Dress codes at your salsa clubs?

[salsachinita]

Inspired by all these talks about jeans and whether or not people dress up to go dancing, I am just wondering.......

What's the dress code at your local salsa clubs, or clubs you have visited...?

Our clubs used to be more dressed up, no jeans, runners (sneakers) etc. This seems to have eased with the popularity of 'streetwear' trends over the years. Now, apart from special functions or 'dressy' venues, most salsa clubs don't seem to enforce a dress code (of course, within reasons).

*some of these 'streetwear' (read: designer casuals) do, and often cost more than 'dressy' items :shock: !*

The other reason for this casualisation is because of our Aussie laid-back attitude....it's just not a dress-up-formally kind of culture. So our clubs may be a bit more tolerant compared to other majar cities, me thinks :? .

It can actually be very uncool to over-dress in many clubs here :shock: .....

As TJ said in one of the other threads, a girl was refused entry at Mayan for wearing baggy jeans. I remember seeing signs at places like Copa (NYC) & Mayan (LA) stating "No khakis, no baggies, no jeans, no sneakers, no team colours etc. etc"

So let's share this information here! We DF members like to go salsa dancing in other cities. I can't think of anything worse than getting refused entry because we didn't know the dress code :roll: !

[Sabor]

we dont have any particular dress code here.. its left to everyones own scale of what works and what doesn't.. so, so long as one is not naked they'll go thru.. yet if someone looks obviously dirty or offensive in any hygenic way they'll not pass.. logically.

personally, i prefer no code because its simply takes away from my freedom of dressing the way i like at that particular moment in time.. hence we rely on the existence of a minumum general awareness of eticate and carrying oneself any where public.. plus .. it gives u an added insight to how people are, partially, over time, when they act on their fashio impulse..

that said.. i always prefer the the feminine sexy dress on a salsera over other stuff beause it just gives added boost to my energy somehow.. pants are be cool of course.. with their varying cuts, material and colors but not most of the time.. in my view.. leave the pants for guys :wink: it suits them more :lol:

[Jack]

I always dress up, Its just the way I go out..I feel comfortable anywhere like this.

[squirrel]

In the club where I go, there is no dress code... anybody can choose their clothing...

I like dressing up, but sometimes I go in jeans... still, never sneakers...

:)

[cocodrilo]

In Japan, no rules at all. Most people here tend to get cold easily, so you'll notice a lot of people in long-sleeved shirts at the dance clubs(be it hip hop or latin), while I'm sweating my butt of in a skimpy camisole...

My rule of thumb when going ANYWHERE-
It's better to be overdressed than underdressed! :D

[ketchup]

Most people here tend to get cold easily,

I never realized that :lol: , although I am one of those. :wink:

[squirrel]

In Japan, no rules at all. Most people here tend to get cold easily, so you'll notice a lot of people in long-sleeved shirts at the dance clubs(be it hip hop or latin), while I'm sweating my butt of in a skimpy camisole...

My rule of thumb when going ANYWHERE-
It's better to be overdressed than underdressed! :D

Well said, cocodrilo... I also prefer being overdressed! :roll:

[Sabor]

so long as no one else wears lime-green socks.. its fine by me, cause thats my look :mrgreen:

[squirrel]

Sabor... I knew your taste had to include some lime... don't know why, but it sure fits you :lol: :roll: :lol:

[Sabor]

i'm not sure .. but i'll take that as a compliment, with but a squeeze of lime :lol:

[salsachinita]

so long as no one else wears lime-green socks.. its fine by me, cause thats my look :mrgreen:

:idea: I have a lime dress that would match your socks real well :lol: !

[borikensalsero]

Here in Manhattan there isn't really, per se, a salsa club, well, the Wild Palm in the bronx is probably the only one left. Here we have mainstream clubs that dedicate a given night of the week to salsa.

The Copa isn't seen as a salsa club, nor a dance club any longer. So you must be "presentable" to go there. No Jeans, No baggie clothing, no cut off sleeves for males, no sneakers, etc.

The nights that are meant for Salsa Dancers, not latin night, but Pure 100% know how salsa/mambo dancing, are casual. Even if advertise as dress to impress you can wear jeans. That is if it isn't a Friday or Saturday Night at a Mainstream club which has a side room to dedicate to us dancers. Then you must adhere to the rules of dress with "taste".

Socials, you pretty much dress like you are going to the beach, the gym, it doesn't matter, you wear whatever you desire.

Personaly, you won't catch me dead dress down dancing even to the beach. I am more comfortable dressing up whenever I dance. Sweat-pants, jeans, or a T shirt, Tank Top, aren't comfortable to me. But put me in a pair of slacks, a button down shirt and I'm as comfortable as the guy in the sweat pants and the T-shirt.

[danceguy]

The few places in my area for Salsa list the dress code as the following:

"No sports hats or clothing, classy attire required."
"Dress code enforced."
And some clearly say "No jeans." or simply "Dress code."

Honestly, I've never any of these venues really enforce this, but most of the more serious dancers do dress up a bit. I always go in dark dress slacks and a matching dress shirt with a white tee underneath, and my trusty soft soled dancing shoes. I like to dress up a bit...as well as observing good hygiene, it gives me a bit more confidence in myself. ;)

I see some folks in jeans now and then, more with ladies than guys. I do wish that more of the ladies wore dresses... :D :banana:

SG

[tj]

i'm not sure .. but i'll take that as a compliment, with but a squeeze of lime :lol:

Lime? Did someone say lime?

Bartender, mojitos all around! :D

[tj]

In Seattle, there's no dress code. Even when a place advertises it, I've never seen anyone get turned away.

In Denver, I never had any issues except for Alex at La Rumba not liking it when I'd walk in wearing my Blochs. It was perfectly ok for me to bring in a small backpack with them inside, and just wear nice shoes at the entrance.

At a club in Chicago, I got turned away because I was wearing black jeans.

At one club in NYC, they enforced a "no jeans" policy. It was ok, since I called ahead of time and already knew.

Personally, I like it when people dress up. I won't wear anything particularly fancy, but I will wear my nicer clothes in general.

[mellody43]

In Seattle, there's no dress code. Even when a place advertises it, I've never seen anyone get turned away.


Personally, I like it when people dress up. I won't wear anything particularly fancy, but I will wear my nicer clothes in general.

TJ -- would you believe that Jorge got turned away from Beso for wearing some sort of sleeveless shirt? At least, according to my friend. Weird. Eep! Also, most places don't allow any kind of hats on the guys.

I like to see that people have taken some sort of effort to look nice. Generally the women are okay, but I've seen some guys out there and thought to myself -- that's how he presents himself at his BEST? for going out? Eeeesh. *shrug* You don't need to spend a lot of money to look decent.

[tj]

In Seattle, there's no dress code. Even when a place advertises it, I've never seen anyone get turned away.

Personally, I like it when people dress up. I won't wear anything particularly fancy, but I will wear my nicer clothes in general.

TJ -- would you believe that Jorge got turned away from Beso for wearing some sort of sleeveless shirt? At least, according to my friend. Weird. Eep! Also, most places don't allow any kind of hats on the guys.

Really? I guess it's good I don't wear either. Why do they worry about either of those items?

I thought I've seen a couple of guys wearing hats at the Century - Marcello, for one. Maybe not...


I like to see that people have taken some sort of effort to look nice. Generally the women are okay, but I've seen some guys out there and thought to myself -- that's how he presents himself at his BEST? for going out? Eeeesh. *shrug* You don't need to spend a lot of money to look decent.

Lol! There's a guy I know who wore sweatpants and a T-shirt when he went to the Wilsonian one night. And he had his tennis shoes treated so that he could dance in them. Not much of a fashion sense... :roll:

What's bad is that there are about 5-6 of us guys who all have bought the same shirt from Jim Hadley's "Experience" store. Oops!

[cocodrilo]

I think guys look so cool in hats. I've seen a few guys here wear hats at clubs/parties(and some ladies, too!). I'm wondering why they wouldn't allow them at clubs?

[SDsalsaguy]

Because some people try to sneak the answers--oh, wait, that's about students and final exams--sorry... back to your regularly scheduled discussions...

[tj]

I think guys look so cool in hats. I've seen a few guys here wear hats at clubs/parties(and some ladies, too!). I'm wondering why they wouldn't allow them at clubs?

Because they look cooler than the Bouncer... :wink:

[DiAnAoN1]

Here in Orlando the new trend seem to be hats, all the hard core salseros and salseras are wearing them nowadays, they look nice but I dont think I could spin without having mine fall out of my head. As far as dress codes in clubs people here tend to dress really nice and I hardly see anyone who's underdressed

[rails]

Like a lot of other places apparently, in San Francisco there are dress codes that usually include not wearing jeans, but they never get enforced. Around here it's hard to get anyone to dress up for anything so it probably wouldn't be practical to enforce, anyway. Nevertheless, there is a mix and a fair number of people dress up.

[cocodrilo]

Like a lot of other places apparently, in San Francisco there are dress codes that usually include not wearing jeans, but they never get enforced. Around here it's hard to get anyone to dress up for anything so it probably wouldn't be practical to enforce, anyway. Nevertheless, there is a mix and a fair number of people dress up.

No kidding! I lived in SF until I was 22 and whenever I go back for a visit nowadays, I'm amazed at the slovenly appearance of some people! Went up to Sonoma to do some wine tasting and, although this isn't generally a dress-up event, people were walking in looking like they just came off the beach. ( I wanted to say "If you can spend $60 on a bottle of wine, why don't you spend some $ on a decent shirt!") :?

[squirrel]

But why do it, cocodrilo, when the fashion nowadays is 'casual'... I heard bluejeans are considered 'elegant' now... you know, the multi-coloured, multi-form, multi-whatever jeans... you see a VIP party in my country and many ladies are wearing the 'fashionable jeans'... thanks Lord, the gentlemen stick to the suits (not that the suits are well-chosen though...)
But this is just the way the fashion goes nowadays...

[cocodrilo]

But why do it, cocodrilo, when the fashion nowadays is 'casual'... I heard bluejeans are considered 'elegant' now... you know, the multi-coloured, multi-form, multi-whatever jeans... you see a VIP party in my country and many ladies are wearing the 'fashionable jeans'... thanks Lord, the gentlemen stick to the suits (not that the suits are well-chosen though...)
But this is just the way the fashion goes nowadays...

I personally don't care for jeans. I like to look nice, and I don't care if Jennifer Lopez is wearin' it, I don't want to look like her, anyhow!

It's funny, 'cause when I travel, even after having conversations with locals for awhile, I'm often asked where I'm from("But you don't DRESS like an American...") Somehow, this pleases me! :twisted:

[mellody43]

I think guys look so cool in hats. I've seen a few guys here wear hats at clubs/parties(and some ladies, too!). I'm wondering why they wouldn't allow them at clubs?
I've seen guys in those snug knit caps, and those seem to be accepted, but not baseball caps -- maybe they figure people can hide stuff under them? *shrug*

Some women are wearing those little trendy caps with the small front brim -- I wish I could get away with those! LOL!

Melissa

[borikensalsero]

maybe they figure people can hide stuff under them? *shrug*

Like Cheat Shee, err, I think SD changed the channel before... :mrgreen:

[danceguy]

Went up to Sonoma to do some wine tasting and, although this isn't generally a dress-up event, people were walking in looking like they just came off the beach.

Hey now senorita, don't go dissin' the county I live in! :argue: :tongue:

I wonder what winery you went to (not that I'd ever be caught dead in such an establishment, strictly for the "winos and the cheeseos"!), but some folks are a bit more casual around here.

As rails commented, the one time I went dancing in SF I saw guys decked out in suits next to others who looked like they woke up in a gutter...hey whatever works for you I guess. :roll:

SG

[Pacion]

Because some people try to sneak the answers--oh, wait, that's about students and final exams--sorry... back to your regularly scheduled discussions...

:lol: SD

personally, i prefer no code because its simply takes away from my freedom of dressing the way i like at that particular moment in time.. ... in my view.. leave the pants for guys :wink: it suits them more :lol:

I prefer guys who dance in skirts :twisted: So much easier to see their legs :wink: :lol:

[cocodrilo]

Went up to Sonoma to do some wine tasting and, although this isn't generally a dress-up event, people were walking in looking like they just came off the beach.

Hey now senorita, don't go dissin' the county I live in! :argue: :tongue:

I wonder what winery you went to (not that I'd ever be caught dead in such an establishment, strictly for the "winos and the cheeseos"!), but some folks are a bit more casual around here.

As rails commented, the one time I went dancing in SF I saw guys decked out in suits next to others who looked like they woke up in a gutter...hey whatever works for you I guess. :roll:

SG

I wasn't referring to any LOCALS in Sonoma, it was the TOURISTS who looked trashy. They were obviously NOT from that area! Forget which winery it was, we hit like 6 that day! You never visit wineries? How do you sample their new releases? Take your chances with the whole bottle? I buy wines by the case so I like to try before I buy. You can also get good deals on case wines at the wineries. A lot of the wineries I visit are by appointment only and NONE of the wineries I've visited had cheese, or any snacks for that matter. :?

[Sabor]

i'm not sure .. but i'll take that as a compliment, with but a squeeze of lime :lol:

Lime? Did someone say lime?

Bartender, mojitos all around! :D

8) with but a touch of mango :cheers:

prefer guys who dance in skirts So much easier to see their legs

3 words for u pacion 'Scottish folkloric dancers' :wink:

[cocodrilo]

One of my buddies, who is Scottish, sez the guys don't wear anything under those kilts :shock: ! Next time I run into a guy wearing one, I think I'll have me a look! 8)

[Sabor]

One of my buddies, who is Scottish, sez the guys don't wear anything under those kilts :shock: ! Next time I run into a guy wearing one, I think I'll have me a look! 8)

:lol: no comment :lol:

[Pacion]

prefer guys who dance in skirts So much easier to see their legs

3 words for u pacion 'Scottish folkloric dancers' :wink:

:shock: Does that mean you are going to take up Scottish dancing for lil' me :friend: :bouncy: :lol:

Oh yes Cocodrilo! I remember reading that real men don't wear anything underneath their kilts :lol: and seeing as Sabor is a real man 8) :lol: :lol:


Peeping underneath men's kilts is NOT one of my ambitions in life :lol:

[Sabor]

Peeping underneath men's kilts is NOT one of my ambitions in life

honey.. i bet i can change your mind there, like certain things in life, sometimes experience b4 opinion is best :lol:

tell u what, while we ar dancing sometime in the foreseeabl future, i'll let u flip me so u can have a good satisfactory peek.. LMAO! :lol:

[MacMoto]

Oh yes Cocodrilo! I remember reading that real men don't wear anything underneath their kilts :lol: and seeing as Sabor is a real man 8) :lol: :lol:


Peeping underneath men's kilts is NOT one of my ambitions in life :lol:
Going off topic, but back in the time of the first world war when the Scottish regiments still used the kilt as their uniform, morning inspections included a peep under the kilt to make sure they had no sissies among their ranks who wore underwear. This is absolutely true!

The kilt, by the way, is a perfectly acceptable form of dress at any Scottish salsa venues. Come to our summer ball and it's a safe bet you will see some "men in skirts" in action! Whether they'll turn up as real men in terms of underwear is another matter though -- those fast spins can make them rather self-conscious... :lol:

[Pacion]

tell u what, while we ar dancing sometime in the foreseeabl future, i'll let u flip me so u can have a good satisfactory peek.. LMAO! :lol:

Does that mean you will wear a kilt/skirt then :shock: :lol: :banana: oh baby :lol:


Come to our summer ball and it's a safe bet you will see some "men in skirts" in action! Whether they'll turn up as real men in terms of underwear is another matter though -- those fast spins can make them rather self-conscious... :lol:

:shock: Hey! Forget about them being self-conscious. I don't want to feel that I absolutely must keep my eyes on my dance partner's face for a change :shock: :lol: Sabor, shush! :lol:

[Sabor]

whatever turns u on sugar :wink: :lol:

[Pacion]

:nope: :lol:

[Sabor]

flirt!

:lol:

[Pacion]

Moi! :shock: I am not scorpion :(


:lol:

[danceguy]

Now now folks, please keep things appropriate for all ages here! :D

[Pacion]

Okay, so now that we talked extensively about the Scottish kilt :lol: what is the dress code in some of the other places you have been to SGuy :kitty: :D

[jamaicanspice]

here in Jamaica we have latin night every Thursday night at the Jonakanoo Lounge.....its located at the Hilton Hotel in New Kingston, Kingston. There really isn't much of a dress code there per se but alot of people wear jeans (guys and gals) but they 'dress' it up by wearing nice tops....you do have peeps who dress up though - dresses/skirts/dress pants, etc. The one thing they won't allow is OBVIOUS sloppy dressing (obviously lol) so have no fear about coming to Jamaica and going latin dancing :D We welcome ALLL!!!!! :wink:

(yes...it's called SHAMELESS advertising :lol: 8) )

[pygmalion]

:lol: :lol: A little advertising can be a good thing. :wink: :D

[jamaicanspice]

:lol: :lol: A little advertising can be a good thing. :wink: :D

since you insist 8)

if you look at my pix in the album you'll see what the dress code is like..please ignore me in the black dress..that is a RARE thing! lol I'm usually in jeans too :lol:

[MacMoto]

I don't think we have any dress code around here. Our salsa balls are a dress up occasion (hence the appearances of the kilt, which is a formal dress for men in Scotland), but apart from that, anything goes really -- people turn up in all sorts of clothes, from jeans and t-shirt and "streetwear" to trousers and dress shirt (for men) and strappy dress (for women). The overall impression is casual rather than dressy. See the photos below and you get the general idea.

Last Salsa ball:
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaBall/20040207/index.html

Regular club nights:
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaDura/20031017/index.html
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaFriday/20031221/index.html

Mind you, I don't remember ever seeing football (soccer) club strips at salsa venues. I tend to think it's because salsa doesn't attract the type of people who wear them, but it's also possible that they would be turned away at the door since football colours often spell trouble in Scotland (especially -- but not limited to -- Glasgow, where the rivalry between the two main clubs is very acrimonious), and many night clubs operate a "no football colours" policy.

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

Because some people try to sneak the answers--oh, wait, that's about students and final exams--sorry... back to your regularly scheduled discussions...

:lol: SD

personally, i prefer no code because its simply takes away from my freedom of dressing the way i like at that particular moment in time.. ... in my view.. leave the pants for guys :wink: it suits them more :lol:

I prefer guys who dance in skirts :twisted: So much easier to see their legs :wink: :lol:

Pacion!! There´s this Scottish salsero here in Lisbon. He sometimes dances with a kilt. Shall I introduce you? :wink:

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

I don't think we have any dress code around here. Our salsa balls are a dress up occasion (hence the appearances of the kilt, which is a formal dress for men in Scotland), but apart from that, anything goes really -- people turn up in all sorts of clothes, from jeans and t-shirt and "streetwear" to trousers and dress shirt (for men) and strappy dress (for women). The overall impression is casual rather than dressy. See the photos below and you get the general idea.

Last Salsa ball:
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaBall/20040207/index.html

Regular club nights:
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaDura/20031017/index.html
http://www.salsaholics.co.uk/SalsaFriday/20031221/index.html

Mind you, I don't remember ever seeing football (soccer) club strips at salsa venues. I tend to think it's because salsa doesn't attract the type of people who wear them, but it's also possible that they would be turned away at the door since football colours often spell trouble in Scotland (especially -- but not limited to -- Glasgow, where the rivalry between the two main clubs is very acrimonious), and many night clubs operate a "no football colours" policy.

Macmoto,

And which of the ladies in these pictures is you??

Would these 2 football clubs be Celtic & Glasgow Rangers?

Here In Portugal, there aren´t dress codes at the salsa clubs (at least the one´s I know). I personally don´t usually dress up when going dancing. I prefer my good old Levis with a nice shirt (no T-shirts). I feel comfortable this way. At work, I sometimes go formal (the tie and suit thing) so on weekends I like to be more casual. I do however like seeing girls dress up. It makes me want to dance with them :wink: . I would say that Portuguese women dress up more than the men...

[jamaicanspice]

8) 8) hmmmmmmmmmmmmm....all this talk of men in sKirts is making me think of............................men in sKirts :lol: :lol:

[jamaicanspice]

(just looked at pix)

*with jersey accent* ooooooooooohhh!! I wanna dance with a man in a Skoit tooo!!! :P :P :D

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

8) 8) hmmmmmmmmmmmmm....all this talk of men in sKirts is making me think of............................men in sKirts :lol: :lol:

Like your logic Jamaicanspice... 8) :wink:

By the way, that was with a Jamaican accent maan... :wink:

[MacMoto]

Hi MapleLeaf Salsero, nice to see you back! :D
And which of the ladies in these pictures is you??
None of them. :wink: There are some photos of me on the Salsaholics site, but not on the pages linked above.

Would these 2 football clubs be Celtic & Glasgow Rangers?
Correct. Let's just say green and blue don't mix well in Glasgow...

[Sagitta]

Hi MapleLeaf Salsero, nice to see you back! :D
And which of the ladies in these pictures is you??
None of them. :wink: There are some photos of me on the Salsaholics site, but not on the pages linked above.

Well, what are you waiting for? :? When are we going to get a link with a picture of you? :)

[MacMoto]

Hi MapleLeaf Salsero, nice to see you back! :D
And which of the ladies in these pictures is you??
None of them. :wink: There are some photos of me on the Salsaholics site, but not on the pages linked above.

Well, what are you waiting for? :? When are we going to get a link with a picture of you? :)
All in good time, my dear, all in good time... :wink:

[cocodrilo]

Most of the people looked pretty well-dressed at that party, Macmoto! Nice! :D The guys in kilts were cool, too! Have never seen THAT at a latin gig!

[Sabor]

hope the guys with kilts didn't spin much :shock:

[jamaicanspice]

Like your logic Jamaicanspice...

By the way, that was with a Jamaican accent maan...

hehehehehee..... 8) all these peeps trying to be Jamaican :lol:

@Sabor: now THAT would have been a sight worth seeing lol lol

[salsera_alemana]

Hey Boriquen,

Personaly, you won't catch me dead dress down dancing even to the beach. I am more comfortable dressing up whenever I dance. Sweat-pants, jeans, or a T shirt, Tank Top, aren't comfortable to me. But put me in a pair of slacks, a button down shirt and I'm as comfortable as the guy in the sweat pants and the T-shirt.[/quote]

You are my kind of salsero. When I came to salsa (1991), everybody dressed up here in Germany at salsa events (not at normal discos) and I really enjoyed that! That was my kind of crowd. For me, going out dancing is something special although I might do it 2-3 times a week, STILL it is something special. I mean, girls, isn't it great to dance with a handsome dancer who is well dressed, smells good and can dance?

Unfortunately, now even in Puerto Rico the dress code has changed and many people go out dancing salsa in jeans. That is what I saw in 2002 at the evening dance at the Congreso de la Salsa in the Caribe Hilton. A couple of years ago (still in 2000) you saw everybody really dressed up at those events, many women in gorgeous long, sexy dresses, wow!
I personally regret this development because it takes away from the elegance of the dance. Two well dressed people look so much better dancing than the same two people dressed in jeans and sneakers.

Here in Germany hats are cool and you can wear them anywhere you want. Anyway, here there is no such thing as a dress code and most people now go out in jeans or very casual. Not my thing. I always dress up when I go out dancing. I like hats on men, I mean those cool nice real hats, not baseball caps or the like. However, when we lived in Kansas City, my husband one night wore his (real nice) hat and he had to put it back into the car because there were no hats allowed in the club. The reason was that KC was full of Mexicans and apparently hats had a negative image there, they represented "trouble". I love Mexico (have been there 4 times) and the Mexicans are very close to my heart, so I do not share this view. However, in many US cities Mexicans have the reputation of getting drunk and causing trouble. As we all know it is only certain people, and those people spoil the reputation for everybody.

So for me no jeans when I go out dancing! I like it stylish! And I like well dressed guys!

[squirrel]

Welcome back to the dance forums, salsera-alemana... nice to have you post again...
I would love it if people dressed up really nice for going out... but unfortunately they prefer the casual clothing... :(

[Sabor]

i'm glad to see poeple with variety and different tastes on almost any issue regarding looks/style.. i'm very thankfull for it because i think this is one of the issues where difference is very becoming..

i'd for sure been bored to see every one either generally dressing casual or generally dressing elegent .. i enjoy both because some people look great in casual as well as elegant.. even tho its adifferent look it doesnt take away from the energy given out..

plus there always has to be people who are messy dressers in all styles.. its just how they are.. they will always be there..

so.. as long as u got a hot look on whatever style u are dressing that works by me.. again its not what u are wearing as much as how u are wearing it.. so i'm very much in favor of mixed styles cause it awakens my various tastes and vibes.. makes it more interesting for me :D

[borikensalsero]

Thank you very much Salsara_alemana... :D :D :D

Funny thing happened yesterday evening. I was dress up as usual at jimmy Anton's social. Almost everyone was is in jeans/t-shirts/sweats/etc. Every time I went outside I took my button down shirt off to cool off, as I had a tank-top uderneath. Every time I came back inside I would put it back on... Towards mid evening, my lady love took my shirt off and told me to keep it off. Being a good boy, I did as told.

I must admit, it felt weired for me. I felt like I was naked! I couldn't wait to put it back on when the night was over. I didn't care how hot it was, all I knew was that I wasn't comfortable dancing wearing a tank.

For those who have been to jimmy, you know the place is a sweaty and stinky place, where you need at least 3 shirts, but even then, God, did I feel uncomfortable not being in my normal wear...

Hey... I danced with our very own Pacion. :bouncy:

[jamaicanspice]

that is SOOO cool!!! I'm missing out on so much!! :?

[SDsalsaguy]

Hey... I danced with our very own Pacion. :bouncy:
Lucky boy :!:

[danceguy]

And where are the pictures of this DF meeting? Pacion - I'm sure all the ladies here will be wanting to hear about how the dance went! (heck the guys too!) :D

SG

[jamaicanspice]

And where are the pictures of this DF meeting? Pacion - I'm sure all the ladies here will be wanting to hear about how the dance went! (heck the guys too!) :D

SG

8) *reaches for a large box of popcorn and sits cross legged on the ground* I'm WAITING Pacion 8) .....details please!!! DETAILS!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

[MapleLeaf Salsero]

Hey... I danced with our very own Pacion. :bouncy:

Boriken, you danced with Pacion? :shock: Lucky guy!! And how did it go????

[salsachinita]

Hey... I danced with our very own Pacion. :bouncy:

Boriken, you danced with Pacion? :shock: Lucky guy!! And how did it go????

Pacion, you lucky girl!!!!! How did it go???

[danceguy]

Yeah Pacion and Boriken, we're all waiting patiently! *taps foot*

:banana:

SG

[salsachinita]

Unfortunately, now even in Puerto Rico the dress code has changed and many people go out dancing salsa in jeans. That is what I saw in 2002 at the evening dance at the Congreso de la Salsa in the Caribe Hilton. A couple of years ago (still in 2000) you saw everybody really dressed up at those events, many women in gorgeous long, sexy dresses, wow!!

I know what you mean, salsera alemana! I grew up with the idea that salsa is a dressed-up thing, and in the early days no one would be caught dead in jeans :shock: !

Fair enough things have changed, but I still believe in dressing up for the right events!

For example, when Oscar D'Leon visited Melbourne two years ago, I made an effort to be in my absolute best salsa gown, only to find many people (including some of my local celebrities :shock: ) wearing jeans!!!!!! I personally thought it was on the disrespectful side :roll: !

[salsachinita]

i'd for sure been bored to see every one either generally dressing casual or generally dressing elegent .. i enjoy both because some people look great in casual as well as elegant.. even tho its adifferent look it doesnt take away from the energy given out..

so.. as long as u got a hot look on whatever style u are dressing that works by me.. again its not what u are wearing as much as how u are wearing it.. so i'm very much in favor of mixed styles cause it awakens my various tastes and vibes.. makes it more interesting for me :D

:notworth: Well said, Sabor! A very nice sum-up for this little thread of mine :wink: !

[salsaholic]

:idea: I find that salsa dancing in a kilt is very practical - It seems to be
easier to keep cool than dancing in trousers and there is much more
freedom of movement. However, I have to admit to wearing underwear
with the kilt - while being a true scotsman is cool, I dont want to
traumatise anybody when I spin :!:

Apart from that, it gets you noticed! Which is never a bad thing.


Graeme

[Sagitta]

Welcome to df salsaholic. Another person from your area already pointed me out to your site, and so I've checked it out a couple times. :)

[foursquare]

There's one latin club that is in our area that mentions in a newsletter that I get: "no hats."

Anyone know the significance of non-hat wearing? I must admit to being clueless.

foursquare

[mellody43]

i'm glad to see poeple with variety and different tastes on almost any issue regarding looks/style.. i'm very thankfull for it because i think this is one of the issues where difference is very becoming..


so.. as long as u got a hot look on whatever style u are dressing that works by me.. again its not what u are wearing as much as how u are wearing it.. so i'm very much in favor of mixed styles cause it awakens my various tastes and vibes.. makes it more interesting for me :D

I agree. Express your own personal style, but make some effort to look your best.

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

[borikensalsero]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

Hey, I'm getting jealous!!! That's me on my avatar!!! I got it going on too, not just sabor!!! :kissme:

[mellody43]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

Hey, I'm getting jealous!!! That's me on my avatar!!! I got it going on too, not just sabor!!! :kissme:
After seeing your post about dancing shirtless, I am sure you are. ;-)

and i am FLEEING IN TERROR from that avatar! Freaky! :shock:

[borikensalsero]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

Hey, I'm getting jealous!!! That's me on my avatar!!! I got it going on too, not just sabor!!! :kissme:
After seeing your post about dancing shirtless, I am sure you are. ;-)

and i am FLEEING IN TERROR from that avatar! Freaky! :shock:


I'm sorry, the pony tails freaking you out? I'll cut them before we meet.

[mellody43]

(oops)

[mellody43]

I'm sorry, the pony tails freaking you out? I'll cut them before we meet.
It's definitely not the ponytails. Perhaps you need to get on "Extreme Makeover." :-) -- those lips! those eyes!

[borikensalsero]

I'm sorry, the pony tails freaking you out? I'll cut them before we meet.
It's definitely not the ponytails. Perhaps you need to get on "Extreme Makeover." :-) -- those lips! those eyes!

Thank GOD, I thought I had to cut my beloved pony tails, and fix my teeth, but you don't seem to mind them, so they'll stay. Those eyes can deeply penetrate the eyes of another dancer, even behind the thickest of walls.

[mellody43]

I'm sorry, the pony tails freaking you out? I'll cut them before we meet.
It's definitely not the ponytails. Perhaps you need to get on "Extreme Makeover." :-) -- those lips! those eyes!

Thank GOD, I thought I had to cut my beloved pony tails, and fix my teeth, but you don't seem to mind them, so they'll stay. Those eyes can deeply penetrate the eyes of another dancer, even behind the thickest of walls.

I think you might have some alien DNA in you. Just sayin'. :-)

[Pacion]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

Hey, I'm getting jealous!!! That's me on my avatar!!! I got it going on too, not just sabor!!! :kissme:

:doh: I think I am sleepsurfing :roll: :roll: :roll:


:lol:

[borikensalsero]

I'm sorry, the pony tails freaking you out? I'll cut them before we meet.
It's definitely not the ponytails. Perhaps you need to get on "Extreme Makeover." :-) -- those lips! those eyes!

Thank GOD, I thought I had to cut my beloved pony tails, and fix my teeth, but you don't seem to mind them, so they'll stay. Those eyes can deeply penetrate the eyes of another dancer, even behind the thickest of walls.

I think you might have some alien DNA in you. Just sayin'. :-)

Don't tell anyone, I'm looking to take over the salsa race and convert it to robots doing what I say how I say. I might have chosen the wrong facade, but still aliens are cute, check out Godzilla! Wait, he was a god, I mean a...

[peachexploration]

Those eyes can deeply penetrate the eyes of another dancer, even behind the thickest of walls.

......... and the thickest of computer cyberspace..... I'm totally mesmermized! :shock: Very powerful!

(She says while her jaws are aching from laughter!)

Boriken, you rock! 8)

[borikensalsero]

Those eyes can deeply penetrate the eyes of another dancer, even behind the thickest of walls.

......... and the thickest of computer cyberspace..... I'm totally mesmermized! :shock: Very powerful!

(She says while her jaws are aching from laughter!)

Boriken, you rock! 8)

lmao, you should see that face and deep eyes staring deeply at you during Idilio! Ahhhh, beauty at its most innocent form.

[jamaicanspice]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

holy smokes INDEED :shock: !! aye caramba!!! 8)

[jamaicanspice]

:shock: boriken....that is DEEPLY disturbing :? !!! just so you know

[borikensalsero]

:shock: boriken....that is DEEPLY disturbing :? !!! just so you know

Is it the parting of my hair down the middle? or that I didn't shave before the picture?

[jamaicanspice]

Is it the parting of my hair down the middle? or that I didn't shave before the picture?

honestly?? :roll: it's the whole thing!!! :shock: I mean I doubt even extreme makeover could do the job!! I mean it's completely horrendous!! what in the world were you thinking!! good heavens I don't know whether to run or scream or cry or hide!! :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

ooooops :oops: did I say all that out loud? :oops:

[DanceMentor]

I remember a couple of years ago before jazz sneakers were becoming popular with Salsa dancers, they wouldn't let me enter the club in my dance sneakers. I remember being quite upset by this. I tried to explain these were dance shoes, but they wouldn't allow me to enter.

In general, I support having a dress code, because it promotes a classy atmosphere, and better...classy behavior.

[Sagitta]

I agree.

I'm happy to see a new page. That striking avatar of Boriken's is quite distracting.

[mellody43]

I agree.

I'm happy to see a new page. That striking avatar of Boriken's is quite distracting.

:o

[salsachinita]

Dodo strikes yet again.........non of my avartars or emoticons work :cry: !

I got lots of crosses instead *sign*, missing out on finding out what all these fuss over Boriken's avartar is about!!!!!!!

[MacMoto]

SC -- strangely, I have the same problem when I access DF from my home computer. Lots of crosses. Yet I can see all pics and icons fine on my work PCs. Hmmm... :?

As for Boriken's new avatar, trust me, ignorance is definitely bliss here -- it's SCARY. :shock:

[Sabor]

Sabor -- is your avatar a pic of you?! Holy smokes. http://images2.fotki.com/v18/photos/9/9145/46831/Katesrequestdancndevil-vi.gif LOL!

Melissa

holy smokes INDEED :shock: !! aye caramba!!! 8)

:oops: .. just a lucky pose amigas .. u are too kind, muchas gracias!

[squirrel]

geeesh, girls, don't give Sabor the wrong impression... just explain him you like the colour of the T-shirt... 8) :wink: :wink: :twisted:

Dance Mentor... I like the new avatar!

[Pacion]

geeesh, girls, don't give Sabor the wrong impression...

I see you are learning :roll: :lol:

Anyway, even if the girls didn't give him the wrong impression, he will choose to take the impression he wants :friend: :lol:

[squirrel]

yes, Pacion, I'm a fast learner! :)))))

[Sabor]

yes, Pacion, I'm a fast learner! :)))))

ahem.. u should never never admit that u are 'fast' in public! ahhh all the free advice i give :roll: .. someone make me a strawberry avec la creme sandwich s'il tu plait :lol:

[Lita_rulez]

Hi all !

First post on this forum, seems like a nice enough spot to be chating about salsa :wink:


This particular topic made me stop and think. Well actually, I started thinjing about that topic a few weeks back, in L.A. as I was atending the West Coast Congress.


The club(s) I go to in Paris do not have a dress code (provided of course it is not a them party like "black & white" or "white tuesday" or "Red birthday")

Since I like the look and feel of a wide leged pair of pants, and the only kind I have with such legs is Baggy Jeans, I usualy were those.

Since It is hot in those clubs, and I work in a suit, I do not get to were my T-shirts that often, so I were those to go dancing as well.

Sure enough, I got to buy dance shoes (after a while, you get cocky and believe you actually know how to dance well enough to justify you wearing dance shoes) and went for the dance sneakers (black)

So all in all, I think I pretty much qualify for the "streetwear" type.


I have been realy dancing for a litle over a year now, and I believe I can say I got to be a litle over average dancer (sufice to say I sometimes get compliments at the end of the dance, and will probably dare inviting allmost any dancer/performer now, without the fear of boring her to death in just one dance). So in the clubs I usualy go to, I am not familiar anymore with the word "no thanks" when I ask a girl to dance.


Arrival in L.A. (my first congress ever outside of France) I got very puzzled by the fact that almost every one was dressing up....
Not that I regret that, don't get me wrong, I'll chose the dancer in the sexy dress over the one in the baggys any night of the year. But I'm not used to it. And I didn't really fit in, what with the streetwear look and all...

Still, I did have a very good time, got to dance with a lot of diffrent dancers from difrent countries... But I got more "no" than I'm used to.

Oh well, whatever, there is a lot of evenings left (I got there on monday)


But I really got the meaning of "dressing up is important" on the first night in salsaland. I did get a lot mort "no" than I usually get (probably my record number in the last 6 months or so...) and a friend of mine who is a
good dancer also got 3 "no" in a row...

As we were driving back to the hotel with one of the DJs who I am friends with, we talked about it.
She said to me :

"well of course you'll get blown off. You're not dressed for the job ! I was looking at you from the DJ spot, and believe me, you were looking good, and far from seeming misplaced amongst the other dancers (that was the other part troubling me during the week. I can not think of me as anything more than an OK average dancer, and as such feel a litle misplaced in such a magic place as Salsaland...) EXCEPT for the way you dress.
This is not something new, I wanted to tell you this back in Paris already, you really should dress up a litle (at least stick with black jeans and a shirt, you'll look a lot better...) but here, it is all the more important."

The next evening, I did as advised. Black from top to bottom, including a nice enough shirt. (though not to fancy, as it seemed to me over the evenings that the crazyer your shirt was, the better dancer you were supposed to be)

And sure enough, I got a lot less "no" than the previous day (well... 3 over the entire evening... seems like an OK night to me. Especially since one of the "no" came from Grisell Ponse who promised a dance for the next evening :oops: )

The best part is what happened to my friend.

He also came in a shirt that evening, but he kept it open (don't frown like that girls, he was wearing a tank top under it, no hairs showing ;) )
He got 2 "no" in a row, came to me and said :
"well, the shirt thing does not seem to cut it for me, I just got 2 "no" in a row... guess I'm not good enough in here or they do not like my face or something"

I looked at him and said : "let's try it with the shirt buttoned down"

He closed his shirt. 20 seconds later (and I do mean 20 actual seconds, I'm not just saying that) a girl tapped on his shoulder asking him to dance :!:



Now I am puzzled by that story.

Does it happen like that all over the USA ?
Only in LA ?
Only in a congress ?
Only this conress ?
Only in very high end clubs ?
How about the rest of the world ?
Who shot JFK ? (oups, sorry, got carried away with the questions :? )



OK, I'll stop writing now, don't want to bore the readers on my very first post...


Oh well ! Read you all soon :D

[salsachinita]

Hi, Lita_rulez!

I want to be the first to welcome you :wink: !

My experience in L.A. was not all that fantastic....but that was back in '99. So I don't really have the latest feedback.

However, you will fit right in here 8) ! These days it's almost not cool to be over dressed........not that my local salseras really judge you by the way you dress anyway.

:wink: Pay us a visit any time soon...?

[borikensalsero]

Welcome welcome welcome!!

Now I am puzzled by that story.
Where I'm from (NY City) you can usually tell when a person can dance by what they are wearing. Advance dancers follow that. However, there are a lot of T-shirt/jeans kind of dancers who are just as advance as the fellows dressed up who don't care about wear.

The congress here in NY City (only one I've been to), was a big social. It seemed that only a few people cared to look presentable, however, it was hot as heck, so I don't blame them for wearing T-shirts and the like. A lot of people showed up dressed elegant as well. Which was nice to see amongt the streetwear dancers.
High End clubs in Manhattan (NY City) all require dress codes, if you don't dress per their dress code. You won't get it!

Who shot JFK ? (oups, sorry, got carried away with the questions )

I don't know, but I've been wondering who killed Hector Lavoe...

[Lita_rulez]

Hi, Lita_rulez!

I want to be the first to welcome you :wink: !

Well, if you look anything like the picture next to your name, I could hardly have gotten a better welcome had I benn writing the script myself.
And if you don't... well you're still going to be my best loved girl in here for being so nice !

(and hell, I still got the best looking pic to say "hey" ;) )


However, you will fit right in here 8) ! These days it's almost not cool to be over dressed........not that my local salseras really judge you by the way you dress anyway.

Well, if they judge you by the looks, I'm not really better off... At least I could dress up. Face up is going to be a hell of a bigger challenge :?

:wink: Pay us a visit any time soon...?

Believe me, I wish I could, but I'm going to the congress in Cannes (in france) the first week end of jully, and after that, well.. I'm broke !
So no Australia for me before a while.

(btw, if the girls down there judge you by the size of your wallet, I do stand a chance. As long as they don't mind if it's filled with invoices rather than money :roll: )

[DanceMentor]

Welcome, Lita_rulez!
It's great to see someone from Paris here. I truly hope you will stay around.
Thanks,
David

[Lita_rulez]

Welcome welcome welcome!!
Now I am puzzled by that story.
Where I'm from (NY City) you can usually tell when a person can dance by what they are wearing. Advance dancers follow that. However, there are a lot of T-shirt/jeans kind of dancers who are just as advance as the fellows dressed up who don't care about wear.

So let me put it the way I understand it :

basically, if you're a very good dancer and look like you just got out of a Hip Hop congress, you'll still get to dance a lot...
Provided the girls in there do know you for a good salsa dancer, because a stranger seen for the first time is going to be judged by the way he dresses.

Sounds about right ?

The congress here in NY City (only one I've been to), was a big social. It seemed that only a few people cared to look presentable, however, it was hot as heck, so I don't blame them for wearing T-shirts and the like. A lot of people showed up dressed elegant as well. Which was nice to see amongt the streetwear dancers.

Well... The LA congress was a dream of mine since my first congress (Cannes in france, Last year... and I was just a wide-eyed-new-born to the salsa world) and many people were talking about how LA was a huge congress, probably the best they had ever seen, and so on and so on.

However, I met one of my favourit dancer (and performer... did I mention she is a wonderfull dancer ? OK, back to the thread, sorry ;) ) in L.A. and she said I should really try and come to the NYC congress, for it is something absolutely wonderfull as well.

So if I can get my finances up and about again, hopefully, I can come by in Novembre and check out what "elegant dressers" look like in NYC ;)

High End clubs in Manhattan (NY City) all require dress codes, if you don't dress per their dress code. You won't get it!

Yep... even heard I should probably trade in my jazz-sneakers for a pair of good looking dance shoes if I didn't want to spend my evenings staring at closed doors...

But hey, I'm only begining to break on 2, so maybe I won't be ready to come to NYC even if my finances look healthy by novembre !

[Lita_rulez]

Welcome, Lita_rulez!
It's great to see someone from Paris here. I truly hope you will stay around.
Thanks,
David

Site Admin ???

OK, where the hell is that "bow-down" smiley... what a crapy computer, you can never get what you want when you're in a hurry and need a specific sm...

huh ?

:shock:

Oh, you're here allready ?

:oops:

Sorry, thought I was by myself...

:?

Well, thanks for the welcome !

From what I've seen so far, I do believe I'm going to hang around, people seem very friendly and many threads I feel like contributing to.

Best wishes to this site anyways !


P.S.
I know I do put a lot of jokes and off-topic comments in my posts, as I just did at the begining of this one, hope it's OK with the forum's "ethics" ?

[SDsalsaguy]

P.S.
I know I do put a lot of jokes and off-topic comments in my posts, as I just did at the begining of this one, hope it's OK with the forum's "ethics" ?
LOL... you mean vs. actually stay on topic??? :shock:

While some semblance of order is always welcome I honestly don't know what most DFites would do if silliness was agianst DF ethics. Collective apoplexy perhaps? :lol:


P.S. Welcome to the DF! :D

P.P.S. Was this :notworth: the one you were looking for?
(Hint: click on View more Emoticons. :wink: )

[Lita_rulez]

P.S.
I know I do put a lot of jokes and off-topic comments in my posts, as I just did at the begining of this one, hope it's OK with the forum's "ethics" ?
LOL... you mean vs. actually stay on topic??? :shock:

While some semblance of order is always welcome I honestly don't know what most DFites would do if silliness was agianst DF ethics. Collective apoplexy perhaps? :lol:

Well I'm definitly going to stay around then... My kinda place http://membres.lycos.fr/owk/FORUM/MINI-ICONES/TEX_AVERY/bicketboy-wolfy03.gif


P.S. Welcome to the DF! :D

http://membres.lycos.fr/owk/FORUM/MINI-ICONES/TEX_AVERY/wolfy28.gif Sir, Thank you, Sir !


P.P.S. Was this :notworth: the one you were looking for?
(Hint: click on View more Emoticons. :wink: )

well... That's more like it : http://www.ifrance.com/tout-foutre/Images/Gifs/bowdown.gif but thanks ;)

[salsachinita]

I'm only begining to break on 2, so maybe I won't be ready to come to NYC even if my finances look healthy by novembre !

We dance on 1 here :P !!!!!! If your finance looks healthy our congress in Sydney is this coming January, followed by Bacardi Festival (FREE outdoor event)! What's more, it will be summer then :wink: !

P.S. Just t give you more incentive, have you been to the Photo Album and check out my local salseras yet......?

[salsalawyer]

here in LA, we are laid back.

People to go dress casual, some clubs like Stevens and Monte Cristo allow designer jeans!

The larger clubs like the Mayan don`t allow jeans for salsa nights. Unfortunately, it gets so hot in clubs that it just isn`t comfortable to wear a suit or dress up!! :x

[tj]

here in LA, we are laid back.

People to go dress casual, some clubs like Stevens and Monte Cristo allow designer jeans!

The larger clubs like the Mayan don`t allow jeans for salsa nights. Unfortunately, it gets so hot in clubs that it just isn`t comfortable to wear a suit or dress up!! :x

Actually, the Mayan let me in with jeans about a month ago (during the competition finals). They were turning away people wearing khakis as well as a woman wearing loose, baggy jeans. In general, people were dressed pretty nicely.

Hey, are you the same one who got all the heat over on that other forum? Welcome, btw.

[salsalawyer]

yep, that would be me!! I`m causing trouble as usual!!


howdy!! :D

[Pacion]

[quote=Lita_rulez] P.S.
I know I do put a lot of jokes and off-topic comments in my posts, as I just did at the begining of this one, hope it's OK with the forum's "ethics" ?
LOL... you mean vs. actually stay on topic??? :shock:

While some semblance of order is always welcome I honestly don't know what most DFites would do if silliness was agianst DF ethics. Collective apoplexy perhaps? :lol:

Yes, and may I say/add that SD aka SDsalsaguy is the leader of the pack :roll: :lol:

Welcome to DF! Another European :banana: :car:

yep, that would be me!! I`m causing trouble as usual!!

:roll: :roll: :roll: And loving every second of it :wink:

[San]

(I think I'll be safe posting in here as yet another European :lol: )

Over here there are no real dress codes. Sure, on most flyers it's said 'Dress to impress' or 'no jeans or sportswear', but I haven't heard of people being refused because of what they're wearing.

It's appreciated though if you dress up nicely.

I sure like to!

[borikensalsero]

(I think I'll be safe posting in here as yet another European :lol: )

Over here there are no real dress codes. Sure, on most flyers it's said 'Dress to impress' or 'no jeans or sportswear', but I haven't heard of people being refused because of what they're wearing.

It's appreciated though if you dress up nicely.

I sure like to!

Welcome to DF San!!! :banana:

[Pacion]

(I think I'll be safe posting in here as yet another European :lol: )

Oh yes! You will be safe. It is the politicians who don't like each other :wink:

[San]

Thx Boriken!

And thx Pacion, for reassuring me ;)

[salsalawyer]

Welcome, SAn!!

[tj]

yep, that would be me!! I`m causing trouble as usual!!


howdy!! :D

Welcome to DF!

One note: I find it admirable that you decided to help your friend who got into all the trouble at the LA Congress, especially considering all the heat you took for taking that stance.

(and that's all that I plan on saying about it!)

[salsalawyer]

thank you.

[San]

Thx, Salsalawyer :D, same to you!