and leave the chaff. Make friends inside the club, dance with people you like and ignore comments that are cheap and stupid. You know, it's just a club, it doesn't have to be a grand symbol of your Initiation into Dance.

What I do is just listen to what people tell me to do in the club and I do it. It's different enough from my ballroom experience that I can afford to think of it as a totally different dance. Ballroom I dance "mambo." Salsa club I dance salsa. The main difference I've found is that where I dance salsa much of the lead comes from the arms, which is similar (as I think tsb said somewhere else) to hustle. There are no absolutes in dancing--there are very good reasons to hold a frame in waltz. People who know what they're doing alter what they're doing in different situations. That's why the best teachers and dancers out there always recognize and admire great dancing, without getting caught up in the labels.

Sorry you had a bad time at the club, ShyDancer, but I know you'll pull something good out of it! :D

Cheers,

Genesius

[Sagitta]

I actually learnt from a variety of sources - ballroom, dance hosts at social nights, a club instructor, just absorbing the music and learning to move to it. The "open"criticism you met from the host was patently unfair. Yes ballroom salsa is very different from club salsa, and yes the feel is different, and yes club salsa may be from the street and thus considered "authentic" or "proper" by people. However, that doesn't mean you put someone down, particularly if you are a host.

Jumping in and finding something not what you expected can be frightening and mortifying. I had a little of that coming back after only a few months of salsa, then a month off while I was on holiday. You know what? I just gritted my teeth and did it and my second time was better, and my third last night was peachy. It might take you a little longer but do what is important for you. There are arrogant egoistical people out there, but don't let that stop you doing what you enjoy.

[danceguy]

Shy Dancer,

Just as Youngsta said...it is an eye opening experience to go to a real Salsa event, especially with live music and a huge, crowded dance floor. If you really want to learn Salsa...just keep going back to the clubs...eventually you will get to know people, and even find some of the really good dancers who may teach lessons. Dance as much as you can, learn as much as you can and have an open mind and a humble heart. One day, you may become a regular and suddenly that club is one of your usual spots...and you'll have forgotten you once stood there petrified and unable to dance. :wink: :P

Of course, there are other venues in other cities...and as you branch out the same thing will happen at larger venues...and with time I imagine (not quite there yet myself!) you should be comfortable just about anywhere...even though I've been intimidated and many larger Salsa events...I always manage to dance a few times and get a feel for the energy of the group. Sometimes good, sometimes not...but its always an educational experience. ;)

Best of luck!

SG

[sbsalsera]

ShyDancer,

When I first started dancing at a local club (after having been in a studio salsa class for 2-3 months), I made a special effort to attend the lesson that preceeded open dancing. This helped a lot because I got to know the novice leaders and could practice with them. Before I knew it, the club was filled with familiar & friendly faces on a weekly basis!

SB

[Spitfire]

You know, I don't do much dancing at clubs of any kind, but there is a salsa group at the university here that puts on an end of semester dance featuring a live band at the studio that I attend. When I dance to live, loud Salsa music I do get a different feeling then what I get from recorded music; like I'm dancing more club then ballroom.

I've made some earlier posts expressing confusion between the two, but didn't think about this until just now.

Note to Youngsta - I think you would enjoy these end of semester dances if you were still here. 8) :wink:

[tj]

So tell me all you club dancers out there..how did you do it? Did you learn straightt from the clubs?

In my own experience, it usually works better to ease oneself into the club scene. Start with folks that you're comfortable (e.g. invite fellow classmates to go to the club with you), and after you feel more secure about everything, then start dancing with everyone else. It's important to have a strong sense of self and not let others ruin an otherwise good time.


And to make matters just that little bit worse, our "host" openly criticised ballroom salsa when I told her I had been taught in a studio, saying "Oh we only teach the proper stuff here, not how to keep your body straight and point your hands" :evil: :evil:


This is a pretty common sales tactic that's being used nowadays. Openly criticize someone about themselves or mention how they're lacking something, and offer oneself or one's goods as the solution to fill that need.

It's being done in so many areas, including teaching dance. Something we should all be aware of...

[rails]

How do you make the transition smoothly from a social ballroom venue to a club??

I've been reading about the difference between ballroom and club salsa on this forum and I must confess that I have no idea what anyone's talking about. I live in San Francisco. If I go to the Allegro or the Metronome (studios) on Sunday night I see the same people dancing the same way that I see at the clubs (Roccapulco, Cocomo, the Glas Kat etc).

Many of the instructors that teach at studios also teach drop-in lessons at the clubs. They don't teach different things depending on the venue. I also see studio instructors out dancing in the clubs quite a lot. I've never heard anyone call their dancing style ballroom.

Maybe San Francisco is a unique place where this ballroom salsa thing doesn't exist? I don't know. Perhaps someone else who lives here can point out a local example of ballroom salsa. I'd be curious to see it. The next time I get a chance to talk to an instructor I'll ask them about it too.

[SDsalsaguy]

Hiya rails... if you don't mind my asking, who's teaching/running the Sunday night salsa at Metronome?

[rails]

Hiya rails... if you don't mind my asking, who's teaching/running the Sunday night salsa at Metronome?

I haven't been in a while, but last I heard, Val and Matt were still doing the intermediate class and Fernando and Hiroe were doing the beginner class. The latter used to teach the Monday night drop-in at Cocomo.

[Sagitta]

Check out an instructor who teaches ballroom and ask him/her to teach you mambo. You'll get ballroom salsa. Instructors in studios, on the other hand, may teach club salsa. The two instructors that I enjoy teach club salsa.

[SDsalsaguy]

rails-
The reason I asked is because when I was there a couple of years ago it was a salsa couple (from a local salsa group) who were running the salsa events at Metronome so, of course, I'd expect real "club" salsa from them.

I'm not surprised that you don't see the divide we're talking about though. The instructors at Metronome tend to all be very seasoned instructors... social dancing as well as teaching. The divide really shows up the most with newer instructors/students who's only exposure is through a ballroom studio. Aside from a real difference in flavor and flow, there *is* a difference in connection & arm/tensions...

Count yourself lucky and enjoy!