Latin nights experiences - hip hop?

[Sagitta]

Every single latin night that I've gone to in my area they play hip hop also. My question is where does hip hop fit in the latin genre? I can see extrpolating from merenegue, and doing it for some booty shaking, but still!! :? What have been your experiences on latin nights?

[squirrel]

you don't want to know... here latin means anything from latino pop to R&B, hip-hop, salsa, cumbia... old rock&roll tunes etc. :)

[Sagitta]

Oh my god!! :shock:

Here they play samba, cumbia, forro, merengue, bachata, one cha cha or two, and salsa. The hip hop is the one thing that I want to get rid of. I actually went to one of thsoe events that you describe, last Saturday and did not have as much fun as I do on Tuesday nights. Not my cup of tea, really. :? :(

[Tasek]

Don't get me started, big peeve of mine, has happened several times when someplace they want to have a theme night (where they normally don't do latin/salsa), advertise it as latin or salsa night, I go there and then spend a few hours listening to hip-hop, R'n'B and "latin house/pop" before going home disappointed. :evil:

[squirrel]

Trust me, Tasek, when they advertise Salsa/Cuban night in my country, we listen to hip-hop, house and R&B most of the night... we consider ourselves lucky if they actually play latino pop!!!

[cocodrilo]

Oh my god!! :shock:

Here they play samba, cumbia, forro, merengue, bachata, one cha cha or two, and salsa. The hip hop is the one thing that I want to get rid of. I actually went to one of thsoe events that you describe, last Saturday and did not have as much fun as I do on Tuesday nights. Not my cup of tea, really. :? :(

There's a club I occasionally go to in Hiroshima- the 2nd floor is latin. GREAT salsa, some merengue, etc. Attracts a latin crowd. The 1st floor is hip-hop & R & B- lots of guys from the base, lots of morons smoking on the dance floor, lots of attitudes and a gunky floor to ruin your dance shoes! Although I think some aspects of hip hop DANCE very cool, I would not want to hang at a place that tries to heap latin with hip hop music. They just don't mix! :evil:

[Tasek]

Sorry to hear that squirrel, here it highly depends on the venue, some places have regular latin things and those tend to be what is advertised :D, those other places just want to draw some extra punters every once in a while and then it often sucks :(

*Tasek sends some big salsa vibes to Romania*

[squirrel]

the same here Tasek... there's one venue where they play salsa and the rest are trying to organize Latino nights, but they hardly ever succeed... at least in Salsa terms :)

[cocodrilo]

On a different forum I noticed a thread about "salsa nights" not making any money. This I can vouch for as I host latin dance parties. Thank GOODNESS for the Brazilian/Peruvian party animals or we would TOTALLY be in the red! I think the rationale behind playing the mish-mash of music is that they must appeal to a wider crowd to make money. (This is CLUBS we are talking about, no?) The salsa folks I hang with are party animals, but a lot of them that frequent the clubs aren't- bringing in their own drinks or drinking nothing but water, not buying ANYTHING from the bar- how's a club to survive? Certainly NOT on the paltry cover alone, considering there are DJs to be paid, electricity bills to be covered and not to mention the staff...:?

[pygmalion]

So shoot me. I actually LIKE reggaeton. It grows on you ... kinda like a fungus. :shock: :lol: Just kidding. It gets played on pop and Latin pop radio here all the time, and there are catchy hooks in the music. I'm getting used to it, and I car dance to it all the time. But when I want to dance salsa, I find the salsa/reggae/hip-hop mix to be a bit annoying.

[squirrel]

you're right cocodrilo... one venue here, that played mostly salsa (the owner was an addict) went bankrupt... salsa dancers are known to drink mostly water (or beer in my country)... but not the hard stuff

[cocodrilo]

you're right cocodrilo... one venue here, that played mostly salsa (the owner was an addict) went bankrupt... salsa dancers are known to drink mostly water (or beer in my country)... but not the hard stuff

Yeah, "Drinking beer without vodka is a waste of money" -Old Kazakh Proverb, haw haw...But to go out & want to dance latin & get slogged with HIP HOP tunes, UGH!!!!!!!!!!! :evil:

[salsachinita]

On a different forum I noticed a thread about "salsa nights" not making any money. This I can vouch for as I host latin dance parties. Thank GOODNESS for the Brazilian/Peruvian party animals or we would TOTALLY be in the red! I think the rationale behind playing the mish-mash of music is that they must appeal to a wider crowd to make money. (This is CLUBS we are talking about, no?) The salsa folks I hang with are party animals, but a lot of them that frequent the clubs aren't- bringing in their own drinks or drinking nothing but water, not buying ANYTHING from the bar- how's a club to survive? Certainly NOT on the paltry cover alone, considering there are DJs to be paid, electricity bills to be covered and not to mention the staff...:?

That's the whole point. Clubs are there to make a profit, or they are not interested! For a successful salsa night to happen, you NEED a combination of two clientels: [1] Salsa dancers (who don't drink, but will happily pay the cover charge) [2] Latino party animals (who will spend a lot on drinks, add to atmosphere if not too drunk, but will generally be reluctant to pay at the door...."my cousin is the DJ" or "my uncle plays in the band").

The most successful salsa club we've experienced in recent years was a 50/50 mix of the above. The music? Live salsa dura band with DJs playing salsa/merengue/cumbia earlier, then latin pop/R&B/hip-hop with live rap later. Hardcore salseros/as would show up early, get their fix, go home. Then the younger crowd (who love salsa but not yet dancing) would turn up & party til 3-4am. Then, if we crazy ones are still there, & the band members are in the mood, as we get kicked out of the club we would start a street rumba..........with whatever percussion avilable & whoever wanted to sing 'unplugged'. We dancers would dance to pure percussion/raw vocals :D !

* :oops: sorry, I am getting lost on my thoughts :oops: *

IMHO, Hip-Hop/R&B and Salsa/related latin rhythms all shared a common root of Afro beats. The base & percussions are also interchangable depending on the songs ( :oops: musicians in da house, please help me out with the similarities or correct me here!).

Hip-Hop/R&B has its place crossing over the Salsa/Latin genre; the exact percentage of each would be up to the clubs (who should be clear on the targeted clientel). The presence of Hip-hop/R&B could mean the survival of Salsa/Latin nights.

[cocodrilo]

We don't play any hip hop at our gigs, no one would stand for that, but if the Brazilians show up, we have to play samba(not ballroom samba, folks, CARNIVAL samba!). Boy is this tiring to dance to. These guys are all over the floor. The women SHAKE! It's great, but the salsa folk sit at the sidelines and yawn...
Gotta try to please everyone*shrug* :?

[squirrel]

Salsachinita, that's exactly what's happening in the most succesful club in my country. We have Thursdays, when they play a mixture of salsa, cumbia, bachata, merengue and cha cha mostly. Then Fridays they start with the above mix, then change to R&B, hip-hop and the rest, then oriental music, and then the above mix again... if salseros can make it until 2-3 am, then they get to dance to salsa again (mostly salsa this time). Saturdays they play very few salsa and the rest, it's mostly a normal mix for any disco... Salseros sometimes go on Saturdays, but bitch and moan all the time :)

[cocodrilo]

Salsachinita, that's exactly what's happening in the most succesful club in my country. We have Thursdays, when they play a mixture of salsa, cumbia, bachata, merengue and cha cha mostly. Then Fridays they start with the above mix, then change to R&B, hip-hop and the rest, then oriental music, and then the above mix again... if salseros can make it until 2-3 am, then they get to dance to salsa again (mostly salsa this time). Saturdays they play very few salsa and the rest, it's mostly a normal mix for any disco... Salseros sometimes go on Saturdays, but witch and moan all the time :)

Don't ya love how they censored your last sentence?
I was a vet and some of the assistants couldn't tell the difference between a bitch and a bull.

[squirrel]

Should I try to write something more 'offensive'? I wonder how they'll change that!

[Sagitta]

We don't play any hip hop at our gigs, no one would stand for that, but if the Brazilians show up, we have to play samba(not ballroom samba, folks, CARNIVAL samba!). Boy is this tiring to dance to. These guys are all over the floor. The women SHAKE! It's great, but the salsa folk sit at the sidelines and yawn...
Gotta try to please everyone*shrug* :?

Actually I don't mind a little Brazillian samba. I'l take that over the hip hop, as it reminds me more of African rhythmns, which Latin does too, but I still don't have the fortitude to shake/vibrate for a whole song. Oh just hearing those drums drives me wild!! :)

[borikensalsero]

Here in NY City a night advertised as Latin by a mainstream club means only one thing. 10 hours of hip hop/regeton/reggea and 1 salsa, 2 bachatas, and 3 merengues.

I haven't attended one of those clubs in about 4 years. I just can't handle the testosterone/estrogen filled atmosphere.

A latin club, ran by latinos, doesn't advertise their nights as anything, you know that if you show up. It will be 70% merengue, 15%bachata, 5% salsa, and the rest regeton, or any variation of hip hop/reggea.

When an event is advertised as salsa, there will only be salsa playing, with the occasional cha cha. While it is hard to start up a new salsa only venue, we still have a few that are very strong and have been so for years. It is absolutely great to go to these places. Everyone can dance, and there is only salsa. The testosterone/estrogen isn’t there! The places really don’t make that much money, but because the rest of their nights are for mainstream audiences they make up for the lack of money coming in the rest of the night.

[pygmalion]

Don't ya love how they censored your last sentence?
I was a vet and some of the assistants couldn't tell the difference between a witch and a bull. I'm pretty sure it happens automatically in the software.

Um. What was the topic again? Hip hop? I'm pretty sure there's a really long older thread about that where brujo and borikensalsero give lots of cool historial info. I'll have to dig it up.

Unfortunately for those who hate it, I think it'll be around a while, and, at least at the moment, it's paying the bills for a lot of clubs. :? It's been coming quite a while -- how long has dancehall reggae been mainstream? Fifteen years, give or take? Reggaeton is just the same music with lyrics in Spanish, so I don't think it's just going to shrivel up and disappear anytime soon. Gotta find a way to live together, unless you're lucky, like boriken, and have the "in" at all the cool salsa-only places in NYC. :wink: 8)

[SDsalsaguy]

Don't ya love how they censored your last sentence?
I was a vet and some of the assistants couldn't tell the difference between a witch and a bull. I'm pretty sure it happens automatically in the software.
Yes, and as Jenn says, the word filters are a built in, automated function.

[pygmalion]

Here's that older thread. What's the deal with salsa and hip-hop? (http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=1188)

[tj]

On a related (but different) note, one of the local studios had a fund raiser last Friday for their upcoming trip to the Puerto Rico Salsa Congress. They invited 3 hip hop troupes to perform. Some pretty amazing athletic stuff, and each group had it's own style.

I enjoyed watching the performances, but it did re-affirm why I like partner dancing as I can't picture myself flopping about on the floor, doing handstands and the like.

I also like how mixing styles brings in new influences and new talent, although I don't like when a salsa night turns into a night of mixed music.

[Vin]

I have been to many of the above "latin nights" and have even organized some with some clubs.
Clubs don't make money on salsa, but worse they don't give it a chance. I organized one such night on thursdays at a local place, this place got no business on thursdays(why we targeted them), they should have been glad to have us. But what happened, they would change the music from the salsa we brought to hip hop at 11, it was hilarious to see the club empty as fast as it did. I kept trying to convince them that if they gave it a chance they would make more money than they were making and they did but they steadfastly refused to have a latin night past 11.
I have also seen all out salsa nights and let me tell you, if you organize a party, even here in sw virginia, and the people know for sure they can depend on a good mix of salsa, merengue and bachata, you will have a great party with people spending money.
The problem gets worse since many salsa dancers don't even want to go to a party if they are not sure it will have a decent mix of salsa. They become unwilling to try "unfamiliar" parties since they have been burned by too many bad parties.

[ShyDancer]

The most successful salsa club we've experienced in recent years was a 50/50 mix of the above. The music? Live salsa dura band with DJs playing salsa/merengue/cumbia earlier, then latin pop/R&B/hip-hop with live rap later. Hardcore salseros/as would show up early, get their fix, go home. Then the younger crowd (who love salsa but not yet dancing) would turn up & party til 3-4am. Then, if we crazy ones are still there, & the band members are in the mood, as we get kicked out of the club we would start a street rumba..........with whatever percussion avilable & whoever wanted to sing 'unplugged'. We dancers would dance to pure percussion/raw vocals :D !




Ok I really gotta get myself some more salsa lessons!
Thats sounds awesome :D


I havent experienced much of the Salsa club scene. I wouldnt mind dancing to hip hop/RnB in between .. the RnB club scenec is where I did all my dancing before discovering the much more exciting world of Latin and ballroom dancing!

[youngsta]

I havent experienced much of the Salsa club scene. I wouldnt mind dancing to hip hop/RnB in between .. the RnB club scenec is where I did all my dancing before discovering the much more exciting world of Latin and ballroom dancing!
Not me, and RnB and Hip-Hop are my first love. It's just a totally different mentality. When I'm in the mindset to dance RnB/House/Hip-Hop I don't even wanna hear anything related to salsa and vice versa. I guess I'm a musical Jeckyl and Hyde!

[cocodrilo]

I havent experienced much of the Salsa club scene. I wouldnt mind dancing to hip hop/RnB in between .. the RnB club scenec is where I did all my dancing before discovering the much more exciting world of Latin and ballroom dancing!
Not me, and RnB and Hip-Hop are my first love. It's just a totally different mentality. When I'm in the mindset to dance RnB/House/Hip-Hop I don't even wanna hear anything related to salsa and vice versa. I guess I'm a musical Jeckyl and Hyde!

Right on, Youngsta! Variety is the spice of life! :D