Ask Frankie

[d nice]

If you could ask Frankie Manning anything what would it be?

Frankie Manning? Who is that?


Below is the intro to his bio on Savoy Style (http://www.savoystyle.com/frankie_manning.html)...

No one has contributed more to the Lindy Hop than Frankie Manning -- as a dancer, innovator and choreographer. For much of his lifetime he has been an unofficial Ambassador of Lindy Hop. Originally touring as a dancer and choreographer with Whitey's Lindy Hoppers in the 30's and 40's, he helped spread the popularity of the Lindy Hop through three continents. Once again, since the swing dance revival that started in the 1980s, Frank Manning has been a driving force worldwide with his teaching, choreography and performance. His own love of swing music and dancing has been as contagious as his dazzling smile.

[DanceMentor]

For a start, I offer these two questions:

1) What is the Flying Lindy?
2) How come your so happy all the time?

[Swing Kitten]

I would ask who his favorite bands were.

For which contribution would he like to be remembered for nintey six years from now?

Who does he feel is the most underappreciated or least recognized contributer to the dance?

Which of his character or personality traits may he be attributed to his success?

Does Frankie Manning feel there is anything missing or lacking from today's swing scene/ dancers? If so, what?

Damon, with this discussion you will be moderating be video taped? I, for one, would like to see it.

[d nice]

It won't likely be video taped... I will try and transcribe as much of it as I can, possibly get an audio tape... I'll see what i can do.

[Swing Kitten]

It won't likely be video taped... I will try and transcribe as much of it as I can, possibly get an audio tape... I'll see what i can do.

Oh please do!!! Do you take short hand?? :wink:

[d nice]

So Catrine Llungren has blown out her knee so she won't be able to teach. What we are discussing now is her either taking over the talk, or us doing it together.

I'm not sure which way we'll go, but either way it will still be great. I've got your questions and I'm leaving to see Frankie now.

[Swing Kitten]

Yippeee!!! Have a wonderful Festival!!!

[Spitfire]

I would ask him if Lindy Hop originally was a six count dance since I think I read somewhere that he stated so.

[d nice]

So I have answers to slightly more than half your questions. I'll get the rest of the answers by phone in the next week or so.

I'll give the short answers now. If you want the longer answers let me know.

Favorite band, Count Basie.

Least recognized contributor, Herbert White.

Lindy Hop has alwasys been based around an eight count basic (the swing out), though it uses lots of various six count steps.

It is hard not to be happy when you get to do what you love for a living.

I've got more for you, as well as a few stories I'm going to write up to post here.

[SDsalsaguy]

Thanks for the feedback form a true living legend!

[pygmalion]

Yes. Thanks, d nice. I'm looking forward to hearing your stories. :)

[Black Sheep]

Spitfire asked:
Posted: Sat Sep 20, 2003 2:58 pm Post subject:

"I would ask him (Frankie Manning) if Lindy Hop originally was a six count dance since I think I read somewhere that he stated so."

D'nice, the questrion Spitfire asked you is still unanswered, and we are all waiting with baited breath for your report on Frankie's 'aleged statement concerning the 'six count Lindy'.
Black Sheep, 'Words are Cheep, Verification is Golden' Joe Lanza 2003 a.d.

[Swing Kitten]

Yup... ...missed ya Joe.

actually, he did answer the question with the post that went up more than four hours before your post. It says very clearly...

Lindy Hop has always been based around an eight count basic (the swing out), though it uses lots of various six count steps.

it's there for everyone to read... from Frankie Manning... what else do you need?

In keeping with the theme, D nice's words are golden. He said he'd ask the question, he asked the question, he got the answer and passed it along to us just like he said he would.

[Swing Kitten]

and D nice... I would thoroughly enjoy hearing the long answers!

[DanceMentor]

If you can record Frankie answering the 6-count question, I'll see to it that it is made into a web-ready format and made available for all to hear. :D

[d nice]

I'll see what I can do about recording it.

The longer stories will pop up in there own thread when I'm done compiling my notes from the talk and my interview.

[Swing Kitten]

If you can record Frankie answering the 6-count question, I'll see to it that it is made into a web-ready format and made available for all to hear. :D

It's sad that it seems to be nessesary!

I look forward to reading about what Frankie has to say.

[Black Sheep]

Swing Kitten'
Do you really expect anyone to accept what D'nice Says Frankie said? Is this what common sense verification is? How about some authentic quotes from Frankie himself? either denying or corroborating Spitfire's statement concerning the 'Six Count Lindy being the original Lindy in the 1940's'.
Until we get Frankie's verification from his own lips, let me give you my personal 'Verification' of what was taught up until the 1960's in New York and in L.A. the two specific cities where I was a live active observing dancer and teacher of Swing with a bear trap memory. Here is my Quote, "Nobody ever used the word, ' eight counts' for Swing/Lindy" and if I have to someday demonstrate why the Six Count was used and why it is so flexible and superior 'count' in training anyone to become a top Lindy dancer, I will do it!
But in the time being I am a 'Primary Source' of what Lindy was being taught her in L.A. in the 1940's and the 1950's and what style of Lindy was being taught and danced in New York in the 1930's up until the 1960's. I was there actively teaching and dancing both WCS & ECS (LINDY) styles that have now evolved into similar but different dance forms, before D'nice was ever born.

Black Sheep, "Talk is Cheap, Verification is Golden" Joe Lanza, 2003 a.d.

[d nice]

It's not like Frankie can't be seen within in a 2 hour drive of any major scene at least once a year. If someone really wanted to connect with the true roots of lindy hop as done in the Savoy Ballroom from the 30's to 50's let me know. I'll happily let them know when Frankie will be in their neck of the woods.

That said Frankie Manning will be in Palm Springs (for all you Southern Cali types, Joe, Jonathon) in November for the Harvest Moon Swing Out.

[d nice]

Are we really going to go through this again Joe?

1. Every living member of Whitey's Lindy Hoppers will tell you the swing out is the basic. Everyone of them if asked to count it out will count it as either 8 (with two &'s), 10 (with the & being given a whole number), or two sets of either four or five (depending on whether they assign the second step in the triple as an & or as a number).

Why this discrepancy? Because they didn't use numbers at all among the top Savoy dancers. Not six, not eight, nothing.

[pygmalion]

It's not like Frankie can't be seen within in a 2 hour drive of any major scene at least once a year. If someone really wanted to connect with the true roots of lindy hop as done in the Savoy Ballroom from the 30's to 50's let me know. I'll happily let them know when Frankie will be in their neck of the woods.

That said Frankie Manning will be in Palm Springs (for all you Southern Cali types, Joe, Jonathon) in November for the Harvest Moon Swing Out.

Hey d nice! I realize that Orlando is not a "major scene", but I'm willing to drive or fly. Do you know if Frankie Manning has a website or if he publishes a calendar. Or do you publish info on your website?

[Spitfire]

Swing Kitten'
Do you really expect anyone to accept what D'nice Says Frankie said? Is this what common sense verification is? How about some authentic quotes from Frankie himself? either denying or corroborating Spitfire's statement concerning the 'Six Count Lindy being the original Lindy in the 1940's'.
Until we get Frankie's verification from his own lips, let me give you my personal 'Verification' of what was taught up until the 1960's in New York and in L.A. the two specific cities where I was a live active observing dancer and teacher of Swing with a bear trap memory. Here is my Quote, "Nobody ever used the word, ' eight counts' for Swing/Lindy" and if I have to someday demonstrate why the Six Count was used and why it is so flexible and superior 'count' in training anyone to become a top Lindy dancer, I will do it!
But in the time being I am a 'Primary Source' of what Lindy was being taught her in L.A. in the 1940's and the 1950's and what style of Lindy was being taught and danced in New York in the 1930's up until the 1960's. I was there actively teaching and dancing both WCS & ECS (LINDY) styles that have now evolved into similar but different dance forms, before D'nice was ever born.

Black Sheep, "Talk is Cheap, Verification is Golden" Joe Lanza, 2003 a.d.

Joe, it's not a big deal; d nice is answering the question as he best knows. I may be wondering about the six count thing, but it's nothing that needs going out of the way to find out.

[d nice]

Jenn, Frankie will be at the Virgina State Open in October. The event is run by Craig Hutchinson. The event itself is a little weird as far as swing events go... the break down for dances is very ballroom-esque, but since it is so close to DC it generally draws a decent number of pretty amazing dancers. This is as close to Florida that I know he is going to be before the end of the year. I'll ask if there is anything closer out your way in the next six months. I do know he is on vacation the month of December.

If you want to hook up with one of the original Savoy dancers, Sugar Sullivan lives in Boca I think (I can never remember where exactly, it is one of the small towns in Southern Florida). She might be at SoFLEX (South Florida Lindy EXchange).

[pygmalion]

Cool! I may look into the South Florida Exchange. That's about a three-hour drive for me, versus about ten to VA. Plus, if I go to VA, I'll probably get waylaid by my Mom, who's in South Carolina. I'd probably never make it to Virginia, with all those homemade biscuits in me! :lol:

Frankie Manning's 2003Workshop Schedule
http://www.savoystyle.com/schedule.html

-FF

Until we get Frankie's verification from his own lips..

How about Frankie on video talking about it in his own instructional series?

http://www.swingdanceshop.com/linhopwitfra.html

While you're on the website, click on the videos and you can view a Quicktime movie.

You can buy these for yourself, or go to your library and see if they have them (if they don't you can request them).

-FF

[d nice]

Thanks for the website ff.

[Danish Guy]

Swing Kitten'
Do you really expect anyone to accept what D'nice Says Frankie said? Is this what common sense verification is? How about some authentic quotes from Frankie himself?

Please stop treating this issue like it is a religious question. Should d’Nice lie just to annoy the BlackSheep. I don’t think so! Frankie could remember right or wrong. BlackSheep could remember right or wrong. It was long time ago in a big city. They could say 6 and 8 and both be right. Move on, and appreciate the dance as it is today. Have fun. Enjoy. If the Sheeps magic pill can help anyone that great. If somebody prefers another way, that’s great to. Personally I would like the friendly dance instructor back.

[pygmalion]

Amen to that! 8)

[DanceMentor]

We will be using the answers that d'nice provides for this thread. If you feel d'nice is not going to give a valid answer, then I would suggest starting a separate thread about your point of view. The main focus of this thread is about Frankie's answers to d'nice's questions. If we are lucky, we may even get a recording which I will happily make available here on the forums.

Danish Guy, well said!
Swing Kitten, your the best!

When it comes to Frankie Manning, I will personally vouch for the fact that he considers the 8-count swing out the core of the Lindy Hop and nearly all the moves he teaches are 8 count including the line dances. Yes, he does do some 6-count, but he always keeps some level of phrasing with the music. 6-count is not a very good method of choreography.

Let's stick to questions you would like to ask Frankie.

Here's one:
Frankie, if we gathered some donations from people, would you give your official answers right here on the Dance Forums? We can hire a typist if you like.

[pygmalion]

Danish Guy, well said!
Swing Kitten, your the best!

Hey, what am I, chopped liver? :lol: :lol: Just kidding. Yes. They both said what needed saying, and said it well.


Frankie, if we gathered some donations from people, would you give your official answers right here on the Dance Forums? We can hire a typist if you like.

This is an excellent idea. It would be so nice to get words of wisdom from some living greats, like Frankie Manning and others. It's worth making a donation. This is a rare time in history, and these folks won't be around forever. We need to learn all we can. :)

[SDsalsaguy]

For some more info straight from Frankie's mouth please see the Frankie Manning... Master of the Lindy Hop (http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=872), in the Articles Forum, as provided by Christine Zona, Editor-in-Chief of Dance Notes.

[d nice]

Frankie could remember right or wrong. BlackSheep could remember right or wrong. It was long time ago in a big city. They could say 6 and 8 and both be right. Move on, and appreciate the dance as it is today.

Two notes...

While it is technically possible that a dancer from one era could forget what they used to do... Frankie never stopped dancing (minus his stint in the Army in WWII). He danced pretty much every week up in Harlem and in the late 80's began to dance around not just this country but the world. The line of continuity unbroken and so many film clips of his dancing from the Swing Era of the 30's and 40's, make it very unlikely that he could have forgotten something so basic as... the basic. Fact is the count behind his dancing now and the dancing in his clips is the same.

We've already established that Joe, despite his insistance of using a six count method, infact executes the swing out in the eight count format as counted by todays international instructors.

The problem really lies in the fact that Joe didn't learn swing dancing in 30's Harlem, the acknowledged hot bed of the dance. I believe he learned more than a decade later (Joe will correct me if I am wrong, but he has said he didn't start dancing swing until around 27, and by that rakish picture of his, he couldn't possibly have been born in 1913) and on the other coast. The dance had noticeably changed both in its music and its form. So while some people maintained the name Lindy Hop a significant number of dancers had switched to the term Lindy, Jitterbug, or Swing.

As is want with dancers today, many people do not want to acknowledge what they are dong may be a different dance. Despite the number of changes in style, form, music, moves, and character.

Suffice to say that I have little doubt Joe teaches the dance the way he danced it in the 50's. That dance however is not the same as done by Herbert White's performers, the dancers from the Savoy Ballroom, or from Harlem... at least according to those who are still with us or the film footage.

[DanceMentor]

Thanks for the support, chopped liver...er...pygmalion :lol: :lol: :lol:
WOuldn't it be awesome if we could get Frankie Manning offer his comments right here on Dance Forums?

d'nice,
I have a high level of confidence the dancers at the Savoy dance an 8-count swing out as the basis of their dance.

[d nice]

Well I'm glad of your confidence. The fact Frankie counts it out as eight in his instructional video is pretty telling as far as what he does now... which is pretty much the same (minus adjustments made from a performance style to the social style) as his film clips in the 40's.

Anyone who doubts should check out the movies Frankie has been in and count it out themselves.

You certainly don't need me or Joe telling you what it is, when you have two perfectly good eyes yourself.

"The Proof is in the pudding." - Anonymous

[SDsalsaguy]

And, from the Frankie Manning… Master of the Lindy Hop (http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=872) interview, in Articles...

Has what you teaching changed over the years?
Well, it has changed because now at least I know how to count up to eight!
(His point having been that, back in the day, they didn't think about numbers but now, instructionally, this is the count/timing he uses.)

[d nice]

Neat. I could have swoorn I read someone else say something like that. Maybe in this thread? ;)

[Black Sheep]

Lindy Buffs,
Does not the statement below by Frankie verify what I have been saying for a long, long time that, 'There was no such thing as an 'Eight Count Lindy" in the 1940's & 1950's'?

Quote:
Has what you teaching changed over the years?
FRANKIE, "Well, it has changed because now at least I know how to count up to eight!

Black Sheep, 'Talk is cheep, but Frankie's Verification is GOLDEN'

[Black Sheep]

Frankie Fans,
Check out SDSalsaguy's revealing intervierw of Frankie Manning for a Primary Source Report on his thread, FRANKIE MANNMING ...MASTER of the LINDSY HOP' for a realk eye opener!.
Black Sheep, I never knew Bo Peep!

[SDsalsaguy]

Check out SDSalsaguy's revealing intervierw of Frankie Manning for a Primary Source Report on his thread, FRANKIE MANNMING ...MASTER of the LINDSY HOP' for a realk eye opener!.
Just for the record, I did not do this interview! As posted at the bottom of the article, I was just re-posting, with full permission, form Dance Notes. The interview itself was conducted by Christine Zona, Dance Notes' Editor-in-Chief .

[d nice]

Joe, you've completely missed the point and mischaracterized your own argument. I've always said that there were no counts used by the lindy hoppers at the Savoy, however if anyone counts out their swing out you end up with an eight count movement.

Completely different than your statement that "there was no eight count Lindy Hop in the 40's and 50's".

[Swing Kitten]

Lindy Buffs,
Does not the statement below by Frankie verify what I have been saying for a long, long time that, 'There was no such thing as an 'Eight Count Lindy" in the 1940's & 1950's'?

Quote:
Has what you teaching changed over the years?
FRANKIE, "Well, it has changed because now at least I know how to count up to eight!

Ahhh... but you see that he doesn't say that it used to be a six count dance! In fact this statement verifies that the DANCE has not changed (only the method of teaching it) and the DANCE is an EIGHT COUNT MOVEMENT-- and has always been that way.

This completely shoots down your theory of lindy being based on a six count movement... I am interested to see how gracefully you can accept this.

'Talk is cheep, but Frankie's Verification is GOLDEN'

Yes, I agree... which is why I'm posting this in the hopes you'll consider that what Frankie Manning is saying is actually in opposition of your painfully strong opinions.

I thought one person's verification wasn't to be believed,
if it was through someone else, who may have
misinterputed for their own gain?
Anyway...

-FF

[SDsalsaguy]

I read the interview the same as Swing Kitten does. Also keep in mind that I am not, nor have I ever claimed to be, a swing dancer. As such, perhaps I'm reading what it says and not what I hope or think it says, hmmm?

[Danish Guy]

I’m sad this issue continues. :( :( :(

I don’t know much of the Lindy hop thing, but I got this question for Frankie “the legend” I hope I have been formulating the question correct, and I hope Joe will accept the answer, whatever this may be, so we can burry this crusade. :?


Question:

I got this friend named Joe. He is an old guy, who has danced the Lindy hop from back in the 40’s. He insist that back then, they used a teaching method based on a count to 6, even though it was a 8 beat rhythm. It has become an issue in our dance-forum, and very important for Joe, if this was common back then, or a local thing. So, back in the 40’s & 50’s, did they use a count to 6, a count to 8, or didn’t they count at all while teaching?

I understand the d’nice will be able to talk to Frankie again later.
If we need a better choice of words, let me know. :wink:

[Black Sheep]

SwingKitten,
The Six Count Question is answered in SDSalsaguy's thread, 'Frankie
Manning...Master of the Lindy Hop'. Frankie categorically states that in the
1930's and 1940's they did not count at all, and it wasn't until 1980' he
states, "I learned to count up to eight." Check the interview for 'PRIMARY
VERIFICATION'.
I came up with the 'Magic Pill Six Count Lindy' in 2002 to simplify the learning process of the dance to help increase the diminishing Swing population for everyone's benefit; teachers and students.
The only count we used in the Hollywood area in the 1950's was, "1,2,3,-1,2,3-rock step (1,2)" I never heard the term 'TRIPLE-TRIPLE, or SIX count or EIGHT count terms in the 1950's until I returned, like Frankie did in 1980, I returned to dancing in 1999.
What is the significance in the end result in the appearance of the dance in general? NONE! The significance is in the expedited learnining process when using the Joe Lanza Six Count teaching method, and here is WHY!
The great majority of teachers today are using the number of STEPS 'eight' (8) in teaching the Lindy Basic patterns: While, in teaching, I use the number of QUARTER NOTES (6) used to complete one Basic Lindy pattern. Why? because it is a much more logical and flexible method in teaching the Lindy, besides teaching the dancer that the musical beats are of the PRIMARY focus NOT the number of steps taken, AND HERE IS THE KEY: The number of steps in the Lindy vary considerably with the innovative patterns created by the WCS dancers and the Joshua Jive stylists. BUT the numberof 'six quarter beats' NEVER changes WHEN dancing the Savoy Lindy Hop.

Black Sheep, 'The truth never NEEDS to be remembered'. Socrates, 359 b.c.

[d nice]

LOL.

Joe. I highly suggest you read this site on learning to read music (http://datadragon.com/education/reading/).

This isn't the first time you have referenced notes and done it incorrectly. It'll make your arguments a lot stronger... of course when you realize how the counting of notes and steps work... you find yourself without an argument.

There are quarter, eighth, and sixteenth notes, what the majority of teachers are counting is the steps to the notes...

As in 1 2 3 & 4 5 6 7 & 8 with the 1 and 2 representing a quarter note and the 3 an eighth note and the & 4 representing sixteenth notes, repeat this pattern for the second bar 5-8.

So where are we at now Joe? Its hard to comment about a teaching style you have never used because you are probably missing the nuances invovled. I'm glad to say my students don't.

[Danish Guy]

The only count we used in the Hollywood area in the 1950's was, "1,2,3,-1,2,3-rock step (1,2)" I never heard the term 'TRIPLE-TRIPLE, or SIX count or EIGHT count terms in the 1950's until I returned, like Frankie did in 1980, I returned to dancing in 1999.
What is the significance in the end result in the appearance of the dance in general? NONE! The significance is in the expedited learnining process when using the Joe Lanza Six Count teaching method, and here is WHY!



Somebody pushed the reset button or what?

I don’t get it. http://www.clandisa.dk/forum/images/weeping_125.gif

Why ask Frankie anything about the 6 count if this is a 2002 thing for Joe?
Sorry, forget my Question from before, Ill just skip the swing pages.

Guess I’ll stick to salsa. http://www.clandisa.dk/forum/images/paperbag_125.gif

[d nice]

Frankie never stopped dancing, he danced every single week. He stopped dancing professionally.

[pygmalion]

I've tried really hard to stay out of this whole thing, because I find it to be counterproductive. But, during karate class today, it came to me that now I have to have a say. Here's what I say.

This whole situation has gotten personal. Way too personal. But, bottom line is it's not personal, and it's not about whom you find to be the most sympathetic figure. If you're anything like me, you feel sympathy and genuine affection for everybody involved. To me, this situation and the questions at hand are about facts. So here are some facts that I don't think anyone can dispute.

1. Black Sheep is a great guy and a knowledgeable teacher, with years of experience teaching lindy hop and other dances. He also successfully ran his own dance studio for many years.

2. dnice is a dance historian, who has spent his career traveling the US and the world, researching lindy and other dances, as well as personally interviewing many of the living legends of these dances.

3. Frankie Manning is alive and well, G_d bless him, and is perfectly capable of answering any questions we may have. In my mind, he's already answered the questions on the table pretty unequivocally, but, if people have lingering doubts, ask him again.


While I don't think matters of historical accuracy are as simple as who remembers what, I'm still with Danish guy on this one. These are not ancient unsolvable mysteries of the Bible. We may never know what Moses meant when he wrote Exodus, since he died a few millenia ago, and can't tell us himself. Frankie Manning, on the other hand, is alive and well, and, from all appearances, fairly accessible.

Let's ask Frankie.

[Swing Kitten]

I thought we did!

[pygmalion]

We did. And he answered. But, we're going to be stuck here until all the dissenters accept the answers. So the question on the table is what will it take to make asking Frankie enough? A tape/video recording was suggested a couple days ago. At that time, I thought it was ridiculous to have to go to those lengths. Now, I wonder.

The thing is that we all have much more in common than we have in dispute. So settle the dispute however you need to, and get back into the helping each other mode.

And asking Frankie can look a million different ways. It could be referring to things he's written, interviews he's done, video footage that's there in the archives. Or, as a last resort, it could be literally asking him again, or more specifically. Whatever it takes. Just settle it.

[Swing Kitten]

I somehow have the feeling that Frankie could come onto these forums, write his own answer and for some reason it still wouldn't be good enough!!

I'm begining to see that the problem is not with the answer but with the hearer of the answer.

Oh how often that is the case!

His breakdown of dance is on video, and is easily accessable by local Library or one's own ordering. Even that, as SwingKitten brings up, isn't enough yet.

-FF

[d nice]

Frankie can be asked in person by anyone who doubts the short answers I gave to the questions. I'll find time in the next week to type up Frankie's stories and long answers. I'm suppssed to give him a call and I'll do that as soon as I figure out how to record the conversation so it can be turned into a digital file so it can be uploaded and made available to everyone on this forum...

Of course some people might doubt whether or not Frankie is actually Frankie... but I can't help that.

[Swing Kitten]

Maybe that will help. However I still have my doubts if even that would convince someone who seems bent on disregaurding anything that does not coincide with his atablished world view. Seriously, is there anyone other than joe who is having any problems accepting the answers given thus far? I can't think of ONE... I also find it amazing the lengths that have already been gone to in order to convince someone of something that they seem to absolutely refuse being convinced of... that he is wrong.

There's nothing wrong with being wrong-- it's doesn't mean they are a bad person or anything... but to admit it and alter one's behavior accordingly is not only a sign of true intelligence but of actual reason.

Black Sheep says he has no problem admitting when he is wrong... which inspired audible laughter on my part... and only reminds me of when he has apologizes for conduct he fails to correct in any sense of a long term manner.

[d nice]

September 19th, 2003 Frankie Manning interview, Sacramento Swing Festival

Who was your favorite band?

I’m not sure you’ve heard of him. He was kind of small, but we liked him. His name was, um, something like, Bay. Base. Oh, Count Basie. (Applause and Laughter) Oh, you’ve heard of him? Yeah, he was the swingiest Swing band that ever swung, Jim. Those cats could swing anything. They get out there and we’d get out there and it was just magic.

Who is the most under appreciated or least recognized contributor to the dance?

Whitey. Herbert “Whitey” White. He got all of us together. When you were dancing and Whitey walked by everyone started dancing all out, knowing he was scouting for talent. Whitey was a good dancer, but his talent was spotting talent in others and developing it. He taught us confidence and pride. He taught us we don’t have to bow down to anyone.
There was this show we were in. It was a Bill Robinson show. Bill Robinson was kind of a bad character. He had been given this silver pistol by the mayor of a city he had performed at. When he shot pool he’d pull this pistol out and set it on the side of the table, so everyone knew he was serious. No one messed with Bill.
So we were in this show and there was this dancer, Dynamite Hooker, he was a tap dancer. When he got of stage there were always the next act waiting to go on in the wings, he‘d just push his way through, knocking people around. I was talking to this beautiful young lady in the chorus line, and off comes Dynamite pushing people around. Well he pushed me, and I jut laid him out. One hit and he was down.
People started pulling me away saying Bill didn’t like any fighting in his shows. That he was going to fire me. Well in those days the lindy hoppers always closed down the show. No one could go on after us. When I got off stage someone was waiting for me. ‘Bill Robinson is waiting for you in his dressing room.’ I went down there to his door and knocked.
‘Who is it?’ he says.
I say, ‘It’s Frankie Manning, the lindy Hopper.’
’Come in.’ So I go in and he’s sitting there just looking at me and then says ‘I don’t like fighting on my sets. Every show there is someone who is a trouble maker and starts fights.’
‘There really wasn’t I fight. I hit him once and he went down. Besides he shoved me. NO one shoves me. NO one puts their hands on me. I’ll hit ANYONE who does.’ I wanted to make sure that he understood I meant anyone, even him.
‘There will be no fighting on my set. If you have a problem see me. Now get out of here.’ I turned and started to leave when he called out to me right as I was at the door. ‘Frankie?’
‘Yes sir?’
‘I’ve wanted to do that for three years.’

That is what Whitey taught us. We were as good as anyone else. Never think that you aren’t never let anyone walk over you.

[pygmalion]

That is a great story. I wonder what his voice sounds like. You can really "hear" his personality in that narrative. What a character he must be! :D

[Swing Kitten]

How absolutely wonderful! Thank you for sharing that and I can't wait to hear more!

[d nice]

He has a slightly smoother voicer than Louis Armstrong. It's funny if I were 50 years older I'd probably sound just like him. My ex finacee actually mistook Frankie for me once upon a time. Really funny.

[Swing Kitten]

hahaha... I'm sure that was. Thanks, the reading is a bit more complete now.

[HepcatBob]

What a character he must be! :D

He is. If you ever get a chance to take a class from him, or attend one of his lectures, I highly recommend it. I've had about 3 brief moments to talk to him and he's one of the nicest people you could ever hope to meet.

[pygmalion]

Hello, Hepcat Bob! Welcome to the forums! :D

Can't you just hear Frankie Manning talk in the interview above? I'm hoping to get to one of his classes quite soon. Anything before the end of the year can't happen, and I haven't seen a schedule for next year, yet. But definitely as soon as I can, G_d willing! :D

Thanks again for joining us!

Jenn :D

[Swing Kitten]

Hello there HepcatBob!

Welcome to the forums!! It's nice to hear from yet another source that Frankie is as wonderful as he seems. How did you find your opportunities to learn from him?

It's nice that we seem to be getting more swing dancers on the forums! Yippee!! Please tell us a bit about yourself and how you came to find the forums!

I look forward to seeing you around.

--Swing Kitten

[HepcatBob]

Hi Pygmalion and Swing Kitten!!

I take it you're not the same Swing Kitten from Yehoodi?

I found out about this board from Yehoodi. I've been posting there for years.

I guess my first experience with Frankie was actually on video. I used to play trombone in a big band here in Greensboro, NC. I was getting tired of the band politics, so I decided to try dancing instead because I still loved the music. I did some searching and found the www.savoystyle.com site. Of course, that was before I knew about classes and workshops, so I ordered the tapes Frankie did with Erin Stevens. I also ordered both 'Can't Top the Lindy Hop' videos. I watched those tapes so much I felt like I knew him.

During my search for instructional help, I found out about Frankie's 85th Birthday Party at the Roseland in NY, so I decided to go. That was the first time I met him in person. I met one of the moderators from Yehoodi at the party and that's how I got started posting there.

Then, in September of 1999, my girlfriend and I went to 'A Natural Ball' in Atlanta. Frankie was teaching there, along with most of the members of 'The Rhythm Hot Shots' and a bunch of other world class instructors. I worked my butt off that weekend. I think I took 5 classes from Frankie, at least 3 from Eddie & Eva from TRHS, a couple from Marcus & Baerbl, and a bunch of others. The event itself was really disorganized, and a lot of people were unhappy with the way it was run, but I still managed to learn a lot.

The last time I took classes from Frankie was here in Greensboro last March. Our local Swing Dance Society brought him here for a couple of days of workshops.

[pygmalion]

That is so cool, HepcatBob!

Sounds like your girlfriend is also into swing dance, which is excellent! :D

Do you have a pretty active swing community where you live? Lots of sponsored dances and workshops, etc.? Please share your experiences. :D

Jenn

[HepcatBob]

I actually met my girlfriend dancing.

Our local scene isn't too bad. Back in 2000, a group of us started the Piedmont Swing Dance Society and it's still going fairly well. Before that, Joel Domoe, who now lives in Atlanta, used to put on dances in Greensboro and Winston-Salem. PSDS (http://www.piedmontswingdance.org) has 2 dances with live bands every month. There is also the Triangle Swing Dance Society over in the Raleigh/Durham/Chapel Hill area. They also put on dances on alternating Saturday nights. The scene in the Triangle is a bit bigger than this area, but it's only about an hour's drive. We also have a place in Greensboro called Green's Supper Club that's pretty good depending on the band that's playing.

[HepcatBob]

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention that the Triangle Swing Dance (http://www.triangleswingdance.org) group does quite a few workshops. They just had Ryan Francois there last weekend. My girlfriend's first Lindy Hop class was at a TSDS workshop with Frankie and Norma Miller back in '98.

[pygmalion]

That's cool, HepcatBob. There's a pretty interesting thread on "Would You Date or Marry Someone Who's Not a Dancer" you should check out. Good for a laugh, if nothing else. Enlightening too. :D :lol:

Sounds like you have a pretty active swing scene, there. Same thing in Orlando, where I live. There's a pretty active swing club affiliated with a local university that sponsors weekly dances, group classes, workshops, and a bunch more stuff. Plus there are quite a few clubs that do swing dances many nights of the week. Lots of fun! :D

[HepcatBob]

I've heard about Orlando. I think there are at least a couple of people from that area that post on Yehoodi.

[pygmalion]

Orlando is definitely not the swing capital of the universe, but there is a lot going going on much of the time. Good enough for me! :D