Tango Argentino > Videos > Butt wiggling and flashy footwork are not tango

Discussion in 'Videos' started by jantango, Feb 21, 2013.

  1. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    I've heard the idea. I took it to mean, as it was said to me, to learn how to use the floor as part of the dance, rather than just something to be on top of - to let ones feet become more familiar and interactive with the floor.
  2. twnkltoz

    twnkltoz Well-Known Member

    Sending your energy down into the floor and being grounded. Using the floor to help you balance and be stable.
  3. UKDancer

    UKDancer Well-Known Member

    I do know what is meant by these expressions, but they frequently baffle beginners: and they don't really signify anything very helpful.

    Gravity takes care of my energy going down into the floor, it really does. It is such a successful strategy, that you can't alter its effect even a little bit for some of the time. And look at the converse of the second idea: not using the floor to help balance or be stable.... Do you see what I mean?

    Sometimes, in dance, as in other things, we use vocabulary and concepts that we insufficiently unbundle for the benefit of those who might otherwise be helped by them. This is such an example.
    NZ_Guy, Bailamosdance and Mladenac like this.
  4. Mladenac

    Mladenac Well-Known Member

    Using complicated words and terms makes complicated things only more complicated not simpler.

    If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough.
    Albert Einstein

    Teacher might use KISS Principle for change and more people would more easily grasp the AT.
    (KISS is an acronym for "Keep it simple, stupid" as a design principle noted by the U.S. Navy in 1960.[1][2] The KISS principle states that most systems work best if they are kept simple rather than made complex; therefore simplicity should be a key goal in design and unnecessary complexity should be avoided.)
    Bailamosdance likes this.
  5. twnkltoz

    twnkltoz Well-Known Member

    I'll give you that. When you first introduce that concept, it can be baffling for them. It's kind of a weird concept, and I haven't been able to find a more accessible term for it.
  6. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    I think those with a martial arts training have no problem understanding the term grounded. But they are going to be a minority. But then I am not attempting to teach anything here. I learnt the term through Tai Chi and it was practically demonstarted and applied; if an opponent pushes you, you resist by transmitting the force through your limbs into the floor, so the skill lies in aligning and positioning those limbs for best effect. The same is true for dancing tango; you are working with a partner, sharing moving energy and positioning ourselves to maintain balance and moving through positions of instability to stability.
    twnkltoz likes this.
  7. jantango

    jantango Active Member

    There is an Argentine expression which appears in a tango lyric -- "Sacarle viruta al piso" --- to dance with lots of enthusiasm.

    The word viruta means wood or metal shavings; piso is floor.

    I've been told that a female teacher in BsAs tells her students to walk like elephants. I doubt milongueros viejos would agree.

    I like to think of it as drawing on the floor. Our feet remain close to and in contact with the floor so we do not lose balance between steps and do not injure others in social dancing.
  8. Mladenac

    Mladenac Well-Known Member

    It seems that part of the words are from this milinonga:

    But i don't know the rest.
    Could you be so kind and translate it?
  9. jantango

    jantango Active Member

    The phrase is in many tango lyrics.
    This is not a site for translations.

    The topic of discussion is social tango with feet on the floor.
  10. twnkltoz

    twnkltoz Well-Known Member

    Oh...I thought the topic was judging how other people dance. My mistake.
  11. jantango

    jantango Active Member

    This tells us that you do not dance tango.
  12. twnkltoz

    twnkltoz Well-Known Member

    Well, luckily I don't dance with you, but I do with the best leaders in our community and they would disagree with your assertion. And since they're the ones I'm more concerned about pleasing, I'm OK with that.
  13. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    You're a better man than me. While I think I know what grounded means (balanced and stable), I have no clue what sending energy into the floor means. I do know that if you send enough force into the floor, the result will be that you jump (physics). I don't think that's what she meant by that energy thing, though.

    Basically, I agree with you, in that I don't use ambiguous terms like those.
  14. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    There are dance concepts that do not readily translate into mere words. The fact that some teachers do a poor job of this, choosing to just state the concept rather than explain it fully, doesn't mean teachers should not attempt to teach it. And some teachers don't really, deeply understand the concepts to begin with.

    Still, some advanced dancers know that there is something meaningful there that is beneficial to understand. Doesn't that mean that teachers should at least try to convey the idea, if they can?
  15. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    There ARE very competent people here in the US who teach dance, and how to TEACH dance. But, this is AT, so I don't expect anyone to agree that teachers should actually learn how to explain things in a coherent, consistent way.

    Oh, and I took the initial use of the term "the floor" to be interacting with the other couples who were dancing at the time.

    Don't get me started on the business of "the floor pushes back with an equal force."
  16. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Actually, elephants walk very carefully and delicately. They are quite picky about what they put their feet down on. They are essentially walking on tiptoe because of their foot structure. So while I don't advise followers to walk on tiptoe, the smooth elegant silent walking of an elephant could be something to aspire to.

    LKSO likes this.
  17. UKDancer

    UKDancer Well-Known Member

    Yes, of course.

    But it does, doesn't it?

    This is why we should be careful in what we say on this subject, lest we convey a meaning opposite to that intended.
  18. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    I don´t want to comment on true "tango" dancing, nor on tango in general or any specific tango style. I don´t also regard only the usage of the words frame or arms as an barricade argument. A frame simply is a field of force and advanced dancers (this actually may exclude some milongueros) do use frames of course. I do not mean those narrow and horizontal BR style frame. And yet, nevertheless in large colgadas we also make heavy use for this variant too, but with the only difference, that the focal point is extended further down to our feet. And concerning arms, any touching part of your body is a means of leading. José El Turco once said (not directly me, unfortunately) I lead with every part of my body, even with my butt. And watch what he got out of this lady. The qualitiy makes the difference, not the very part you lead with.
  19. UKDancer

    UKDancer Well-Known Member

    You've done it now: they're not tango, either. ;)
    opendoor likes this.
  20. Mladenac

    Mladenac Well-Known Member

    Those are the jokes for the intellingent ones

    I talked to the professional balerina and she was talking about French, Russian and English schools.
    That she can recognize from which school certain elements come from.
    And that nowadays everything is less obvious cause of travelling dancers and choreographs.

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