Swing Discussion Boards > ECS triple step method.

Discussion in 'Swing Discussion Boards' started by Spitfire, Oct 23, 2003.

  1. Spitfire

    Spitfire Well-Known Member

    I've been in a few ECS classes where the instructor stressed taking a fairly wide step on the first count. I find this to be ackward since most instruction I've received stressed keeping all steps fairly short.

    With the rock step I was first taught to do so by just stepping straight back, but later I was told it should be done with a hook type motion behind the right foot; both work equally well for me.

    Are these just styling options?
     
  2. SwinginBoo

    SwinginBoo New Member

    Not sure spitfire, I know that in ECS I have always hooked the rock step.
     
  3. Vince A

    Vince A Active Member

    I also rock-step, however, I've done both and some moves require a straight-back step!

    I've also had an instructor who said to take a wide first triple-step and another who said "keep it very small/compact."

    Probably why I do both???
     
  4. SwinginBoo

    SwinginBoo New Member

    You're absolutely right Vince. The only time I do a straight backwards rock-step is if I'm led to do so to complete a specific move.
     
  5. SDsalsaguy

    SDsalsaguy Administrator Staff Member

    I can only comment on the American Rhythm version of ECS -- in which case it is the last step of the triple that is accented, and not the first.
     
  6. d nice

    d nice New Member

    The first step of a triple step should be a normal sized step. The point of triple stepping is the center travels beyond the balance point hence the second two steps. If the first step is overly large your center never reaches the point where a transition is necessary and it kills the flow and rhythm of the step.

    The rock-step has no set placement. PErsonally I would question any teacher that ever says you must step in a certain place for a certain step. A leader moves his body as necessary to properly lead the follower. If she is off to one side, does not travel far enough or travels to far your body is going to need to change its distance and orientation to compensate... this means the placement of your foot must change. A follower's body placement is dictated by the leaders movement, her feet need to stay "underneath" he body to keep her from slipping, sliding, or stumbling. IF a follower attempts to follow imaginary (And not so imaginary) footsteps on the floor she is going to quickly find herself commiting the one cardinal sin in partner dance... not dancing with her partner.

    Sometimes you will rock step in a straight line, other times it will be rotational... it should rarely "hook". Hooking on the part of the leader provides no direction for the follow, it instead provides rotation and usually grounds her immediately after. Hooking on the part of the follower is just like any other step... it should be a natural response to the leader's movement of your body unless it is part of an improvisation/syncopation in which case you need to ensure that it in no way inteferes with his leading you.
     
  7. d nice

    d nice New Member

    Ahhh... but how is it accented. Ballrooms dancers seem to have a very different idea on how this can or needs to be done compared to street/club dancers.
     
  8. SDsalsaguy

    SDsalsaguy Administrator Staff Member

    ooops, my bad...I should have been more clear. What I meant was that, contrary to the description provided by Spitfire, the largest step was on the last step, not the first. This is in line with the description in your post (2 up) about the center travelling past the base to generate the swing of swing.
     
  9. Spitfire

    Spitfire Well-Known Member

    Probably a better term then "hook" is a diagonal step with the foot landing behind and to the right (for the leader) of the other foot.
     
  10. Spitfire

    Spitfire Well-Known Member

    I need to correct myself here; it is the LAST step of the triple and not the first that I've been told by should be wide. My bad.

    I've also been told on occasion that ECS should actually begin by using a rock step. Does anyone here dance by starting with the rock step?
     
  11. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    In ballroom classes ECS is taught starting with a triple step, and in the othr dance classes it is taught starting with the rock step. I feel that both are equally leadable. So, it depends on my mood, and also the follower. If I know the follower has learnt ECS in ballroom class and is a beginner I will definitely start with the triple step first...
     
  12. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    I don't know about the last step of the triple being wide. I was never told that, however speaking of the triple I was taught that the triple step is syncopated, with the second step belonging to the third step, i.e. 1 -&2, and not 1& -2.
     
  13. SDsalsaguy

    SDsalsaguy Administrator Staff Member

    To my understanding the "&" belongs to the 1 in both of your examples. Why? Because the next step is taken on 3 – meaning that the body is "on" the 2 for an entire beat in a way that it is not for the 1 or the &. Does that make sense?
     
  14. d nice

    d nice New Member

    Swing Music structure places the swung note in favor of the upbeat (giving it both a visual and rhythmic syncopation).

    The rhythm that best fits most Swing Music is 1 - & 2.
     
  15. SDsalsaguy

    SDsalsaguy Administrator Staff Member

    Would you agree that you are "over" the 2 for longer then the 1 or the &?

    I think this was the only idea I was trying to communicate.
     
  16. d nice

    d nice New Member

    Absolutely.

    The triple step is created by staking a step which "undercuts" the movement of the center, so it passes past the foot, the second step is a catch-up step, landing next to the first. The third step catches the weight , as such is he larger of the three steps (as Vince noted) and "holds the weight" the longest (as SDsalsaguy noted).
     
  17. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    Thanks guys. It's beautiful to see how the ECS basic that now comes naturally can be broken down into such detail. Inspiring!!! I just danced some ECS and it all checked out.

    Now back to trying out "cuban motion". Got to get it...got to get it...right now I look totally like a gringo dancing latin --I want to look more like a latino dancing latin.
     

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