Pet Peeves of Dance Instructors

[pygmalion]

In another forum, MissAlyssa commented on an irritating comment she often hears from students.

Maybe the students are doing irritating stuff intentionally, but probably not.

From the perspective of a lowly student trying to "toe the line", I would be like to hear comments from you other instructors out there. What things do your students say and/or do that push your buttons? How do you handle it?

[SDsalsaguy]

I'm not an instructor, but I'd say students who insist on taking group classes way above their level probably rank right up there...

[Holiday]

A couple of years ago, I went back to my old dance school to take a basic class in salsa because I had forgotten how and I bought a bundled unlimited package for ballroom classes anyways. I went through the rotation very quiet and respectful like and we were covering the cross body lead which I remembered how to do.

I drew a follow who was doing the move wrong, so I tried to lead her into the spot without saying anything. She turned to me and said, "Look, I've seen you dance before, but this is Salsa and you're doing it wrong!" I was shocked at first and then I got a little mad and I raised my hand and asked the teacher. "Excuse me Sandra, could you go over the cross body lead again, because I want to make sure I'm doing it right." The teacher did it exactly the same way I was doing it and the follow didn't say anything after that. I then left the class because I wasn't feeling all that great about it, and it was a free class anyways.

[MissAlyssa]

I'd rather a student ask questions instead of just getting frustrated because they didn't actually know what I was talking about (but didn't want to say anything).

I also can't stand to hear "it doesn't feel natural" within at least the first few minutes of showing someone a new move. I just want to say "duuuuuuhhh.."

Another that really steams me is when a person comes in (who has taken dance lessons before) and tries to tell ME how to do the dance. I'M THE INSTRUCTOR AND YOU PAID ME TO TEACH YOU. "When I was at _____ they said that you do it like this..." blech.

When Intermediate skill dancers come to the Beginner lesson, get bored at the pace, and start making it audibly known is something that seems to happen every so often while doing lessons before dances.

-FF

[DanceMentor]

- Talking instead of paying attention and then have trouble doing what I just demonstrated.

- B.O.

- Intoxicated Students

[pygmalion]

Intoxicated Students

Once, I took an ongoing salsa class for several months. One Friday, a new student showed up, half smashed. And then had the nerve to start making lewd remarks to all the females in class, including me. Uugh!

The instructor running the class was a real pro, though. He had the guy "contained" in no time, through semi-sarcastic remarks.

I was impressed.

[pygmalion]

Oh, and since we lowly students are being allowed to participate, how about this?

Husband/wife couples who pick on each other throughout class/rehearsal.

Usually it's the wife picking on the husband, but not always. My take is, get over it, guys, or stop taking lessons together.

[d nice]

Students who blame their partners for everything going wrong.

Students who think they already know how to do a step, don't pay attention, and then miss the technique I want used in the move.

[MissAlyssa]

Oh, and since we lowly students are being allowed to participate, how about this?

Husband/wife couples who pick on each other throughout class/rehearsal.

Usually it's the wife picking on the husband, but not always. My take is, get over it, guys, or stop taking lessons together.


This happens to me EVERYDAY. Sometimes I feel like a marraige councelor.

[Swing Kitten]

Students who blame their partners for everything going wrong.

Students who think they already know how to do a step, don't pay attention, and then miss the technique I want used in the move.

It's like a metaphor for life and the people who make it unenjoyable!

I would imagine that people paying for classes would behave -- does this show how many classes I've taken? I always assumed that way back in high school when people like this would drive me nuts it was because they didn't really want to be there. Which was sorta understandable because they didn't have a choice.

They're not just in your classes... they're everywhere... and need to be stopped :twisted:

[DanceMentor]

Having to do more marriage counseling than dance instuction.

[MissAlyssa]

also..I know some people just CAN'T help it but...I can't stand to see someone dance offbeat and then act like I'm crazy or get pissed when I stop or slow to get on beat. argh! :evil:

[Swing Kitten]

Wow MissAlyssa, an even CUTER avatar!! awwww

[MissAlyssa]

hehe, thanks! :D

[DanceMentor]

I hate it when I start a group class and then half the class shows up late. I'm never sure if it is better to start over again or make them figure it out themselves. Either way, it's not fair to the people who got there on time.

[SDsalsaguy]

I hate it when I start a group class and then half the class shows up late. I'm never sure if it is better to start over again or make them figure it out themselves. Either way, it's not fair to the people who got there on time.
That pisses me off, as a student, as well! Either the instructor does go back and review or I end up having to dance with people who don't know what had already been covered... either one is objectionable, and as disrespectful of fellow students as it is of the instructor.

[Sagitta]

I agree about being on time to classes. However, there are some unavoidable situations. I always get to my Beginner Cornell ballroom class late as I have started taking a salsa class that is some distance away. But, then I do not join in until I have figured out what they have been teaching, otherwise I do not join in. I would not attend the classes at all, but there always is a shortage of follows, and so far I have been able to quickly catch-up with no problems. I also talk with the people teaching, before each series, so that they are aware of what I am doing. If any of them said that what I was doing would be too disruptive I wouldn't attend. Then on the other hand I also go for the classes that I know how to dance for that reason too, such as beginner swing, and respectfully follow the instructions of the person conducting the class...

Then speaking of the pet peeve people taking classses above their level...at the ballroom club they had some classes of intermediate cha-cha. I went for the first class to see if I knew enough, but soon saw that I wasn't ready for this class series. Here the instructor assured people that if they didn't know some of the bronze standard moves and didn't want to come and practice/learn them on Saturday they would be covered in the beginner classs series. After that we would be ready to partcipate in the intermediate cha-cha series next time it was offered. The beginner class series was recently completed and not much of the bronze syllabus was covered. The frustrating thing is that for all the beginner classes here I know at least half the moves, so for cha-cha I patiently went through the entire class and did not receive the end result that I thought I would achieve. :evil: If the people in the club cannot coordinate and ensure that they prepare those for the beginner class adequately for the intermediate class, after one of them saying that is what would happen then I don't think they deserve the courtesy of not having people coming to classes above their level. I have never done classes above my level otherwise!

[suek]

Student speaking: And when the teacher is late, what then? And when the teacher doesn't show and the student has paid in advance for the series, what then? And when the teacher is unprepared?

This last is a dilemma for me. I prefer a class setting that's responsive to the students' needs and is fluid more than one that follows a strict bronze/silver/gold curriculum. But that doesn't mean I like it when a teacher has obviously put no thought into the class before he or she gets on the floor. There's a good middle ground in there; I just know it!

Thx

Sue

[pygmalion]

Amen to that! At my former studio, the teachers (ALL of them!) would often start classes or lessons ten to fifteen minutes late. Yet, if you were late for a lesson, your late time was often deducted from your lesson. Rude! :x

[SDsalsaguy]

Amen to that! At my former studio, the teachers (ALL of them!) would often start classes or lessons ten to fifteen minutes late. Yet, if you were late for a lesson, your late time was often deducted from your lesson. Rude! :x
Aside from being rude, that's just downright unprofessional! Certainly things do happen…in which case the instructor would “owe” those 10-15 minutes to the student/class. Anything else is unethical.

[pygmalion]

Actually, I didn't mind the lateness. Things happen to everybody. It's the disparity that bugged me.

[SDsalsaguy]

I certainly agree Jenn, which is what I meant when I said, "certainly things do happen..." I guess that just didn't come across as I'd intended. My point had been that I can accept delays/absences, etc.,... but that it is unfair/unethical for the student to have to "eat it" when the loss of time comes from the instructor.

My original point above, however, had been that students being disruptive to a class is not just a problem for the instructor, as DanceMentor had been saying, but is also a problem for the other students as well. Sagitta's description is a different issue... sure logistics may bring one in late, but he makes a point of *not* disrupting the class as a result.

As far as the adaptive vs. curriculum (or structured vs. unstructured) classes, I think that's a great topic and deserves its own thread... See Dance Class Structure (http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?p=14791#14791)

[Swing Kitten]

I certainly agree Jenn, which is what I meant when I said, "certainly things do happen..." I guess that just didn't come across as I'd intended. My point had been that I can accept delays/absences, etc.,... but that it is unfair/unethical for the student to have to "eat it" when the loss of time comes from the instructor.

I think you misunderstood her SD. It appeared to me that the gripe was that it's ok for the instructor to be consistantly late but not fore the student if something where to come up-- as they tend to do. If the teacher was late then the time frame would be flexible but if the student was comparably late then the student time frame would be ridged.

Did I get that right Jenn?

[SDsalsaguy]

I agree that there's a problem with the double standard SK... it's just that since people do need to be able to make schedules, etc., I tend to think it's OK to be rigid about them -- as long as this does go in both directions.

[Swing Kitten]

I haven't stated my opinion either way. Sure ideally everyone would be on time for everything.

I'm all for being flexible at the same time I'm all for being responsible. Responsible so when the flexibility is needed it's not an issue nor forever taxing but a true courtesy.

[pygmalion]

I am the world's most rigid person when it comes to expectations of myself -- I was raised to be on time or early, as a coutesy to others. No problem; I get there on time. But I have learned through experience that people need a little flexibility when it comes to time -- even me, occasionally.

My problem was with the PATTERN of lateness, combined with a PATTERN of inflexibility toward students, combined with an absolute refusal to start lessones early. If you arrived early, these teachers would literally ignore you until your appointed start time. Yet, if you arrived late, they'd end your lesson on time. Or, if they went over time for some reason, you had to wait for them. Huh? :?

It got really funny, after a while. For group classes, after months of this lateness, the students started congregating on the dance floor en masse at class start time, and practicing, sending an on time message to the staff. I wonder if they ever got it? :lol: Oh well. Not my problem anymore.

[NeoDevin]

You complain about the disparity, but I think (other than it being commonplace for them to be late), that it is the right system. If the instructor is late, it's his responsibility to still teach the amount of time you've paid for. If you're late, the instructor is still spending his/her time waiting for you, so you're paying for it. It isn't the instructor's responsibility to spend his/her personal time to make up for your lateness. At my old job, when I was on the first shift of the day, when my boss would show up late to open, and I was on time, I would still get payed for the time he was late, even though I wasn't working, yet if I showed up late, I would have to stay late, or take a pay cut. I wouldn't ever have it any other way. It all comes down to who is held accountable for what. You are late, you are accountable, your loss.

Devin

[SDsalsaguy]

Agreed Devin, but, as I read it, the problem was with instructors showing up late and *not* making up the time. And that's just not right.

[NeoDevin]

Ok, then I misunderstood, if that was the case, then I would probably quit right away, and demand the rest of my money back... or if that wasn't an option, they definately wouldn't be getting any more of my money.

[d nice]

Aside from being rude, that's just downright unprofessional! Certainly things do happen…in which case the instructor would “owe” those 10-15 minutes to the student/class. Anything else is unethical.

All lessons, group or private are 50 minutes at my studio... I push the lessons to an hour almost every single time, building up a "reserve". =) I know that things happen, I have students that come in late, I come in late, it happens to everyone at somepoint or another, and sometimes beyond your control.

I want my students to gain as much information as possible that can only happen with face to face time. If the teacher or student is chronically late and therefore causing the class sessions to be shorter in duration there is a problem.

[dancergal]

Here is my biggest pet peeve when taking a group class. I can stand it when the instructor does not rotate the couples often enough and you're stuck dancing the lesson with someone that doesn't have a clue or in the case of followers, sometimes there are too many followers and we're dancing by ourselves. The instructors need to be aware of the class as a whole and not get caught up on teaching his routine. Rotate the couples pleeeeeeeeeease!!!

[Sagitta]

I am the world's most rigid person when it comes to expectations of myself -- I was raised to be on time or early, as a coutesy to others. No problem; I get there on time. But I have learned through experience that people need a little flexibility when it comes to time -- even me, occasionally.

Some good old-fashioned values. :)

I'm all for being flexible at the same time I'm all for being responsible. Responsible so when the flexibility is needed it's not an issue nor forever taxing but a true courtesy.

I totally agree.

All lessons, group or private are 50 minutes at my studio... I push the lessons to an hour almost every single time, building up a "reserve". =) I know that things happen, I have students that come in late, I come in late, it happens to everyone at somepoint or another, and sometimes beyond your control.

Very good strategy d nice. My salsa instructor does have one hour classes, and does gives everyone there one hour, which is very much appreciated. He is a great instructor, and even has a couple assistants who help out when there are one or two people having difficulty. This way he can move at a pace most are comfortable with without any detriment to those who are slower. Similarly the few more advanced students get styling / techique tips from the assistants so that they don't feel that they are being helf back. Unfortunately as he has one class after another by the end of the evening the last class can start 20 minutes late, and finishes 20 minutes late. This happens regularly. It is a little harder to plan your schedule around this as sometimes classes don't run as late and sometimes they run over really late!!! :( :)