Ballroom Dance > Videos > 1979 World Championship - Standard

Discussion in 'Videos' started by Musique, Mar 18, 2008.

  1. Kitty

    Kitty New Member

    so? as i said, it is not about "mistakes". If I do nothing at all I dont' make any mistakes. Does it mean I am dancing better if i am just standing there?
    Define a mistake.


    The things I am working on eveyr day are the same things i have worked on from day 1.

    Footwork is not a goal, footwork is part of the means... correct footwork should be a result of the correct actions in the body. If my weight is in the right place at the right time, i will have no choice but take a heel lead, or do a toe on outside or inside edge of the foot, etc.

    Bronze level beginners usually do not achieve the swinging action and therefore can achieve the "footwork" by step by step placing their feet "correctly".

    Couples in the middle level are striving to achieve the correct action in the body. swinging (or other actions) mean that at some point you are not in control to pick up and place your foot, because you are involved in one long action that determines the steps. in this case you are not in control to pick up and place your feet correctly, and often you might make "footwork mistakes" when something does not go as planned. But the action you are doing is a whole world more correct than what a bronze beginner does...

    the top couples of course have trained their actions to perfection, and therefore their actions correct actions also always result in correct footwork.


    I have not seen wrong footwork from Alessia Betti or any other top lady or man.
     
  2. Chris Stratton

    Chris Stratton New Member

    The converse of this is that when the footwork is wrong, it usually indicates a failure of either understanding or execution of the overall movement.

    Yet quite often wrong, in that it fails to achieve details that are presented in bronze classes. This gets interesting when you see a top teacher taking a top couple to task over those specific details. Sure, their dancing is great, but the point of the lesson is that they've slightly missed some basic targets. Often they will be asked to do these things in isolation to set the feeling of them - in the hope that they can then have them occur as a natural result of their overall complete dancing.

    I have seen things that are definitely less than optimal.
     
  3. Warren J. Dew

    Warren J. Dew Well-Known Member

    Is it? Or is it louder to distract from more fundamental issues?

    Take the fallaway and reverse pivot that the Gleaves do near the beginning of their tango. As you say, it looks elegant, easy, and perfect. Today's top couples often look like their dancing requires a lot more effort, even when they are doing the same figure.

    Yet, at the same time, the Gleaves cover far more distance - without seeming to try - and the figure flows into the following rotations better. Why?

    I'd suggest that it's because of technique - the lack of, as you put it, "mistakes". Strong heel leads and toe releases permit each stride to cover more distance with less effort. Properly aligned spinal columns facilitate rotational acceleration.

    There used to be a saying that ballroom was about doing difficult dancing and making it look easy. Now the focus seems to be on making it look difficult. But is it really difficult, or does it just look that way?

    Talk to a ballet dancer - or Irish, or Highland, or whatever - and they'll tell you that dancing more slowly is more difficult than dancing faster. The same is true of ballroom. You know that wonderful instant at the top of a good natural turn when you're momentarily suspended in midair? Now slow the music down to half speed and try to make the moment last twice as long. That would not be easier; it would be more difficult, if not impossible.

    To you, half a dozen head flicks in a single bar might look "more difficult". If you look closely, though, you'll see that each action is cut short - there's no fullness, no continuation of the extension, no filling of the music. The Gleaves and others in these videos take the time to do a fuller - and more difficult - action. A direct comparison of the Gleaves' rondes with the same movement on a show video elsewhere on this forum - of one of the couples you mentioned - should also illustrate the difference. To me, once I've seen the Rolls Royce, squeezing a dozen Yugos into the same space no longer looks "difficult" - it just looks "busy".

    Let's just say, of the ladies you mention, I think Hazel has proper spinal alignment. Of course, what's painful for me to watch may not be painful to you; you may be so used to seeing the arched backs that they seem normal to you.
     
  4. Chris Stratton

    Chris Stratton New Member

    with those skirts they had to have good footwork!
     
  5. Kitty

    Kitty New Member

    Warren, you make lots of assumptions and generalizations.

    the feeling i get is that the biggest of your assumptions is that all of the current competitors are a part of a conspiracy the goal of which is to dance "wrong" and refuse to work on "what is really important".

    I find it impossible to discuss anything with a person that assumes and generalizes so much.
     
  6. latingal

    latingal Well-Known Member

    to each his or her own opinion, but let's keep the general respect going for all our members here.
     
  7. Egoist

    Egoist Member

    Smoothness, efficiency, effortlessness are characteristics that are STILL pursued in dancing. They just aren't enough anymore. Nowadays, one needs to be dynamic and powerful TOO.
     
  8. Chris Stratton

    Chris Stratton New Member

    There's no "conspiracy", simply a very human and very widespread tendency to do what produces near term results. Pretty soon everyone is moving in the same direction, which makes it seem like the normal course of action, with the alternative examples mostly retired.

    Early on, in syllabus events, superior technique can help achieve that initial comfort and capability sooner. For the average champ dancer though, it's practically become more about doing fully, with technique that is merely adequate enough to support that. Only towards the top does the quest for technical perfection start to again become the main decision factor in placements. And you can't even blame the judges for that, as they can only mark the couples that turn up to dance - theoretically perfect technique won't earn anything, unless it's used to put a fully danced performance on a competition floor.

    No conspiracy, just coincident and self-reinforcing-trend decision making.
     
  9. star_gazer

    star_gazer Active Member

    I said to my kids a while back...I think you need to simply your routines and focus on basic technique. We'd love too but its too late for that said my daughter. I didn't pursue it but I think there is a lot of pressure to keep up with the changing style. I too wish there wasn't so much emphasis on style that stresses the neck and back but ??? what do I know.
     
  10. Egoist

    Egoist Member

    I think there's too much emphasis on competition. Often the winners are not the ones with the best technique but with the best look and mediocre technique. Everyone should just stop worrying about results, go back to doing basics...



    and let me take care of the winning.
     
  11. Standarddancer

    Standarddancer Well-Known Member

    like the dancing, but not those dresses - make lady dancers look shorter:(
     
  12. sofi

    sofi New Member

    Thank you very much for sharing this! As a newcomer to ballroom, it is very interesting to see footage from an earlier time period.

    I'm quite curious about where the dress trend came from. Didn't the ladies wear full ballgowns in the European ballrooms?
     
  13. ashybang

    ashybang New Member

    Lovely to see Richard and Janet Gleave in action.
    Very enjoyable videos.
     
  14. Laura

    Laura New Member

    I just tried to watch them and I'm getting a message that the videos are no longer available?
     
  15. GJB

    GJB Well-Known Member

    Me too. But I noticed that youtube is doing site maintenance so maybe that's the problem.
     
  16. Laura

    Laura New Member

    HOLY C**P, did anyone not notice the orchestra playing M's "Pop Musik" while dozens of kids line danced?

    (You could have warned us of that mind-melting experience. :) )
     
  17. Laura

    Laura New Member

    Some people can't deal with seeing the short poofy skirts, but they're great for one thing: I got a really great look at what Janet was doing. So light and precise.
     

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