Personal Space/People Who Grope

[pygmalion]

Check out the horror stories at this link, then come back and sound off, ladies. (Oh yeah, and gentlemen! :lol: ) :D

http://www.havetodance.com/articles/news17.html

[pygmalion]

My worst "groper" wasn't a guy at a dance. It was a dance coach who came into my former studio every couple of months to train the teachers and coach the better students. That guy was a pro! And I don't mean dance pro, although he was that too. :D

His hands always lingered a tiny bit too long. Not long enough for you to make an issue of it without looking stupid. But long enough for him to touch something he shouldn't -- like your tusch, or your belly. Those were his favorites. Uggh! *shudder*

I pity the female teachers who used to have to work with him all day long for the two or three days he was in the studio. :evil:

[danceguy]

Hi,

Being a guy I've never groped any women while dancing, its just not in my nature, a true gentleman at heart. I prefer to be well acquainted and romantically involved with any woman I grope. :)

But - I have noticed that some women will do what I call a "boober" while dancing. For instance, in class one day we're doing very basic ECS moves, I'm leading a man's basic under arm turn. Every time I start the move, instead of going past my advance, my partner turns her body towards me and proceeds to intently rub her boobs on me while I pass by. I think its an accident, but no, each time I start the lead for this move, she does it again, and then smiles like its funny! Eventually, I stop doing this move altogether and actually starting pushing her away while we danced...to give myself some distance. Thank god we rotate partners frequently.
I mean sheesh, if you've got the hots for someone in class, TALK TO THEM AFTER CLASS! Leave that stuff out of a practice session!

Unfortunately, I bet men tend to grope more..but ladies do it too! It's happened to me quite a few times. We all make mistakes and accidently bump someone in a private spot, and a quick apology is all you need. If a lady is doing a sensual move, that's one thing...but when it gets trashy...that's the last dance I'll have with them. :x

[redhead]

Jehn,
I hope that dance instructor was an exception.
In clubs, I believe it's totally up to follower to draw the border. I love sexy moves, but please NO groping involved. If my partner does something I don't feel comfortable with and it's not an accident, I stop smiling and say that if it ever happens again I'm going to walk away. Works like magic. :wink: Once I actually HAD to walk away, and I never dance with that guy, even though he's around quite often and sometimes asks me to dance with him. It seems leaders also talk, and they don't want to lose an OK follower. I'm not trying to say it's OK for guys to do whatever they want, but ladies don't have to be too polite here. :!:

[Sarah]

But - I have noticed that some women will do what I call a "boober" while dancing.


Ew. That is just so -not classy-. She'll probably get what she deserves in the end - a man who likes that sort of thing!

Cheers
Sarah

[pygmalion]

I've heard a few stories of women harassing men on the dance floor, but, sorry to say, many of them (the guys I know) like and encourage it. My friend J_____ was telling me the other day, how a lady at the club was giving him "full body contact." Not for smooth dancing, for nightclub freestyle, which involves no body contact, that I know of. And he loved it. What a lech! He's loveable, though. Just misguided. :shock: :D :lol:

And yes, that coach, I believe, is the exception. I just figured I'd mention him, since I've been itching to talk bad about him for quite a while. :lol:

[borikensalsero]

Talk about groping ladies... In NY City it is bad!!! They seem to be very aggressive...

I get it really bad, But I got my moves down pat for those girls who don't care to dance but get dirty. 1- I'm passed the hooking up when I go out. 2- I just want to dance girl.

When the girls decide to back that thing up, I do the moon walk baby! It aint reggea girl. I'll back up as she backs up until she stops, then I stop. My friends actually laugh at me when I do it.

There are the ones who can't wait to finish a move with their crotch rub on my thigh. Here comes the end of the move, and oooops here I go with a solo shine... Sorry, I missed that you hadn't finished.

Then the girls who rather put their boobies all over me, just because I get close it doesn't mean that you have to rub your chest all over me. Time and place, baby, time and place.

Then the ones who seek the kiss, ahhhhhhh, crapola, can't we just dance... Thanks for making me feel like Brad Pitt but I just wanna dance...

I've even gotten girls to hand me keys to their cars and tell me they'll wait in the parking lot. But hey, My line for those is, I'M GAY, girlfriend.... They respond with, what a waste, until they see my lady give me a kiss. :wink:

How about the ones who chase after you all night long. No matter where you hide they are after you. They give you the looks, the smile, the flurty tooch on the shoulder.. They OMG, you dance so sexy... Ahhhhh be quiet and dance!!!

There is a huge difference between dancing sensual and dirty... Some people actually pull it off, others just don't seem to know the difference.

Now that I'm done with say things about girls, I have seen Girls get it much worse than us males. Some guys just don't give a load about what they do or say to a girl when dancing.

[pygmalion]

:shock: What! Women who grope? Yuck! I guess I'm more old fashioned than I thought. :lol: Just for you, boriken, I'm going to change the title of this thread to people who grope, not just guys.

That does remind me of the time I was out nightclub freestyling (meaning dirty dancing :lol: )with one of my dance teachers. Some hoochy chic comes up behind him and starts doing all sorts of semi-obscene stuff. He turned to her and said, "I am SO gay." Hehe! :lol: The funny thing about it is that he IS gay. Really gay. What a hoot! :lol:

[DanceMentor]

THat thing about the moonwalk.... :lol: :lol: :lol:

What I hate is when I'm teaching a group lesson and the guys aren't even there to learn, they just want to grope the girls. They don't do anything that you can nail them on, but the girls don't show up the next week. I hate it when that happens.

And yes...there are some prominent coaches out there that grope the students. A had one coach show my partner how to tuck her pelvis by grabbing her kanushka and pulling upward. This coach was also a female. I've also heard of the same ploy with male instructors.

[msc]

Just as bad is when guys who think they know a lot start lecturing and berating new women who show up at the studio. Amazing how quickly psychological manhandling will drive them off too.

That's a funny story about teaching the hip tuck. I try to press through the lower back with a flat hand, down to stretch the hips into the floor, then up to force the tuck once they have sufficient stretch, if someone asks me about that kind of stuff. Fortunately, people rarely ask, and I am more than happy not to tell.

[borikensalsero]

:shock: What! Women who grope? Yuck! I guess I'm more old fashioned than I thought. :lol: Just for you, boriken, I'm going to change the title of this thread to people who grope, not just guys.

That does remind me of the time I was out nightclub freestyling (meaning dirty dancing :lol: )with one of my dance teachers. Some hoochy chic comes up behind him and starts doing all sorts of semi-obscene stuff. He turned to her and said, "I am SO gay." Hehe! :lol: The funny thing about it is that he IS gay. Really gay. What a hoot! :lol:

WEPA.... I feel special now... A title change just for me :D

[mellody43]

I think the groping issue is a toughie -- like sexual harrassment. For example, I've noticed that for certain guys I tolerate VERY LITTLE in terms of physical familiarity. I walked off the dance floor because I gave a guy two warnings that he was holding me a little too close for my liking. 3rd strike and he was out. Buh-bye!

However, for other partners, I am more lenient - not that they do anything inappropriate (there are still limits!) but I feel more comfortable with them and perhaps also don't take their actions the wrong way -- i.e. I know when it's a mistake.

For me it's about having class. You can flirt and still be classy. Some men have not grasped this; neither have some women. Those women stick out like sore thumbs, sadly.

I think I've done the "dance by boobing" myself on a few occasions, sometimes unintentionally, LOL! If I'm dating the person I am definitely going to do those little things (not obvious to others) that let him know he's special! But that's the trick -- it's a secret, it's between you two, and therefore much more fun.

But I digress.

*off in la la land*

Melissa

[SDsalsaguy]

Ok, I know that mistakes do happen... which brings to mind my first experience of what I term the speed bump effect.

Earlier on, in my salsa life, I did one particular move where I set the girl into a free spin and then reach in and pick her back up by the back of her shoulder blade. Well, on this particular night I had one particular partner who was a bit spin happy and launched herself into a double spin... needless to say when I reached in to pick her back up I got the speed bump effect – "bump-bump" – as she completed her extra rotation. :oops:

[msc]

yeah, gotta be careful on the pickup, no doubt.

Avoidance of the speedbump effect is the reason for "tracing the body" at the waist, then sliding the hand up the back to reestablish connection.

Personal space can become a bit of an issue in the Standard dances as well.

[SDsalsaguy]

believe me msc, I learned my lesson! :shock:

[Sarah]

Ok, I know that mistakes do happen... which brings to mind my first experience of what I term the speed bump effect.

.....launched herself into a double spin... needless to say when I reached in to pick her back up I got the speed bump effect - "bump-bump" - as she completed her extra rotation. :oops:

An aikido story for ya - aikido is a grappling sort of art and a certain amount of body contact is necessary. I was acting as crash test dummy for a guy somewhat junior to me when the technique he was practicing turned completely to custard, he lost his balance, flailed wildly and ended up with a handfull of left, um, speedbump. I swear the guy teleported six feet and stood there stammering apologies, glowing bright red :oops: with eyes as wide as dinnerplates. Poor thing.
Sensitive and compassionate wee creature that I am, I responded to his obvious distress and contrition by cracking up in the middle of the mat. :lol:

Cheers
Sarah

[pygmalion]

Personal space can become a bit of an issue in the Standard dances as well.

Amen to that! How do I say this delicately? Hmm. Ladies, make sure you stay well to the gentleman's left side. Unless you want to know him very well. :lol:

[SDsalsaguy]

Umm, unless I missed that lesson I think the woman is meant to stay on man's right side... :wink:

[pygmalion]

LOL! Left, right, whatever. I get mixed up after a couple glasses of merlot. :lol:

Either way, stay to the side, girls! :lol: :D

[SDsalsaguy]

Either way, stay to the side, girls! :lol: :D
Exactly, so left or right but definately not "whatever" please! :lol:

[pygmalion]

LOL! You're the only guy I know who'd ask for NO whatever! LOL! :lol:


That said, it can be tough. Like the time I was in a cha cha formation doing this complicated hand to hand move to change partners, and when I reached for my next partners' hand, accidentally grabbed his .... um ... meat and two veg! :lol: How embarrassing! :oops: :lol:

[SDsalsaguy]

LOL! You're the only guy I know who'd ask for NO whatever! LOL! :lol:
Timing Jenn, timing...there's a time and place for everything! :D :wink:

[Spitfire]

Is this problem mainly seen at night spots or at dances in a ballroom type environment?

At a dance in a ballroom setting I have never heard of this being a problem here, only at nightclubs and it isn't just the men who are the guilty party. I've been grouped myself on occasion at these spots; usually by women who've had a lot to drink.

I might add that it happens off the dance floor.

[danceguy]

Sensitive and compassionate wee creature that I am, I responded to his obvious distress and contrition by cracking up in the middle of the mat.

Hmm, I hope when he picked up the shattered pieces of his ego that he got even with you. :)

At a dance in a ballroom setting I have never heard of this being a problem here, only at nightclubs and it isn't just the men who are the guilty party. I've been grouped myself on occasion at these spots; usually by women who've had a lot to drink.

Well I've been "booberated" right in the middle of a very formal class. Thinking back to it, I knew that by the way lady was acting that she was going to do something like that. It was just totally unexpected...and I'm surprised my teacher didn't notice...like what would she say?

"Hey, over there, stop rubbing your knockers on that poor young man! He's young enough to be your son! Introduce him to your daughter if you think he's cute, but you leave him be!"

Ahem. Now I see these types of ladies a mile away. Not very many of them...I had another try and do it during a Caress...so I just starting moving out of boob range to avoid that. Hmm, at dances...its happened a few times.

The bottom line for me is to have class and to respect others. Someone had mentioned getting gropy with your significant other, and if any romantically involved couple didn't do this I'd think something was wrong! But for someone you don't know who's there just to dance...it really is quite rude to be so out of control. It's like DanceMentor was saying...for us new folks...we're already nervous as hell taking our first lessons, trying to keep the beat and not stomp of someone's toes. If someone proceeds to do something lascivious to us in this early stage...it can really make us want to leave and never come back. I'm not trying to judge what others do, but if being trashy is your style, then save it for the trashy clubs.

I'm not even into flirting...and honestly its a big turn off for me when women do this. There are so many ways to let someone know you appreciate them...or find them attractive. A warm smile, having your eyes showing the real you...and simply just the connection hand to hand, a person's touch can tell us so much about who they really are. You don't have to get too close...you don't have to grope or cop a free feel...if it magic's there, you'll know it as soon as you start to dance...maybe even long before that. :)

And if it isn't, well thank god most dances are only 3-5 minutes! :shock:

[pygmalion]

"booberated"? Is that a word? :lol: :lol:

What gets me about this is, I don't see what these people hope to accomplish with their antics. The way I see it, any man I can "land" by "booberating" him, is a man I don't want. Hmm. I just don't understand the mentality. Whatever. *shrug*

[Sarah]

Sensitive and compassionate wee creature that I am, I responded to his obvious distress and contrition by cracking up in the middle of the mat.

Hmm, I hope when he picked up the shattered pieces of his ego that he got even with you. :)


Don't worry - we `kissed and made up' in an appropriate manner for a martial arts setting ;). I think he was mostly too relieved that I wasn't furious with him to worry about his ego. Accidents happen!

Cheers
Sarah

[danceguy]

"booberated"? Is that a word?

I believe I may have just invented it. :lol:

Please also see my complete list of terms for this strange phenomenon:

Bosom Bashed
Melon mangled
Bathycolpiated
Mammosion
Titrified

What gets me about this is, I don't see what these people hope to accomplish with their antics. The way I see it, any man I can "land" by "booberating" him, is a man I don't want. Hmm. I just don't understand the mentality. Whatever. *shrug*

My thoughts are that this how a lot of people communicate...more physically/sexually than mentally and emotionally. And that's fine if it's both people are into that...but if one person clearly is not, then it isn't ok at all. :evil:

[pygmalion]

I can't see that bosom bashing is okay with somebody you don't know, no matter how you slice it. At least, not unless the guy has given some indication he likes that kind of thing. People are weird. :?