Music for Cortinas

[Captain Jep]

I'm currently putting together a playlist and was thinking about cortinas. What have others chosen as music for the cortina breaks? I dont have any music editing software, so I have been looking for "mini tracks" that last about 30 seconds duration.

So far my preferred one is :

0.28 - Texas/White on Blonde (does it have a name?)

but I've also found a cute one that Im going to use for tea dances :

Apple Pie - Judy Dunlop & Ashley Hutchings/Sway With Me

Any other ideas?

[opendoor]

Hi CJ, I use this redundant salsa practice piece (http://www.salsa-merengue.co.uk/Resource/Pract40.mp3), that I found here (http://www.salsa-merengue.co.uk/) (among a lot of other useful ear training tracks and tutorials). Next time I will use one of the clave or bongo files....

OD

[Dave Bailey]

"Convoy" :)

[Joe]

Sir Mix-A-Lot?

[Captain Jep]

"Convoy" :)

:rolleyes: I did say music without an edit ...

[bordertangoman]

how about Puff the Magic Dragon as sung by Marlene Dietrich- yes she did! - in German
or Captain Beefheart's Bat Chain Puller

so what model of cortina do you drive?

[Captain Jep]

You've brought back a memory - I have heard "Puff the Magic Dragon" at a milonga before... might have been one of Steve's ...

"Escort - dunno mate - police car innit ?" ("The Professionals" )

[bordertangoman]

You've brought back a memory - I have heard "Puff the Magic Dragon" at a milonga before... might have been one of Steve's ...

"Escort - dunno mate - police car innit ?" ("The Professionals" )

"Oi- You're nicked!" mine's a Granada- The Sweeney "Guvna"

there's a thought; Police tv theme tunes as cortinas: hawaii-5-0; sweeney z-cars, persuaders, avengers,
department s, hill street blues; plus Blockbuster by The Sweet

[Tango Bellingham]

... I dont have any music editing software...


Free music editing software: http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

Easy-to-use, graphical interface - it's what most DJs I know use.

For cortinas, I use the first 40s of Tangerine Dream's "Love on a Real Train,"
or the first 40s of a Pat Martino-Gil Goldstein duet (jazz guitar and electric piano) from their "We'll Be Together Again" album - I can't recall the name of the specific track. If you want, I can post them to my website - you're certainly welcome to use them.

[Captain Jep]

Free music editing software: http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

Easy-to-use, graphical interface - it's what most DJs I know use.

For cortinas, I use the first 40s of Tangerine Dream's "Love on a Real Train,"
or the first 40s of a Pat Martino-Gil Goldstein duet (jazz guitar and electric piano) from their "We'll Be Together Again" album - I can't recall the name of the specific track. If you want, I can post them to my website - you're certainly welcome to use them.

Excellent! Thanks TB. Have downloaded. Looks good - now to read the documentation....

DB, we have a Convoy!

PS Yes please do post those tracks - the more options the better...
PPS Thanks OpenDoor for your recommendation as well

[Tango Bellingham]

Captain Jep, I PM-d you with the URLs for the cortinas. Enjoy!

[jantango]

If you have been to Salon Canning on Tuesdays when Demian Boggio is in charge of the music, you hear a different cortina after every tanda which is pumped up very loud. He has only a few years experience in the milongas and was never told how cortinas were played. He blasts the music so that you have to shout to someone at your table in order to be heard.

I learned from milongueros that the cortinas were very low level, nondanceable music to clear the floor. The last thing you want is for dancers to stay on the floor because they like the hustle or cha cha you're playing.

The tandas in the downtown confiterias of Buenos Aires were several minutes long. Can you believe it? Yes, there was no rush to get up and dance again. Men didn't want to sweat. They had to wear suits all year long, even during the hot summers without air-conditioning. The cortina was time to cool down, have a cigarette and/or a drink.


"Golden Age of the Milongas" 2/01/09 Tango Chamuyo

[hbboogie1]

If you have been to Salon Canning on Tuesdays when Demian Boggio is in charge of the music, you hear a different cortina after every tanda which is pumped up very loud. He has only a few years experience in the milongas and was never told how cortinas were played. He blasts the music so that you have to shout to someone at your table in order to be heard.

I learned from milongueros that the cortinas were very low level, nondanceable music to clear the floor. The last thing you want is for dancers to stay on the floor because they like the hustle or cha cha you're playing.

The tandas in the downtown confiterias of Buenos Aires were several minutes long. Can you believe it? Yes, there was no rush to get up and dance again. Men didn't want to sweat. They had to wear suits all year long, even during the hot summers without air-conditioning. The cortina was time to cool down, have a cigarette and/or a drink.


"Golden Age of the Milongas" 2/01/09 Tango Chamuyo

In BsAs those who dance during the cortinas are considered idiotas (idiots)

[Captain Jep]

If you have been to Salon Canning on Tuesdays when Demian Boggio is in charge of the music, you hear a different cortina ....

"Golden Age of the Milongas" 2/01/09 Tango Chamuyo

Fascinating stuff, JT. Yes unbelievable.

It was probably also the era when everybody wore a vest under their shirt - no matter what the weather was like :)

[Joe]

How do you deal with the tangueros who dance tango to anything?

[Peaches]

Well, we do know it's a cortina, and what it's for.

But, really, who cares? So two people stay standing to dance a few bars to something different. Does it hurt anyone? Happens with some frequency around here...no one seems to care.

[Dave Bailey]

How do you deal with the tangueros who dance tango to anything?
Why do you have to "deal with" them? Are they hurting anyone? :confused:

[dchester]

How do you deal with the tangueros who dance tango to anything?
If it really bothers you, then select cortinas that are undanceable. I've used the drum solo from the 60's song Wipeout, as a cortina leading into a milonga tanda.

[Tango Bellingham]

How do you deal with the tangueros who dance tango to anything?

Are you referring to people who dance to or stay on the dance floor during the cortinas? I've seen two approaches out in the real world: 1) if it's a newbie and their teacher never bothered to explain the concept to them, the DJ or host explains to them in private that you clear the floor during the cortina; and 2) if it's people who should know better or who are just being jerks, do what a DJ buddy of mine in Vancouver, BC does - just keep playing the cortina for as long as there are people on the dance floor. Eventually even the most obtuse or rebellious individual will get the idea that they're holding up the fun for the rest of the group and get a clue.

If it's just people who want to dance to Hernando's Hideaway, ballroom tango music, or weird alternative stuff, get them their own milonga. That way they get to play in their sandbox, and we get to play in ours. :D

[bordertangoman]

If it really bothers you, then select cortinas that are undanceable. I've used the drum solo from the 60's song Wipeout, as a cortina leading into a milonga tanda.

Now that is throwing down the gauntlet;

I would try to dance to that (even if without a partner) ;)

I think Cortinas are a waste of good dancing time and the tanda starts from when I ask a woman to dance not the DJ's selection. I would regard it as unchivalrous not to have three dances with a woman and if s a cortina comes along I wouldnt move on to another partner.

[Tango Bellingham]

Well, we do know it's a cortina, and what it's for.

But, really, who cares? So two people stay standing to dance a few bars to something different. Does it hurt anyone? Happens with some frequency around here...no one seems to care.

Of course it doesn't "hurt" anyone - it just marks the individual as a) a newbie who wasn't taught any better, which is forgivable and easily remedied; or b) Rebel Without A Clue, somebody who does know better but is ignoring convention to "make a statement." Whatever....:rolleyes:

[Peaches]

or c)someone who "knows better," and is ignoring convention because there's music which is too good to sit down to and you've just got to move to. Who's got time for making statements?

[hbboogie1]

Now that is throwing down the gauntlet;

I would try to dance to that (even if without a partner) ;)

I think Cortinas are a waste of good dancing time and the tanda starts from when I ask a woman to dance not the DJ's selection. I would regard it as unchivalrous not to have three dances with a woman and if s a cortina comes along I wouldnt move on to another partner.

Another reason for the cortina is to give everyone a chance to dance with everyone. Haven't you ever seen someone get a lady out on the floor and hold her hostage forever not allowing her to return to her table?
I've witnessed two men handing a lady back and fourth like a tag team wrestling match, this could never happen in BsAs...Why? Cortinas.
If you have cortinas and you dance with someone new you have three or four dances of the same pace and style to get comfortable dancing with that person. Without cortinas you might really enjoy dancing a slow tango with someone new and just can't wait for the next song and S....! it's "Tango Negro"
PS
Half of the milongas in LA have no Cortinas and I do attend, It's still a milonga and I love to dance however without cortinas a milonga resembles a ballroom dance one song after another with about five seconds in between making it imposable to clear the floor before another song starts. Most women get grabbed before the can get off the floor. Too much chaos.

[Tango Bellingham]

Half of the milongas in LA have no Cortinas and I do attend, It's still a milonga...

Nope - it's a practica disguised as a milonga. ;)
Daniel Trenner used to say he didn't think there were any milongas in the USA, just practicas. Wonder what he says now?

...however without cortinas a milonga resembles a ballroom dance one song after another with about five seconds in between making it imposable to clear the floor before another song starts. Most women get grabbed before the can get off the floor. Too much chaos.

"Your Honor, the Prosecution rests..." :)

[bordertangoman]

Another reason for the cortina is to give everyone a chance to dance with everyone. Haven't you ever seen someone get a lady out on the floor and hold her hostage forever not allowing her to return to her table?.


i have seen couples dance for more than three dances. I cant say that either was hostage and I've seen it happen whether there were cortinas played or not. I regard your argument as unsound; People are aware of tandas and the custom of dancing three dances with a partner; and they either do it or they dont or maybe they have four or five dances; or more I think it more likely that a good lead be held "hostage" than a woman

[hbboogie1]

i have seen couples dance for more than three dances. I cant say that either was hostage and I've seen it happen whether there were cortinas played or not. I regard your argument as unsound; People are aware of tandas and the custom of dancing three dances with a partner; and they either do it or they dont or maybe they have four or five dances; or more I think it more likely that a good lead be held "hostage" than a woman

you miss my point or rather the point of the cortinas and tandas
Lets assume the tanda is tango with 4 songs.

Dance only one song and say "Thank you" This is rude and the meaning is I really don't like dancing with you.

Dance only the 4th song in the tanda...your an idiot because you really enjoyed dancing with each other but the tandas over and you must part company.

Dance two songs and say Thank you is polite but sends the message that you didn't enjoy it that much.(unless you didn't start dancing until the 3rd song then it's all good)

Dance all 4 songs and really enjoy your partner say Thank you and sit down giving someone else an opportunity to dance with that person.

As you can now see there are a lot things going on with cortinas and tandas that you probably never knew. All of these rules were made in BsAs a long time ago. Some to protect the "Macho" men from being embarrassed in front of everyone. I think the main reason for the tandas and cortinas was because there weren't enough women and rules had to be made so everyone had a fair shot at scoring.

The more I'm exposed to the tango world the more I'm amazed at how many codes there are ( in BsAs ) of course.
PS
My wife is Argentine and she helps when it comes to interpreting all the codes.

[Captain Jep]

I think we're all aware of what the cortina is about, thanks.

So - any other favoured pieces for cortinas?

[Peaches]

I wish I had my iPod with me...and functional. There was one song by a Turkish singer that I heard used a while ago, and it was great (albeit danceable ;) ). I'll have to look that up.

I don't like cortinas that start off too quietly. There was one used a while ago (some Jimi Hendrix song--great song, lousy cortina) which was so hard to hear at first that no one could tell right off if there was a problem with the sound system or if the cortina was starting.

[dchester]

Another reason for the cortina is to give everyone a chance to dance with everyone. Haven't you ever seen someone get a lady out on the floor and hold her hostage forever not allowing her to return to her table?
No, I haven't. But then again, I'm usually too busy dancing to worry about who else is dancing with who and for how long. When I'm taking a tanda off to rest, I'll look around, but I spend as much time to look at who isn't dancing as well as who is dancing. It would seem that if you want to give every one a chance, I would think you'd be focusing on who isn't dancing, rather than who is already dancing.

I'll admit that occasionally I'll ask someone to dance on the last song of a tanda (after resting during most of the tanda), and then during the cortina either one of us might commit the sin of asking the other if we want to do the next tanda. I find that this works best with three song tandas.

[dchester]

I think we're all aware of what the cortina is about, thanks.

So - any other favoured pieces for cortinas?
One I like is the intro to the Michael Jackson song, Billy Jean.

[Tango Bellingham]

So - any other favoured pieces for cortinas?

Go on iTunes, iTunes Store, search for "Conjunto Berretin". The album you're looking for is Tangamente. Alex has two cortinas, Hip-Hop Cortina, and Cambalache Cortina. They're both good, but Hip-Hop might encourage the clueless and RWACs to dance, while Cambalache is a dirge with Alex doing his famous throat-singing to the words of Cambalache.

Think of those Tibeten monks singing, "El mundo fue y será una porquería, ya lo se..." - too funny. :)

[Captain Jep]

Go on iTunes, iTunes Store, search for "Conjunto Berretin". The album you're looking for is Tangamente. Alex has two cortinas, Hip-Hop Cortina, and Cambalache Cortina. They're both good, but Hip-Hop might encourage the clueless and RWACs to dance, while Cambalache is a dirge with Alex doing his famous throat-singing to the words of Cambalache.

Think of those Tibeten monks singing, "El mundo fue y será una porquería, ya lo se..." - too funny. :)

Agree with both your remarks. The dirge though - it would make me think I was being tortured by a bunch of Greek Orthodox monks ....

[Tango Bellingham]

Agree with both your remarks. The dirge though - it would make me think I was being tortured by a bunch of Greek Orthodox monks ....

Yeah, but it sure would clear the floor fast.... :raisebro:

[Angel HI]

Another reason for the cortina is to give everyone a chance to dance with everyone. Haven't you ever seen someone get a lady out on the floor and hold her hostage forever not allowing her to return to her table?This has little to do w/ cortina, and more to do w/ lack of class.
you miss my point or rather the point of the cortinas and tandas
Lets assume the tanda is tango with 4 songs.

Dance only one song and say "Thank you" This is rude and the meaning is I really don't like dancing with you.

Dance only the 4th song in the tanda...your an idiot because you really enjoyed dancing with each other but the tandas over and you must part company.

Dance two songs and say Thank you is polite but sends the message that you didn't enjoy it that much.(unless you didn't start dancing until the 3rd song then it's all good)This has been debated to death, but these codes are only applicable in BsAs and such. They mean nothing here. These same persons will; leave a milonga, go to a salsa dance, dance one dance and thank the lady and think nothing of it. The codes here are for pretense, only. I say play dancable cortinas; this gives the individuals the options of thanking/leaving, resting, or dancing.
The more I'm exposed to the tango world the more I'm amazed at how many codes there are ( in BsAs ) of course.
Exactly my point.

[Joe]

One I like is the intro to the Michael Jackson song, Billy Jean.
So you can give the Westies a chance to dance?

[Dave Bailey]

This has been debated to death, but these codes are only applicable in BsAs and such. They mean nothing here.
Exactly.

We should have this statement framed.

[bordertangoman]

Exactly.

We should have this statement framed.

and then have a cortina of the complete 20 minute cortina of Mahakala (the fierce manifestation of Avalokiteshvara, the Bodhisattva of absolute compassion) chanted by Buddhist monks
bringing compassion to those who havnt had enough dances, to those who hate traditional or alternative music; for those whom tango is an escape from a dreary existence; for the lonely hearts with no companion in search of love and for those who thought they were coming to a salsa night but wrote it down wrong in their diary.

[Tango Bellingham]

Exactly.

We should have this statement framed.

Fine, whatever. :rolleyes: Then don't call it Argentine tango, because it's not, and don't call it a milonga, because it's not. Do what the Finns did - come up with your own version, call it "UK non-ballroom tango", play whatever music you want, do whatever you want, whenever you want, no line of dance, no tandas, no cortinas, and the folks in the US can call it "Yankee non-ballroom tango", and the folks south of the Mason-Dixon can call it "Southern non-ballroom tango", and here in Bellingham they can call it "Hamster tango" (they already do), and then everybody's happy. It's all a "sliding chain of signifiers," right? :tongue:

Just remember, like the man said:

Pensalo bien,
antes de dar ese paso,
que tal vez mañana acaso
no puedas retroceder.

[Tango Bellingham]

and then have a cortina of the complete 20 minute cortina of Mahakala (the fierce manifestation of Avalokiteshvara, the Bodhisattva of absolute compassion) chanted by Buddhist monks
bringing compassion to those who havnt had enough dances, to those who hate traditional or alternative music; for those whom tango is an escape from a dreary existence; for the lonely hearts with no companion in search of love and for those who thought they were coming to a salsa night but wrote it down wrong in their diary.

And then Manjusri can drop by and whack everybody with his Sword of Discriminating Wisdom, and Mara will be defeated, and everyone will spontaneosly chant, "Canaro, D'Arienzo, Di Sarli, Troilo, Pugliese, OM". :)

[hbboogie1]

[QUOTE=Tango Bellingham;694627]Fine, whatever. :rolleyes: Then don't call it Argentine tango, because it's not, and don't call it a milonga, because it's not. Do what the Finns did - come up with your own version, call it "UK non-ballroom tango", play whatever music you want, do whatever you want, whenever you want, no line of dance, no tandas, no cortinas, and the folks in the US can call it "Yankee non-ballroom tango", and the folks south of the Mason-Dixon can call it "Southern non-ballroom tango", and here in Bellingham they can call it "Hamster tango" (they already do), and then everybody's happy. It's all a "sliding chain of signifiers," right? :tongue:

Oh! so you've visited L.A.

[dchester]

Fine, whatever. :rolleyes: Then don't call it Argentine tango, because it's not, and don't call it a milonga, because it's not. Do what the Finns did - come up with your own version, call it "UK non-ballroom tango", play whatever music you want, do whatever you want, whenever you want, no line of dance, no tandas, no cortinas, and the folks in the US can call it "Yankee non-ballroom tango", and the folks south of the Mason-Dixon can call it "Southern non-ballroom tango", and here in Bellingham they can call it "Hamster tango" (they already do), and then everybody's happy. It's all a "sliding chain of signifiers," right? :tongue:

Oh! so you've visited L.A.
Until I saw no tandas and no cortinas, I thought they meant Boston.

[Dave Bailey]

Fine, whatever. :rolleyes:
Oooh, a ":rolleyes:"; I haven't had one of those in ages. I'll add that to the frame.

Then don't call it Argentine tango, because it's not,
And you get to decide this because...?

and don't call it a milonga, because it's not.
And you get to decide this because...?

Do what the Finns did
What, drink a lot you mean?

Or maybe you know something I don't? (http://www.jivetango.co.uk/Reviews/FinnishSnowTango.html)

come up with your own version, call it "UK non-ballroom tango", play whatever music you want, do whatever you want, whenever you want, no line of dance, no tandas, no cortinas,
Ah, you've been to Negracha's then?

EDIT: blast, beaten to it... :(

On a semi-serious note, are you really stating that every single one of the codes and conventions in BsAs must be copied exactly before you can call AT "Argentine Tango" anywhere else?

Are you, in short, attempting to define an AT trademark?

[bordertangoman]

No for it to be Argentine tango, as the taxi driver in "the Tango Lesson" says to know tango you have to suffer; you have to know the absolute loneliness of being a male immigrant in a new land where there is a shortage of women; you have to know the soul dispairing abandonment of an infant who has no concept of time whos cries are ignored until he stops crying and his wordless feeling is of total angstian nihilism.


The codigos are merely a middle class convention of reduicng the coarse behaviour of the barrios

[Tango Bellingham]

Oooh, a ":rolleyes:"; I haven't had one of those in ages. I'll add that to the frame.

Cool! Glad to be of service!


And you get to decide this because...?
Because I'm not a post-modernist, and I think this whole twaddle about the observer getting to decide what the "meaning" of something is and that their interpretation is just as valid as the original creator's (or creators, in this case) is bovine fecal matter. "Sliding chain of signifiers" - feh! It's their ball, their bat, their rules.

Why can't we (Americans, and apparently, UK also) accept that maybe, just maybe those Italian/German/British/Jewish/French/half-a-dozen-other immigrants figured out something after futzing around with this dance for close to a hundred years? Don't you think maybe they worked out the kinks, and we might try doing it their way first? And maybe, even after it's all said and done, that it's not really the dancing that's important, but the music? (everybody really should rent Si Sos Brujo and watch it] The dancing is just an afterthought.


On a semi-serious note, are you really stating that every single one of the codes and conventions in BsAs must be copied exactly before you can call AT "Argentine Tango" anywhere else?

As jazz trumpeter Clark Terry said, "Imitate, Assimilate, Innovate." For some reason (maybe it's our imperialist past, or just rampant narcissistic baby-boomerism), we tend to skip over the "Imitate, Assimilate" part and go straight to the "Innovate" , which usually translates "do it the same way we do everything else."


Are you, in short, attempting to define an AT trademark?
No, I believe the legalistic expression is something like, "preventing dilution of the trademark".

I really don't care what they do on Dancing With The Stars, or that people want to dance to cortinas, or alternative music, or do lifts, whatever. It's a free universe. Just call it "Pottsylvanian clog-dancing", and "Pottsylvanian clog-dancing party" or something other than "Argentine tango" and "milonga".

That way the public doesn't get confused.

[Dave Bailey]

No for it to be Argentine tango, as the taxi driver in "the Tango Lesson" says to know tango you have to suffer; you have to know the absolute loneliness of being a male immigrant in a new land where there is a shortage of women; you have to know the soul dispairing abandonment of an infant who has no concept of time whos cries are ignored until he stops crying and his wordless feeling is of total angstian nihilism.
Sounds exactly like where I work actually...

[Dave Bailey]

Because I'm not a post-modernist, and I think this whole twaddle about the observer getting to decide what the "meaning" of something is and that their interpretation is just as valid as the original creator's (or creators, in this case) is bovine fecal matter. "Sliding chain of signifiers" - feh! It's their ball, their bat, their rules.
So following that logic, presumably you think the Argentines should refer to football as English Football? And they should play it exactly the way the English do? Otherwise it can't be called football?

Why can't we (Americans, and apparently, UK also) accept that maybe, just maybe those Italian/German/British/Jewish/French/half-a-dozen-other immigrants figured out something after futzing around with this dance for close to a hundred years? Don't you think maybe they worked out the kinks, and we might try doing it their way first? And maybe, even after it's all said and done, that it's not really the dancing that's important, but the music? (everybody really should rent Si Sos Brujo and watch it] The dancing is just an afterthought.
Why can't these Argentines accept that English people invented football and that we've been playing it for longer and therefore we've a God-given right to define exactly how it's played?

[dchester]

So following that logic, presumably you think the Argentines should refer to football as English Football? And they should play it exactly the way the English do? Otherwise it can't be called football?

Why can't these Argentines accept that English people invented football and that we've been playing it for longer and therefore we've a God-given right to define exactly how it's played?
In the states, we solved that by called it soccer.

:twisted:

[Tango Bellingham]

So following that logic, presumably you think the Argentines should refer to football as English Football? And they should play it exactly the way the English do? Otherwise it can't be called football?

Why can't these Argentines accept that English people invented football and that we've been playing it for longer and therefore we've a God-given right to define exactly how it's played?

You'll get no argument from me there, although I think we're stretching the analogy almost to the breaking point. :raisebro:

But let's look at it this way - I don't know what constitutes quintessentially English pub behavior, but I'll guess darts is pretty important, right?

Now let's say a bunch of Americans come strolling into a pub, order Bud Light (and then berate the bartender when he says he doesn't have any), and decide they're going to play darts. Since they're Americans and not British, they tell you they're going to replace the board in your pub with a larger one, because "that's how we play darts in America."

They then tell you they're going to move the oche (did I get that right?) a foot closer, again because "that's the way we do it in America."

They then make fun of you and your friends for playing darts the way you and everyone else has played darts since the dawn of time.

Now, assuming that by this time they're still alive and haven't been stomped to death by an irate mob, they then leave and return to America, where they open training centers and teach classes on the "British Way to play darts." And make videos, which are bought and consumed by other Americans who say, "hey, we're playing British darts!" These consumers then decide that they too will teach classes on British darts, but they change a few things, "because that's how we do it in Oklahoma," etc.

Or back to our original scenario, let's say that these aforementioned Americans didn't go to a real British pub, but merely watched some British dart players on TV, or went to see an exhibition of British dart players, and then opened training centers and started teaching classes, making videos, etc.

Now, as a bona-fide British person, wouldn't you be shaking your head by now?

Now, change the scenario. These Americans walk into your pub, introduce themselves, maybe buy you and your friends a round of drinks, and then ask, very politely, "would you please teach us how to play darts?" And after practicing for a few years, they come back and ask, "are we doing it right? And is it ok if we show some of our friends how to play like this?"

Now what's your reaction?

That's how I feel about the matter. :)

[Captain Jep]

And this relates to "Music for Cortinas" how?

That aside, I dont really see the point to your analogy. Let's say some Americans came in and tried to change pub darts. Well they are doing that in my country, not their own. But they can do what the hell they like in the States. I might still shake my head but why should I get annoyed? All they're doing is adapting a foreign tradition to their own local culture.

In the same way we adapt tango culture to our own local culture. And we'll call milongas milongas if we feel like it.As DB says the word isnt trademarked. And even if it was is it really worth making a fuss about?

[Tango Bellingham]

And this relates to "Music for Cortinas" how?

Avast, matey! We be Forum Pirates and we've hijacked your thread! We're holding it for ransom, har! :bandit:
Sorry about that - the issue just acquired a life of its own.


All they're doing is adapting a foreign tradition to their own local culture.

Just like the Finns did, and now they call it Finnish tango, not Argentine.


In the same way we adapt tango culture to our own local culture. And we'll call milongas milongas if we feel like it.


Sounds like you're from Texas, like me. That's the Texas-bar-fight-attitude I alluded to in another post. :)


As DB says the word isnt trademarked. And even if it was is it really worth making a fuss about?

Spoken like a true post-modernist. But we've digressed enough....

And sorry about hijacking your thread - I hope the cortinas I sent you help make up for it. [there's no smiley for "sheepish grin"]

[Angel HI]

Fine, whatever. Then don't call it Argentine tango, because it's not, and don't call it a milonga, because it's not. You severely miss the point. It is argentine tango with all of its passion, intensity, emotion, drive, sensuality, and physicality; with all of its communication, lead and follow ability.

Yes, the AT is a dance, born and driven of, from, and by its music. Yet, the tango is not only its music. It is an innate essence as individual as it is universal, and can be found in many places.

[Dave Bailey]

In the states, we solved that by called it soccer.

:twisted:
Well, then obviously you shouldn't be allowed to play it. Or something. I admit, I can't be bothered to pursue the analogy.

My point, to the extent I had one, is this: some things about AT are intrinsic, some are not.

And I think it's reasonable to question whether - for example - codes of conduct worked out in sweaty brothels in South America a century ago (or whatever) apply 100% to dance venues in London in the 21st century.

Perhaps they do. But, just maybe, there are some adjustments needed to recognise - for example - the fact that there aren't 50 women to each man in London, or that women have achieved some measure of equality and empowerment of the past century. So maybe the world of AT wouldn't collapse if, for example, women asked men to dance?

As to what this has to do with the topic - damn-all. But then, our topics do wander off a lot...

[Captain Jep]

So maybe the world of AT wouldn't collapse if, for example, women asked men to dance?

..

Dunno - then we'd have to discover whether we really are popular as dancers or not ... :p

[bordertangoman]

Dunno - then we'd have to discover whether we really are popular as dancers or not ... :p

as soon as enough women learn to lead we're dead meat mate!

[Angel HI]

^ :)