Salsa > Do you think beginners know what a good lead is?

Discussion in 'Salsa' started by Backstreet, Sep 25, 2005.

  1. diputs

    diputs New Member

    I read this on here somewhere. I will attempt to paraphrase from what I remember.

    A good lead will be able to compensate for a beginner and make adjustments so that the follow knows what they are trying to do.

    I consider myself a bad lead. I am a beginner, so I am not really worried about it yet. There are certain women that have complimented me on my lead being good in class. But there is something that I am getting from the follow that makes it easier for me to lead them. I haven't figured out what it is yet. Some women are really easy to lead while others are a nightmare.

    Last night in class, I was having a very difficult time leading this one women through the step. Later in the evening the teacher used her for an example of a step. He had absolutely no problem getting her to follow him. To me, this is what being a good lead is all about. Being able to lead anyone.
  2. tsb

    tsb Well-Known Member

    you really don't get it, do you?

    i've come across your posts in a few threads now & i perceive a pattern of you expressing your opinion in a way that makes it sound like no one could possibly disagree w/o being an idiot. the worst part is that your opinion is often misguided and/or based on a provincial world view. it's my take that as long as you continue to express yourself in this way you will continue to get the responses that you do.

    i hope you recognize that we're trying to do you a kindness by telling you something that can help you if you choose to act on it.
  3. ash88

    ash88 New Member

    I cannot count the number of times i have danced with a follower i could barely get to do the basic step on time, and then seen her dancing with my instructor doing all manner of complicated movements without problems.

    And all this after i consider myself a pretty decent lead.

    One thing's for sure: the longer i dance, even without making a conscious effort at improving my lead for beginners, i find i can lead beginners more and more easily. Another important thing i'm learning over time is that there are certain moves that beginners are intuitively more likely to "get" (like butterfly/titanic), and some that always confuse them (like all manner of "combs"). I've just picked that up through repeated trial and error.

    Also, when i first started, i was quite apprehensive at grabbing a beginners shoulder and pushing her under a right turn, but it turns out that they tend to appreciate it!
  4. diputs

    diputs New Member

    This is one of the most common things I get from more advanced dancers. That I am not being forceful (strong, not sure what the right word is) enough in my lead. There seems to be a very fine line between applying enough pressure and applying to little. And it is different for every person.

    The hard part as a beginner is applying the pressure in the correct moment. The wrong moment throws the follow off balance. The correct moment and the follow does exactly what I intended.

    Now I just need to forget all this and dance!
  5. salsa es mi vida

    salsa es mi vida New Member

    They will know what a good lead is and it's because of it that you'll be asked to dance,it will be enjoyble pain free and the other thing there will be no faight/struggle who will lead/follow/take control. :)
  6. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    OMG, I saw this post come up and couldn't believe that members from years ago were still scuffling about this issue. oh my. what a relief it wasn't the case.
  7. Josh

    Josh Active Member

    boriken, you're still alive! :)
  8. Albanaich

    Albanaich New Member

    That sums it up pretty succinctly. . . . .

    A lot of skill and experience - a little machismo :)

    I had a lot of trouble getting the idea of what a lead was supposed to do when I started dancing. It took a strong (female) lead to bounce me about the floor to understand what was required.

    Most beginner males have problems dancing with another guy, but if you are up for it, its the quickest way to understand what is required in a lead.

    There's fascinating cultural/social gap that you cross when your dance teacher realizes that you're ok with guys dancing with guys.

    I taught my son to dance last year, and the first lesson was - 'this is what good lead feels like'
  9. MacMoto

    MacMoto Active Member

    I'm more inclined to agree with this post:
    There are guys who I thought were good leaders when I was a beginner but not any more...
  10. Albanaich

    Albanaich New Member

    True - a good lead changes their game to suit the skill of their partner, the same is true of follows.

    I remember as a beginner dancing WCS with a follow who was way above my level, every move I started out on she hijacked, it didn't know what was happening, only that everything I started was going to finish differently. Somehow I managed to finish each pattern, on time, on beat.

    She winked at me - 'you've got it' was all she said.
  11. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    Hey Josh,
    Yes. My lady had a little baby (leeanna - she's now 1 year old), work became extremely loaded, and good times took the punishment. =( It's still somewhat difficult to get one on a daily basis, but I'll show up form time to time. =)
  12. MacMoto

    MacMoto Active Member

    :D Congratulations!
  13. englezul

    englezul New Member

    If this so much of an issue that you think you need to ask advice about it, the truth is it doesn't really matter. Your instructors are your best source for feedback.
  14. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    THANK YOU!!! =D I'm so excited!
  15. barrefly

    barrefly New Member

    The other question is, "are experienced leads able to identify a good follow". Apparently, not always.
    (I posted this on another board).

  16. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    Why would you two be upset about dancing a ChaCha?
  17. barrefly

    barrefly New Member,....disappointed. Being in Maimi was a fantastic opportunity for her to dance salsa with the best dancers. When she finally got to dance with him,....she wanted it to be salsa, which is why she was there. She is a latin chacha dancer, not a salsa chacha dancer.
  18. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    Hmmm, I would think anybody who is a great Salsa dancer would be a pretty fair ChaCha dancer as well?
  19. barrefly

    barrefly New Member

    That's not entirely correct. Most pro. level salsa dancers are not latin chacha trained and what they usually do is improvise on the chacha rythym using their salsa knowledge/technique. My daughter just happens to be a gold level, international latin chacha dancer....but unless the lead is trained as well, she does what most of the other dancers do....(improvise). Compared to her salsa dancing, it's usually quite bland by comparision. (...same goes with Bachata, but that's because she doesn't care for the rubbing of bodies at here age).

    A few salsa pros have somewhat put togeather a salsa chacha psuedo syllabus/techniqe class and may teach it. There was a dancer at the event that gave a chacha shine class, was quite good. Everyone seemed to be enjoying themselves.

    She prefered to have an awesome salsa dance with this guy, than a fair chacha dance.

    Though I elaborated, the point of my thread was "Is it possible for a great lead to not recognize a great follow?". Him giving her a patronizing high 5 at the end of the chacha, seemed to indicate that he was clueless how good a follow she actually was.
    Rather suprising to me, because he was an awesome lead, himself. I beleive that if he knew how good salsa dancer she was, he would have very much enjoyed dancing salsa with her. The chacha dance they did, should have given him some clues.
    I may be mistaken.
  20. wooh

    wooh Well-Known Member

    nothing to see here

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