Recommendations for *guys* styling videos?

[azzey]

Why do we have so few?

I'd really like to improve my afro-cuban movement but find it hard to find any video/DVD's that focus on this for more than a couple of minutes.

If anyone knows of any, please recommend them with a short review.

[ArtsySalsera]

:D Scroll down to Men's Styling Volume 1 (Al Liquid Silver Espinoza)

http://www.dancefreak.com/videos/LA_style.html


:D Also more of Al Liquid Silver Espinoza

http://www.dancefreak.com/videos/millennium.htm

[Pat]

Can anybody comment on the various Al Espinoza styling videos?
At 40$ each they're too expensive to just order blindly.

[Vince A]

azzey,
You only "need" a couple of videos . . . go to wherever SDsalsaguy is dancing or practicing, take a video camera, and you'll get all the salsa styling you'll ever need. . . and, I can only assume that Sabor knows his stuff (I haven't persdonally seen him dance) - so go to wherever he dances or practices and do the same . . . :wink:

[ArtsySalsera]

Can anybody comment on the various Al Espinoza styling videos?
At 40$ each they're too expensive to just order blindly.

:D Al's Hip hop/Salsa shines video is excellent.
It has a few standards like Susie Q but a lot of other
cool stylings too.

I have several of Al and Edie's videos and although I don't have the Men's Styling Volume one because I'm a woman, lol. I'd recommend it off the sheer fact that every video I've seen of theirs is really good.

:D Actually I'm going to order his men's styling video anyway eventually because I'm trying to get one of my partners to find some more inner body movement instead of looking as straight as a board, relying solely on the athleticism of doing the patterns extremely fast without expressive himself with his whole body not just his feet and not just relying solely on patterns denying also the woman a chance to style or do millenium styling (hitting the breaks and pauses to the music).

:D I was at the NY salsa congress when Edie was saying that, some guys are pattern freaks. I don't want to dampen the enthusiasm for leaders who are constantly pushing themselves and it's nice for a guy to keep many different patterns in his repretoire of moves to keep the follower from getting bored. However they are missing out on taking their dancing to a whole other level where the real fun comes in when they don't dance to SOME SONGS/MUSIC differently, expressing more of the horn or congos, keyboard etc., breaks pauses, when they don't learn how to solo shine so she can get down with some solo herself and when they don't let her style especially to slower songs. They don't know what they are missing. :wink:

.

[Pacion]

...I can only assume that Sabor knows his stuff (I haven't persdonally seen him dance) -...

If you haven't already, you can see Sabor here :arrow: :wink: http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=5076&highlight=sabor+video

[youngsta]

But do you really need it azzey? That's a lot of cash to fork out for something I don't think you can learn from somebody else (styling)--unless that is you want to look like them.

[Pacion]

I think it depends Youngsta. It can act as a *guide* until such time as the guy (any guy) has the confidence to develop his own style.

Question for azzey though - what do you mean by styling? Feet? Arms? Body movement ie shoulders, rib cage, hips? Everything? Non of the above?

[Vince A]

...I can only assume that Sabor knows his stuff (I haven't persdonally seen him dance) -...

If you haven't already, you can see Sabor here :arrow: :wink: http://www.dance-forums.com/viewtopic.php?t=5076&highlight=sabor+video
OK . . . he knows his "stuff." That female in the picture also knows her stuff!!!

[ArtsySalsera]

Can anybody comment on the various Al Espinoza styling videos?
At 40$ each they're too expensive to just order blindly.

:D Al's Hip hop/Salsa shines video is excellent.
It has a few standards like Susie Q but a lot of other
cool stylings too. You have the power of rewind if you need
it re-demonstrated many times.

I have several of Al and Edie's videos and although I don't have the Men's Styling Volume one because I'm a woman, lol. I'd recommend it off the sheer fact that every video I've seen of theirs is really good.

:D Actually I'm going to order his men's styling video anyway eventually because I'm trying to get one of my partners to find some more inner body movement instead of looking as straight as a board, relying solely on the athleticism of doing the patterns extremely fast without expressive himself with his whole body not just his feet and not just relying solely on patterns denying also the woman a chance to style or do millenium styling (hitting the breaks and pauses to the music).

:D I was at the NY salsa congress when Edie was saying that, some guys are pattern freaks. I don't want to dampen the enthusiasm for leaders who are constantly pushing themselves and it's nice for a guy to keep many different patterns in his repertoire of moves to keep the follower from getting bored. However they are missing out on taking their dancing to a whole other level where the real fun comes in when they don't dance to SOME SONGS/MUSIC differently, expressing more of the horn or congos, keyboard etc., breaks pauses, when they don't learn how to solo shine so she can get down with some solo herself and when they don't let her style especially to slower songs. They don't know what they are missing. :wink:

.

[azzey]

azzey,
You only "need" a couple of videos . . . go to wherever SDsalsaguy is dancing or practicing, take a video camera, and you'll get all the salsa styling you'll ever need. . . and, I can only assume that Sabor knows his stuff (I haven't persdonally seen him dance) - so go to wherever he dances or practices and do the same . . . :wink:

I already have hundreds of video clips of the best dancers in the world (many different styles). It's a bit of a long trip to go from the UK just to see Sabor. No offense to Sabor. :lol:

Teaching videos are not about just looking at a dancers style, but in breaking the elements down and teaching those. Obviously private lessons would be the best way if you can find an instructor who's style you like. However there must be some decent Rumba videos out there somewhere that teach it.. you can't tell me ALL the pro's went to Cuba.
:wink:

[azzey]

But do you really need it azzey? That's a lot of cash to fork out for something I don't think you can learn from somebody else (styling)--unless that is you want to look like them.

No I don't *need* it, but anything that accelerates the learning process is good and cuts down the amount of money I will eventually have to spend on private lessons. :)

I wouldn't buy Al's videos as although I respect him as a dancer (spent some time talking to him and watching him dance at the UK congress) his style is not mine. I don't want to copy someones style just learn the elements of good styling and then pick and choose, which is what I am doing from the video clips at the moment.

[azzey]

I think it depends Youngsta. It can act as a *guide* until such time as the guy (any guy) has the confidence to develop his own style.

Question for azzey though - what do you mean by styling? Feet? Arms? Body movement ie shoulders, rib cage, hips? Everything? Non of the above?

Everything about the body. Nothing to do with moves or patterns.

Example: I'm talking about how a lot of the LA style guys quite often have their right free hand next to their right hip with fingers extended. It's a little technique that looks good as long as you don't over use it.

The important thing is to have elements of style that the other good dancers dont have, so you look different enough.

What I'm looking for is videos that teach technique, otherwise I will stick with cherry picking elements from the best video clips I have.

[Pacion]

azzey,
You only "need" a couple of videos . . . go to wherever SDsalsaguy is dancing or practicing, take a video camera, and you'll get all the salsa styling you'll ever need. . . and, I can only assume that Sabor knows his stuff (I haven't persdonally seen him dance) - so go to wherever he dances or practices and do the same . . . :wink:

I already have hundreds of video clips of the best dancers in the world (many different styles). It's a bit of a long trip to go from the UK just to see Sabor. No offense to Sabor. :lol:

:shock: You wouldn't travel the 32 days and 32 nights to see Sabor :shock: :wink:

I think it depends Youngsta. It can act as a *guide* until such time as the guy (any guy) has the confidence to develop his own style.

Question for azzey though - what do you mean by styling? Feet? Arms? Body movement ie shoulders, rib cage, hips? Everything? Non of the above?

Everything about the body. Nothing to do with moves or patterns.

Example: I'm talking about how a lot of the LA style guys quite often have their right free hand next to their right hip with fingers extended. It's a little technique that looks good as long as you don't over use it.

Okay, gotcha. Firstly re the hand thing of the LA guys. Don't quote me but that immediately suggests to me that that may have been borrowed from latin dancing. Therefore, doing other dance classes (even if it is just from a beginner's perspective) could be useful.

Now that I know you are in the UK :wink: try contacting Rohan Brown of salsafever.co.uk. You can try calling him on one of the numbers on the website or sending him an email. He has a number of videos that he sells through his website, some of which are afro-cuban/cuban rumba movement based (as in body movement) but I don't know if there are any specifically for men. He knows his stuff (and no, I am not on commission :wink: ) and I think he will be able to advise you on whether he has anything or knows of any particular videos out there. If you have difficulties contacting Rohan, do let me know.

[danceguy]

I'll second what youngsta said...I've taken some styling classes and it just didn't feel right to me. I always pay attention when I see Cubans, Ricans and other Latinos dancing...when you see someone who has flavor that you like...see if there is something you can learn from them.

Play around with these ideas when you practice on your own...I'm just starting to have fun with shines (doesn't mean I'm very good at them) and get a lot of my influence from my MA studies, and from watching people with really unique flair and style. :wink:

If I haven't said it before, if you really want to learn some body control (specifically the chest and abdomen) TAKE PILATES! It is a dancer's best friend! :)

[youngsta]

Yeah for me the little "styling" I developed just kinda happened. I just found I'd developed these personal "quirks" (for lack of a better word) that looked pretty good when I danced. A styling class would feel awkward to me.

[azzey]

:shock: You wouldn't travel the 32 days and 32 nights to see Sabor :shock: :wink:


Erm, no.. if he was a girl maybe. :wink:


Okay, gotcha. Firstly re the hand thing of the LA guys. Don't quote me but that immediately suggests to me that that may have been borrowed from latin dancing. Therefore, doing other dance classes (even if it is just from a beginner's perspective) could be useful.


I've done some Tango and Ciroc. Would like to do some hip-hop and jazz but i'd rather put what little money i have into dancing, videos or privates right now.


Now that I know you are in the UK :wink: try contacting Rohan Brown of salsafever.co.uk. You can try calling him on one of the numbers on the website or sending him an email. He has a number of videos that he sells through his website, some of which are afro-cuban/cuban rumba ...

Thanks. :) I know Rohan personally and have been a fan of his site for long time. There is quite a selection of Rumba videos on there but unfortunately none of them are teaching videos (except for Drumming). Eventually I might have to sucomb to buying several of the Afro-cuba De Matanzas series when they come back in stock. Tres expensivo though :(

I did a couple of Rumba (Guaganco and Yambu) lessons in London with Salsa Caribe which was great. what I'm looking for is a video that teaches something similar so I can practice on my own (inexpensively) :)

[azzey]

I'll second what youngsta said...I've taken some styling classes and it just didn't feel right to me. I always pay attention when I see Cubans, Ricans and other Latinos dancing...when you see someone who has flavor that you like...see if there is something you can learn from them.


Yeah, I've been working on this (a little every day) for the last few months using video clips. Thinking about moving to LA also. :lol: :wink:

[Pacion]

:shock: You wouldn't travel the 32 days and 32 nights to see Sabor :shock: :wink:


Erm, no.. if he was a girl maybe. :wink:

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Thanks. :) I know Rohan personally and have been a fan of his site for long time. There is quite a selection of Rumba videos on there but unfortunately none of them are teaching videos (except for Drumming). Eventually I might have to sucomb to buying several of the Afro-cuba De Matanzas series when they come back in stock. Tres expensivo though :(

I did a couple of Rumba (Guaganco and Yambu) lessons in London with Salsa Caribe which was great. what I'm looking for is a video that teaches something similar so I can practice on my own (inexpensively) :)

Try asking Rohan anyway as he might know of something (and then come back and let us know :wink: ) as there may be other guys out there who are thinking along the same lines as you - want to develop styling, need to do so inexpensively etc etc. I haven't seen it but what about the video Rafael and Janet made? Perhaps there is something on that? Otherwise, the only other option might be to have a private lesson with say Rafael and then ask him if he would mind if you videoed say five minutes of what he showed you in the lesson. I know one can learn from watching but sometimes it is "unnecessarily" more difficult because you don't know the technique the person is using.

[Paou]

Personally, I'll try and video myself dancing as much as possible... My dance partner (and her partner) will come over for practice / dinner and I'll video the practice session.

Then I look at that and try and identify something about my dancing/body movement that I like and something I don't like. Then I try and focus on those two things until I feel I've 'solved' them or internalised them into my dancing.

If you haven't access to a camera, try asking around... many many people in the salsa scene have one... and they may well be willing to film you at/before/after class in exchange for a drink or two ;)

Cheers!

[azzey]

I haven't seen it but what about the video Rafael and Janet made? Perhaps there is something on that?


It's on my list, along with a video camera. :)

Otherwise, the only other option might be to have a private lesson with say Rafael and then ask him if he would mind if you videoed say five minutes of what he showed you in the lesson. I know one can learn from watching but sometimes it is "unnecessarily" more difficult because you don't know the technique the person is using.


I don't think I'd do private lessons if I couldn't video them. Would be a waste of money don't u think? I think I've given up on regular classes now.

[Pacion]

Azzey, some salsa teachers don't mind you videoing a few minutes of what they taught you, some do. :? I think the ones who do take the view that you will then "sell" the video on to "friends" and thereby doing them out of money. Others take the view that if it is a few minutes rather than the WHOLE lesson, it is an aid for YOU and they just see it as an extension of the private lesson they have given you.

I don't know if Rafael minds this or not. Only one way to find out :wink:

[Slawek]

As for rumba You may find interesting Tropical Gem instructional video. I've bought by internet. Unfortunately this is Video Cassette (no DVD) but I converted it to digital version myself. This video is in spanish and last about 30 minutes (to short) but is very good introduction to cuban rumba (basic step with many variations and shows you how to vacunar your partner, some rumba presentation at the end).

What it missess for me is not enough information about body movement (isolation exercises etc.).

[azzey]

As for rumba You may find interesting Tropical Gem instructional video. I've bought by internet. Unfortunately this is Video Cassette (no DVD) but I converted it to digital version myself. This video is in spanish and last about 30 minutes (to short) but is very good introduction to cuban rumba (basic step with many variations and shows you how to vacunar your partner, some rumba presentation at the end).

What it missess for me is not enough information about body movement (isolation exercises etc.).

Thanks for the info. I'd been thinking about getting that for a while but since my Spanish and Italian are not very good AND it's not a DVD I was concerned not to waste my money. I did some Rumba workshops with Tropical Gem at the UK congress and they were excellent. I also have a couple of free video clips of their workshops from another site.

[Slawek]

Thanks for the info. I'd been thinking about getting that for a while but since my Spanish and Italian are not very good AND it's not a DVD I was concerned not to waste my money. I did some Rumba workshops with Tropical Gem at the UK congress and they were excellent. I also have a couple of free video clips of their workshops from another site.

You are welcome. I've also liked very much Fernando and Rafael's rumba classes (at Berlin Salsa Festival). They are very nice guys.

Another hint: Sekou McMiller's "Body Movement and Isolations for Salsa/Mambo" - check Descarga Caribe Home Page.

Why don't You come to Prague on april's 1-3? There will be rumba and men's styling classes with Jazzy. He's great dancer. If you live in UK then there are very cheap flights by RyanAir, Prague is beautiful (as well as Czech girls :) ) and beer is almost for free (not during salsa parties I'm afraid because this is Bacardi Festival).

[Pacion]

Why don't You come to Prague on april's 1-3? There will be rumba and men's styling classes with Jazzy. He's great dancer.

Jazzy and Bente are great!!! :banana:

Prague is beautiful (as well as Czech girls

:roll: and what is there for the girls, other than shopping for crystal? :roll: :wink:

[Slawek]

:roll: and what is there for the girls, other than shopping for crystal? :roll: :wink:

Have you been there? It's magical town (alchemy, philosopher's stone, golem). Just wandering around the old town is a pleasure.

Take a look at the pictures:

http://www.virtourist.com/europe/prague/index.html

http://www.picturesofplaces.com/Europe/czech/prague.html