Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by Shaka, Dec 28, 2010.
Good thing no one ever does any kind of cross in AT then.
Well that's what I dislike about tango nuevo style.
An exception: If you are leading an ocho in a molinete sequence in milonguero style, you can rotate your chest so that the follower steps around. Does that make sense?
For instance.. you are starting a CCW sequence. You might:
Lead a regular side step to your left. (she also does a regular sidestep on her right foot) Then with your weight over your left, rotate your chest/shoulders/torso/ whatever (don't want to get bogged down in THAT argument) Your rotation should send her into the back ocho if she's connected to your chest. (so you took a sidestep and then rotated... she took 2 steps - a side step and a back ocho)
In this case, your rotation does not result in the same type of pivoting ocho that you might do with dissasociation and open embrace. It propels her to make the ocho as a milonguero ocho, but she has pivoted as a whole unit to do it around you rather than directly side.
Does this make sense the way I'm explaining it? It's SO easy to demonstrate and so hard to write about.
So you don't like traditional milonguero style, and you don't like nuevo? What do you like in the AT world? I guess you'd like the old timers dress code worn by nuevo and fantasia show dancers?
Elegance may be subjective to one's point of view. But there are points of view shared by most of people. So smokings are elegant and baggy trousers are not
This must be the language barrier... Smokings are elegant? I don't know what that means.
Bad dancers like Murat do in the video you posted.
Crossing the legs does not mean making a diagonal step. You can cross your legs for foot replacement or a complete side step in the direction given by the pelvis.
That, too. That is why in my earlier post I hinted that at times there is no other remedy than looking away from "a sore eye's sight".
Everybody is entitled to an opinion. One does not have to be an expert to make one. However, there is always an option out there to make an informed opinion, and I believe it is what most of us are trying to achieve here on this board.
Sorry, I mean tuxedoes.
I was being sarcastic. La Crusada is one of the most important steps in AT. One of the (many) ways to get into it is to draw back to it diagonally.
Yes.. people are entitled to their own opinion. But they're not entitled to their own facts.
You may do a backward ocho the way you want but what I'm telling from the beginning is that sending back the leg diagonally (what I see too often) is not the most elegant way. Look at how Cristina Ladas is performing in milonguero. She's doing right by dissociating first before making the step. That should be the only way to make backward ochos whether you are in open or close embrace. You may be told by instructors to just cross your legs in milonguero but that's just because it would be too difficult for an average dancer to do it properly.
Exactly. So if one states something that is (or based upon that is) not true he is either misinformed or playing a game.
You're wrong. It's not to be done diagonally. The leg must move back perpendicularly to the pelvis. That's the lower part of the leg that effectively makes the cross.
Ummm... I kind of think it has to. At least when walking. I can't see how one can go from a walk to a cross without some diagonal motion going on. It seems physically impossible.
Or am I being stupid?
Thank you.. You're most generous.
I believe I WILL do them the way I want.
I think you may (still) be confusing ochos with these "ocho milongueros" - the latter does not need a pivot. Because it's basically a cross - which involves dissociation but not pivotting.
Unfortunately, whilst I know what I mean, it's difficult to convince you in text - a 1-minute face-to-face tutorial would be sufficient I think, but that's obviously not practical.
Actually, this thread's been helpful, as it's helped me to understand in my own mind what the ocho-milonguero movement involves. And I think I was quite vague on it before this discussion.
What's important is the upper part of the leg. You can just cross your legs without moving the upper part. Or you can move it at exactly 9 o'clock with the moving knee in the front or in the back. A diagonal step would be moving the upper part at 10+ o'clock.
That's the problem. Too much people do it incorrectly. I'm just giving advices. If you don't want to improve, that's fine. I'm not going to threaten you.
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