Opportunity knocks?

[dancin_feet]

Just HAD to tell you guys about a phone call I had from the head of our studio the other night.

They are looking at training a couple of the students up to be able to teach group lessons. And since I have expressed an interest in learning to lead and / or teach, he has asked if I am still interested in being one of the guinea pigs the new system is trialled on. :shock:

The whole idea comes from the fact that it is usually at this time of the year they put feelers out for new instructors. A lot of the time the people who apply don't have any experience and while they are being trained, find out that it is not for them or they just don't have what it takes to teach, ie wasted time and effort for the studio. While I have been taking lessons there, they have put on probably 5 new instructors to the point of taking classes, but only 2 have remained (and they are female).

I wouldn't be actually working for the studio, I'd still be a student (avoiding the fraternisation rules), but be able to take beginner group classes and do some of the administration work so that the fully qualified instructors can concentrate on taking private lessons. I would get credits towards my own programme in return instead of a paypacket. He expects two nights a week (about 3 hours each night) and late Saturday afternoon - probably for administration and weekly staff meeting. The only problem would be if he wants me to work nights in the city studio. Getting from work, home to change and then into the city could be a problem, but I guess we could work that out if this actually happens.

This is something I have thought would be a good idea for a while, and he now seems open to it. I have a lot of thinking to do over the next week or so to decide whether I want in or not. Certainly sounds good to me, but is this an avenue I still want to travel?

What do you guys reckon? Does this sound like a good deal, without committing to too much (considering I still have a full time job to concentrate on).

[Sagitta]

If this is where you could see yourself going..yes. If you are not into the idea of teaching...NO.

[mamboqueen]

It sounds like an economical way to learn to teach. Go for it. Nothing ventured, nothing gained!

[dancin_feet]

The ironic thing is 12 months ago I would have jumped at the opportunity. But the problem would have still remained about getting there on time after working a full time job all day.

I guess the only thing I can do is talk to him about it. I'm not a paid employee after all, I would be earning credits for what I have done for the studio, so I'm hoping that if needed, his start time is flexible. Providing I don't have a class to take in that first session, it should be OK (cross fingers smiley).

I would love to do it. Being at the studio and working at something I love so that I can continue doing more of what I love without hitting the hip pocket is like a dream to me. But I need to remember to be practical. I don't want it to interfere with my full time job or damage the good relationship I already have with the studio.

[DancePoet]

Based on what you are saying it seems that not jumping to a decision and weighing the pluses and minuses makes sense. Talking further and asking questions will give you more info. You'll get a better sense of what the situation might be like, and I'd sleep on the answers to see if other questions develop before finaling your choice.

[tj]

This is something I have thought would be a good idea for a while, and he now seems open to it.

I'd say this statement answers your question.

I think you should go for it, and make sure to set your boundaries upfront to the instructor about when you're available, so that you both understand your expectations.

[newbie]

To sum up, you will be working for them twice a week without being paid? And then you'll come as a student the five other nights of the week?. I would never do that. It's signing up for duties without anything real in return.
Plus, you'll do some teaching and some clerical work. Won't you be taking someone else's job? Someone else who needs this pay, someone else without (unlike you) any other regular job ?
The whole thing seems a very good deal...for the dance studio.

[dTas]

i agree, i think you should go for it.

it will make you a better dancer as well. you'll understand more about the moves and dances.

the best way to learn something is to teach it to someone else. :D

[pygmalion]

I think you sound excited about it. What's the harm in trying it out? Of course, as DP said, you should probably ask some questions and spell out your expectations on both sides before making a commitment.

I guess the question is what are you getting out of it?

What does credit toward your programme mean? And do teachers in training normally pay for their training or do they get trained for free? And what sort of improvement in your own dance ability can you expect to see, with such intensive training?

How do you quantify the value of the time you'll be spending there -- the opportunity cost of not being able to do other things in those same time slots? (like date or take work-related training or just hang out?)

If the two come out even or close, try it out.

One thing -- no two -- I'd be cautious about. One is what happens if the arrangement doesn't work out? Will you and/or the studio be able to manage potentially hurt feelings? And two -- what happens if your being on time for training/classes becomes an issue? Both could become awkward situations because you'll be in the gray area between teacher and student -- in this case, you won't exactly fit in either slot.

If you can resolve those issues(and others I may have missed,) go for it! :D

[dancin_feet]

To sum up, you will be working for them twice a week without being paid? And then you'll come as a student the five other nights of the week?. I would never do that. It's signing up for duties without anything real in return.
Plus, you'll do some teaching and some clerical work. Won't you be taking someone else's job? Someone else who needs this pay, someone else without (unlike you) any other regular job ?
The whole thing seems a very good deal...for the dance studio.

I won't be paid as such newbie, but I will earn credit towards my dancing programme, making it cheaper for me to do what I am doing now. To me, that's as good as a paypacket, without the added hassle of calculating tax, etc. I won't really be taking someone else's job. This work is already done by the other instructors, but they are getting far too busy trying to keep up with it all. They all already work a long week (as compared to the standard here in Aus.) Additionally, wait times are quite long from when the initial inquiry is made, until they can get the new person into the studio for a first lesson. This way they have more slots free to take private lessons, thus bringing in more money to the studio and the whole system works more efficiently.

What's the difference between me and someone else off the street doing this?

1 - I don't require as much training as someone fresh off the street, so I am brought up to speed faster.
2 - The studio avoids the hassle of another employee and all the paperwork that goes with it for what is only a part time job.
3 - I am already a part of the studio culture and know how things work, having a good relationship with the other instructors already. They know I am interested and committed, so the extra training they put in to bring me up to speed is less likely to be wasted.

I know, I sound as if I am trying to convince myself, but I'm just going through all the pluses and minuses in my head (and I must admit sharing my thoughts with you guys on here really does help me to sort it all out).

[DancePoet]

Pygmalion has developed some very good questions that should be answered before making a final choice. Her last two points strike me as being of high importance to keep you out of worse case situations.

[dancin_feet]

I think you sound excited about it. What's the harm in trying it out? Of course, as DP said, you should probably ask some questions and spell out your expectations on both sides before making a commitment.

I am getting excited about it pygma. It's a scary path to go down, but I believe I am up to it. So apparently does the studio, or he would not have contacted me about it.

What does credit toward your programme mean? And do teachers in training normally pay for their training or do they get trained for free? And what sort of improvement in your own dance ability can you expect to see, with such intensive training?

I will have to clarify this, but from our initial conversation, it was credit toward my programme, making the next lot of lessons I book, cheaper. May even be able to use it towards my next showcase routine.

How do you quantify the value of the time you'll be spending there -- the opportunity cost of not being able to do other things in those same time slots? (like date or take work-related training or just hang out?)

Most of the time I am usually at home by myself anyway. I don't see it as a huge interruption to my "away from work" time. I used to be at the studio four nights a week anyway with classes. Most of my "hang out" time with my friends centres around dancing anyway, so the interruption to that will be minimal. I have been looking for something else to do to take up my free time during the week, but as usual, am short of cash. This may kill two birds with one stone!!

One thing -- no two -- I'd be cautious about. One is what happens if the arrangement doesn't work out? Will you and/or the studio be able to manage potentially hurt feelings? And two -- what happens if your being on time for training/classes becomes an issue? Both could become awkward situations because you'll be in the gray area between teacher and student -- in this case, you won't exactly fit in either slot.

Yes, these are two things I will have to make sure we are both clear on before I definitely say yes. Some people at the studio have told me that the owner is a ***** (to put it nicely). I have never had any problems with him, as I understand where he is coming from. He is running a business and decisions have to be made for the image of the studio to remain top class. Business is business, nothing personal. They know me by now and know that I will approach the situation from a professional standpoint. If I sit down and discuss with him my concerns, I have no doubt he will tell me whether he can accommodate or not. One thing I do admire about him, he calls a spade a spade.

[Sagitta]

Glad that this is helping dancin_feet. I mentioned to a friend my idea of using my current job as a baseline, a safety net, and possibly moving into using my dancing interest to make some extra income in the future, and today she already had some good ideas for me. Unlike you I would be starting a brand new program, so that would be a big step, so I'm considering it carefully. If I make a stab at it and it works the potential to expand would be amazing and I could really do well. We'll see...

[delamusica]

Hey all.

I've been reading this for awhile, and have some thoughts that no one's touched on.

How will this affect your relationships with other students? As a teacher, you may be limited in terms of dancing with other students during studio hours, which can be problematic in terms of your practicing and social dancing. Also, how will you handle it when your friends who are also students ask you questions about steps? This happens all the time between students - you're all dancing, someone has a question, you all talk about it and try to help each other. As a studio employee, you may be reprimanded in this situation for "teaching" for free or for "teaching" other people's students, even though it just seems like casual conversation to you.

These things all happened to me when I was just working as a secretary at my studio for a summer - especially the problem with discussing dancing with other students. I was actually instructed not to answer my friends' questions even if I knew the answer, because that was like teaching other people's students - I was to dodge around the answer and tell them to ask their teacher, even if they knew that I knew the answer. And I wasn't even being trained to teach - I only answered the phones and scheduled things! It was very akward, especially because students talk amongst themselves all the time! It's part of the community of learning.

Be sure to establish with your boss whether or not this new arrangement would extend to alter the way that you interact with the other students that are your friends at the studio.

[dancin_feet]

How will this affect your relationships with other students? As a teacher, you may be limited in terms of dancing with other students during studio hours, which can be problematic in terms of your practicing and social dancing. Also, how will you handle it when your friends who are also students ask you questions about steps? This happens all the time between students - you're all dancing, someone has a question, you all talk about it and try to help each other. As a studio employee, you may be reprimanded in this situation for "teaching" for free or for "teaching" other people's students, even though it just seems like casual conversation to you.

Thanks for that dela. Any ideas or potential problems that anyone can see are welcome. I can make a note if I haven't thought of it before.

I won't be a studio employee as such, I'd still be a student, so socialising, etc with other students will not be an issue. Again clarification will be required but I would imagine that would mean that I still cannot associate with the other instructors, other than in a group, which is fine by me.

I'm usually helping people out on the floor anyway and there are two of us who have actually been teaching each other how to lead (without actually taking any lessons). She is away at the moment so I can't ask her if she has had the offer as well until next week ..... I would only be teaching the "social" syllabus so that is all that I will be trained in. This does not include any additional technique or styling. Most of my friends are well into their bronze and silver so I don't see asking questions about basic figures to be an issue, but you never know. I'll put it on my list of questions I have for the studio owner.

He did say to me that the plan was for the "student instructors" to not have any responsibilities at the regular studio parties, but to enjoy the night as usual. Though I would imagine that if I am teaching beginners, I will most probably get them up for a dance at the parties as I will know most of them anyway. The instructors don't teach on the floor at a party (maybe occassionally, but not often) so I will probably mirror their actions and not teach as such but assist if required. I do more than that now so I guess, yes that will have to be clarified as well.

Man, he's either going to be really impressed with my list of questions or look at me with shock. :shock: :lol: I guess it shows I have put a lot of thought into my decision and not just agreed without thinking it through first.

[DancePoet]

I won't be a studio employee as such, I'd still be a student, so socialising, etc with other students will not be an issue. Again clarification will be required but I would imagine that would mean that I still cannot associate with the other instructors, other than in a group, which is fine by me.
Keep in mind that you will likely be associated with the studio and the owners even if you are not technically an employee. Such preceptions could change the way many dancers interact with you even if only in small ways or ways that may not be totally apparent on the surface.

I'm usually helping people out on the floor anyway and there are two of us who have actually been teaching each other how to lead (without actually taking any lessons). She is away at the moment so I can't ask her if she has had the offer as well until next week ..... I would only be teaching the "social" syllabus so that is all that I will be trained in. This does not include any additional technique or styling. Most of my friends are well into their bronze and silver so I don't see asking questions about basic figures to be an issue, but you never know. I'll put it on my list of questions I have for the studio owner.
Good idea!

He did say to me that the plan was for the "student instructors" to not have any responsibilities at the regular studio parties, but to enjoy the night as usual. Though I would imagine that if I am teaching beginners, I will most probably get them up for a dance at the parties as I will know most of them anyway. The instructors don't teach on the floor at a party (maybe occassionally, but not often) so I will probably mirror their actions and not teach as such but assist if required. I do more than that now so I guess, yes that will have to be clarified as well.
You seem like a concientious person, and sharing and helping others is something I like to do, too. Be certain you understand how your current freedoms could be impacted.

Man, he's either going to be really impressed with my list of questions or look at me with shock. :shock: :lol: I guess it shows I have put a lot of thought into my decision and not just agreed without thinking it through first.
It also means you'll discover how much he is willing to respect you when you start asking your questions. If he brushes this stuff off, doesn't give definitive answers, or gives answers that throw up warning signals, then you have more information to make a choice with then you otherwise had.

[dancin_feet]

Glad that this is helping dancin_feet. I mentioned to a friend my idea of using my current job as a baseline, a safety net, and possibly moving into using my dancing interest to make some extra income in the future, and today she already had some good ideas for me. Unlike you I would be starting a brand new program, so that would be a big step, so I'm considering it carefully. If I make a stab at it and it works the potential to expand would be amazing and I could really do well. We'll see...

Good on you Sag! We'll have to compare notes ....... :wink:

[Sagitta]

Man, he's either going to be really impressed with my list of questions or look at me with shock. :shock: :lol: I guess it shows I have put a lot of thought into my decision and not just agreed without thinking it through first.

Either way this is the only way that you ensure you have a clear idea of what is required of you before you make a commitment. This is great. :D

[Sagitta]

Glad that this is helping dancin_feet. I mentioned to a friend my idea of using my current job as a baseline, a safety net, and possibly moving into using my dancing interest to make some extra income in the future, and today she already had some good ideas for me. Unlike you I would be starting a brand new program, so that would be a big step, so I'm considering it carefully. If I make a stab at it and it works the potential to expand would be amazing and I could really do well. We'll see...

Good on you Sag! We'll have to compare notes ....... :wink: Yeah...if this goes through...and I can make the time commitment...requires a ton of work on my part... :?

[delamusica]

I won't be a studio employee as such, I'd still be a student, so socialising, etc with other students will not be an issue. Again clarification will be required but I would imagine that would mean that I still cannot associate with the other instructors, other than in a group, which is fine by me.
Keep in mind that you will likely be associated with the studio and the owners even if you are not technically an employee. Such preceptions could change the way many dancers interact with you even if only in small ways or ways that may not be totally apparent on the surface.

Exactly. Even though you don't see yourself as an employee because you're not getting "paid", others will see you as a teacher, and how they compensate you won't factor into their perception.

I'm usually helping people out on the floor anyway and there are two of us who have actually been teaching each other how to lead (without actually taking any lessons). She is away at the moment so I can't ask her if she has had the offer as well until next week .....

This is exactly the sort of thing that you might not be allowed to do after you go through their training program.

I would only be teaching the "social" syllabus so that is all that I will be trained in. This does not include any additional technique or styling. Most of my friends are well into their bronze and silver so I don't see asking questions about basic figures to be an issue, but you never know. I'll put it on my list of questions I have for the studio owner.

Again, this isn't necessarily a distinction that your friends will be able to make. You're going to have to get really really good at saying "I haven't learned that, yet" - because once you start teaching, they will ask you questions.

You seem like a concientious person, and sharing and helping others is something I like to do, too. Be certain you understand how your current freedoms could be impacted.

Yeah, that's basically my point. Thanks for actually being able to state it, DP. :)

Man, he's either going to be really impressed with my list of questions or look at me with shock. :shock: :lol: I guess it shows I have put a lot of thought into my decision and not just agreed without thinking it through first.

Well, if this is something that he's just starting (the whole "student instructor" thing), then these are concerns that he should have thought about as well. If he hasn't, then you'll be doing him a favor by bringing them to his attention.

[dancin_feet]

Thanks so much guys. I can't tell you how appreciative I am of your advice.

Yes this is a very new thing and I know he will have put a lot of thought into it before approaching anyone because that is just the way he works. Some of my questions he may have answers for, some we may just have to "suck it and see". Depends on the question, I guess, but as with all new things, it is impossible to see every possible issue. As long as he is open and honest with me (which I know he will be) and I am happy with the conditions that we outline, I don't see much of a problem really. As with anything, trust and communication are paramount. Lose either of these things and the whole arrangement could fall apart.

As far as how other students at the studio see me, that's not really an issue. I gave up caring what people think of me a long time ago, realising that people will always have their own opinions, regardless of the actual facts of the situation. There is nothing I can do but be true to myself and follow any guidelines set down. I'm sure there are people at the studio now who don't particularly like me or think I'm a show off. Their opinion matters not, to me. It's the opinion of my close friends that I care about. I have already sounded one friend out and she tells me I should go for it if I can work out a suitable arrangement.

If people want to be jealous or whatever, that is their issue to sort out. The instructors won't listen to them, my friends won't listen to them. I have made my position clear to the head of the studio where I would like to take my dancing, and he has obviously seen enough over the last 12 months to give me the opportunity to follow it through. If they wanted the same thing and didn't let him know or he didn't see that they could cope with it, that's not my fault and I refuse to feel bad because I have been given the chance and they haven't.

[Sagitta]

As far as how other students at the studio see me, that's not really an issue. I gave up caring what people think of me a long time ago, realising that people will always have their own opinions, regardless of the actual facts of the situation. There is nothing I can do but be true to myself and follow any guidelines set down. I'm sure there are people at the studio now who don't particularly like me or think I'm a show off. Their opinion matters not, to me. It's the opinion of my close friends that I care about. I have already sounded one friend out and she tells me I should go for it if can work out a suitable arrangement.

If people want to be jealous or whatever, that is their issue to sort out. The instructors won't listen to them, my friends won't listen to them.

I like this - being true to oneself and knowing whose opinions matter. :)

[DancePoet]

You seem like a concientious person, and sharing and helping others is something I like to do, too. Be certain you understand how your current freedoms could be impacted.
Yeah, that's basically my point. Thanks for actually being able to state it, DP. :)
Thanks Dela. :)

I like fostering the growth of my studio in little ways. Like dancing with new people at the studio which means they have a good time, and this increases the likelihood they will keep coming back. Or helping out a new person with questions or encouragement. Or showing interest in them as people rather then just customers. (The studio owners act like this, too.) And I prefer to be able to do these kinds of things on my terms, rather then under someone else's instructions or timetable.

Man, he's either going to be really impressed with my list of questions or look at me with shock. :shock: :lol: I guess it shows I have put a lot of thought into my decision and not just agreed without thinking it through first.

Well, if this is something that he's just starting (the whole "student instructor" thing), then these are concerns that he should have thought about as well. If he hasn't, then you'll be doing him a favor by bringing them to his attention.
Yep, big thumbs up to Dela's comment here!

[DancePoet]

Thanks so much guys. I can't tell you how appreciative I am of your advice.
Your welcome!

Yes this is a very new thing and I know he will have put a lot of thought into it before approaching anyone because that is just the way he works. Some of my questions he may have answers for, some we may just have to "suck it and see". Depends on the question, I guess, but as with all new things, it is impossible to see every possible issue. As long as he is open and honest with me (which I know he will be) and I am happy with the conditions that we outline, I don't see much of a problem really. As with anything, trust and communication are paramount. Lose either of these things and the whole arrangement could fall apart.
Don't forget respect. We can't see everything, but if your questions are treated with respect, then this is a good indication of how other potential issues will be handled as they arise. Respect is a very valuable asset in all types of relationships.

As far as how other students at the studio see me, that's not really an issue. I gave up caring what people think of me a long time ago, realising that people will always have their own opinions, regardless of the actual facts of the situation. There is nothing I can do but be true to myself and follow any guidelines set down. I'm sure there are people at the studio now who don't particularly like me or think I'm a show off. Their opinion matters not, to me. It's the opinion of my close friends that I care about. I have already sounded one friend out and she tells me I should go for it if I can work out a suitable arrangement.
Fair enough.

If people want to be jealous or whatever, that is their issue to sort out. The instructors won't listen to them, my friends won't listen to them. I have made my position clear to the head of the studio where I would like to take my dancing, and he has obviously seen enough over the last 12 months to give me the opportunity to follow it through. If they wanted the same thing and didn't let him know or he didn't see that they could cope with it, that's not my fault and I refuse to feel bad because I have been given the chance and they haven't.
I agree. I am impressed with how you are looking at this. :D

[dancin_feet]

Don't forget respect. We can't see everything, but if your questions are treated with respect, then this is a good indication of how other potential issues will be handled as they arise. Respect is a very valuable asset in all types of relationships.

I see trust and respect to go hand in hand, but thanks for pointing that out. Yes I guess you can respect someone but not trust them, but to trust someone I have to have respect for them. I hold the studio owner in the highest regard because of his attitude and his talent. I respect the fact that he took my comments on board early last year and has obviously watched me for 12 months to see if I was up to it in his opinion. To me that shows that he respects me too by not dismissing me or just taking me at my word, but keeping the door open and then follow through with this opportunity. Yes it will help him out, but this is a new area, he is taking a big risk by opening this door.

We'll have to see how far that mutual respect goes ......... :D