Tango Argentino > Videos > Canyengue or Orillero?

Discussion in 'Videos' started by opendoor, Nov 5, 2008.

  1. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

  2. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    Canyengue.
     
  3. newbie

    newbie Well-Known Member

    To my knowledge, cayengue is danced with the guy's left arm at waist level. This is how it was danced by our teachers when they gave a lecture about the evolution of A.T

    Also if you look at this

    http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=CSMCOoljjew

    So, I'd say that your video is non-canyengue.
     
  4. bastet

    bastet Active Member

    I used to say Canyengue because of the music, but an older gentleman I dance with from Argentina says Canyengue (as a dance style) doesn't use crosses and all the videos I look at use a low left arm on the leader so now I am honestly not sure....the music is, at least...
     
  5. newbie

    newbie Well-Known Member

    Yes our teachers said that too, and made no crosses when they demonstrated it.
     
  6. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    From what little I know of Orillero (and I know nothing of C.) the guys left arm is low around the waist in O as well because the effort is make contact throughout the torso and especially low as opposed to the higher chest contact of tango.

    This piece looks like a show piece that starts as something but then adds other stuff just to make it a "performance" for an audience and may or may not be true to a style from start to finish.

    It has passages that remind me of what Omar Vega taught as Orillero, but very little of the piece maintains that "dirty dancing" positioning. He told us in a workshop on Orillero that it is very down and dirty and sexy, very close together with even the lower part of the body together (crotch contact), very bent knees, very much down into the floor. There was even an element of having the legs wrapping slightly as you step which increases the sense of some kind of sexual position.

    To use a reference from another thread, NOT elegant. And not something you'd really want your grandmother to see you doing. And certainly not something I'd do as a performance with people watching on the street. Think the party scene from Dirty Dancing. (without all those backbends and such)... the Tango equivalent of that. Probably could get you arrested in at least some of the states. Of course it was only a workshop, and maybe all those other fancier moves would come in later, but somehow this felt more like a show piece than anything else to me.

    Or maybe Omar was exagerating the sexual part or I misconstrued the need to maintain that posture (believe me it wasn't easy to get people do ANY of that in a workshop with strangers so he was really adamant about it)

    But I know that gathering info on the style and attempting to find older dancers who remembered it from its origin and could help him preserve it was one of the things he was working on in the time before his death.

    So although I saw that a few times in this dance, they danced offset or open far too much to match what Omar was teaching as Orillero.
     
  7. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Interestingly, I found on YouTube a video of a couple named Kenji y Liliana (Japanese I belive) doing what they call Tango Orillero and it bears NO resemblance whatsoever to what Omar taught. Unfortunately I couldn't find much else by searching Tango Orillero on YouTube
     
  8. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Omar on Orillero

    Hi, do you mean these videos of Omar Vega ?

    http://www.virtuar.com/tango/linkblog.htm

    I just found that there are also some other links to Orillero ressources on this blog site.
     
  9. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Wow... I've never seen those old ones. No, I don't know of a video of Omar doing what he taught us in the Orillero workshop. However, his crouching low style as seen in the video from the 2005 Tango Festival (wearing white) bears more resemblance to it than these older videos.

    I am not really familiar with all the various older "folk" based dances (if that's even the correct term) such as Cambio, Canyengue, Condombe, Cumbia (why do they all start with C?) with the exception of Chacarera which of course is structured totally different than any kind of partnered tango.

    I know that Omar was heavily influenced by the African dances as well as the earlier South American dances that sprung from them. So I couldn't even really say how much his tango milonga is actually based on any of those dances. But at least one of those early videos from the site you posted was very clearly tango. (#3) Another was milonga (#2) and the first didn't play evenly for me so I'm not sure but of the 3 it seemed to have the most influence of something besides milonga or tango.
     
  10. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    Hence, my first post.

    Which, actually, is who/what I compare Orillero to.
     
  11. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Hugo posted a clip showing Arolas playing Derecho Viejo and a couple dancing to it. To my mind, they dance very modern: you can see a lot of voleos, enrosques and a corte.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9fpCj5hY_U

    But I don´t know the period shown, the style danced. Is it Golden Age?

    By the way, I like how Arolas wraps his squeezer at the end of the clip.
     
  12. newbie

    newbie Well-Known Member

    The milonguero-estilo activists will have to stalk this tape and burn it.
     
  13. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member


    I'm not sure I want to know what that means....
     
  14. Ampster

    Ampster Active Member

    He was wrapping his bandoneon at the end. Is this what you meant?
     
  15. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Hi Zoopsia, hi Ampster,

    in german we call a free-reed draft-action instrument (either bandoneon, concertina, harmonica, and accordeon) often colloquially "quetch-kasten, or short quetche". So I was very surprised that this term was used by players from the US in a one-to-one translation, too (squeeze-box, or short squeezer). The term "quetch-kasten" was especially used by sailors and so it is still done here in Hamburg. I think the expression was not in use in Eastern-Saxony where the bandoneons were foremostly manufactured. I read in a bandoneon history article, that the instrument was brought to northern America by sailors prior to Argentina.

    The rest of my post is off-topic:
    Years ago I played guitar in a folk band specialized on irish, english, and nether-german (dialect from the north) music. I wanted to expand my options and began to look for a concertina, an instrument often used in folklore. I found one (thought it to be one) at the fish marked in Hamburg. This is a very famous traditonell marked place. You can buy almost everything but especially fish directly from the fishing boats. Today a lot of tourists come to see it (Especially after a Reeperbahn turn, because the marked starts at 5 a clock on sunday morning. You know, Reeperbahn is the old porteño amusement area where the Beatles started their career). I played this old instrument when I studied at university: 9 buttons missing, scarred in and outside, but still in tune. Then I forgot about my squeezer for almost 30 years. When I started to dance TA, I began to dig all my boxes and cardboards in my cellar, and, there it was: a pre-WW-I bandoneon, only 110 voices (for students) but with rhinic button lay out, bought for a song at that place in Germany that is nearest to the river Plata area. I am still working to repair it in summer holidays.
     
  16. mshedgehog

    mshedgehog New Member

    From 00:25 where they adjust the hold, they are doing something that looks quite like what I have been taught in Canyengue classes. Then it changes back and I think it's still obviously similar, but more of a mixture of that and milonga.

    I don't have a definition of Canyengue except based on those classes, and I don't know how far it is reasonable to say something is or is not "Canyengue".

    I believe that the couple who taught it to me, learned it from the same Marta and Manolo who are mentioned here, and what they taught as Canyengue was just like what you see in this video:

    [yt]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/Y8hFSftOR6s&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/Y8hFSftOR6s&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/yt]

    The music in your video is also just the same as was used in the classes I did.

    Off-topic technical reminiscence: It took me some time to learn how to do the different embrace in a way that felt comfortable, but when I got it, it felt wonderful, and perfect for the music, which I also like a lot. I wish more people knew how to do it. It just feels delicious for the woman. Trying to dance it socially, the problem I found was that my partners, who had been taught in the same classes, would sometimes start in a tango embrace and then try to switch to Canyengue when they thought of it. I found the switch very difficult to make during dancing, without leaning too much on my partner, so this wasn't a great success. I think the couple in your video are doing better than I did at solving the same problem, but it still disrupts the dance.
     
  17. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Who knew there was more than one "Daniella y Luis"?

    I didn't.

    But the couple by that name (from France) on the video is NOT the Daniela y Luis that I know of.

    I wonder how many times I or someone else has posted something about Daniela y Luis and we didn't even know we might not be talking about the same couple? Any Europeans here familiar with the couple on the video?
     
  18. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Could this be Orillero ?

    Dear DF,

    could this be orillero ?

    Found it on the web site of Atlanta-Tango.
     
  19. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    Possibly. We must remember that this refers moreso to the style of a group of persons rather than the style of a genre of the dance. One would find present some elements of orillero, and some that are missing. But, we might still consider it so b/c of the era and location.
     

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