Tango Argentino > How can I kindly refuse if someone constantly ask me to dance ?

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by Green, Jan 1, 2008.

  1. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    not me; I would suggest a link to a good website but yes I had the same thing about Giro being pronounced "cheero" (hard ch like in Welsh) and a giro in the uk means an unemployment cheque!
  2. Heather2007

    Heather2007 New Member

    I had almost no faith dancing with any man shorter/slighter than myself (me: 5.10 in heels, athletic build) wanting to perform anything requiring having to come (dramatically) off of my axis. Then I danced with one joyful small/thin chap who after several perfectly led volcadas performed a confidence-building colgado. Thus the lesson for me here was: trust that the man has good technique and to judge him not by his height or weight.

    As for the lady: she's up and out there doing her thing in any shape or form that makes her feel comfortable. Today she rests after one milonga, tomorrow - who knows.
  3. Dave Bailey

    Dave Bailey New Member

    To me, a perv is someone who exploits the proximity of the dance to provide unwanted attention - so yes, it's subjective. But pervs know their attention is unwanted, and don't care. Pervs are usually male I reckon, or they're the worst abusers. If a woman pervs on me, then as a leader I can do any number of things to avoid this - as a follower you have less options.

    Nope, it's on-topic - avoiding a perv being IMO one of the 3 valid reasons to consistently refuse a dance with someone.
  4. Dave Bailey

    Dave Bailey New Member

    Re: glossary:
    I'm not knowledgeable, but I use this glossary:
  5. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    there is a limit to this; one cannot break Newtonian physics no matter how good ones' technique.
  6. Heather2007

    Heather2007 New Member

    A-ha...but Jung would beg to differ.
  7. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    Jung being the sound your a*** makes when it hits the floor?
  8. Heather2007

    Heather2007 New Member

    Have you seen my a*se? More like craaaaasssssshhh-wheeeeew- BANG! Wheeeezz. Grmph! :together: -
  9. cornutt

    cornutt Well-Known Member

    I believe Peaches used the word to refer to a regular at one of the milognas she attends who is notorious for trying to feel up his partners. In that case, I'd say the term is appropriate.
  10. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    sounds very amusing, like tango on a trampoline; that I would like to see
  11. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    Then can we use a more accurate term - perv has all sorts of implications to differnet people and groups any deviation from a particular person's definition of normalcy. Thus, one person's perv is another persons closest friend. From the above discussion the discussion here is solely about a 'groper'. Does that suffice? If not then, even though it may be difficult, please define what the offensive action is.
  12. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Elise, while I see your point, I have to disagree.

    I do not, nor have not, use(d) the term "perv" as a general epithet. I don't use it joking around with friends, or on D-F, and I haven't called anyone here a "perv."

    While a groper would, for me, certainly fall into that category, there are other behaviors that would, as well. The men who grope, or who grind/press, or make off-color remarks, or who leer. Yes, I admit it is all subjective.

    There are things I will tolerate from some men that I would not tolerate from others--in my mind, it largely comes down to a feeling of respect (or lack thereof) for me, and how much control I do or do not have. The overriding characteristic with the men I tolerate flirting from is that I always sense that they respect me and will stop if asked; with others I get no such feeling. Being a woman, I imagine you have to have experienced that intangible difference--some men just weird you out. Don't ask me to describe it more than that, because I honestly cannot.

    I'm not sure where your particular objection to the word "perv" is coming from. I don't suppose it much matters--it offends you, for whatever reason, and that's valid.

    I suppose it would be more correct, and possibly less offensive, to say the objection is to gropers/leer-ers/grinders/and others who generally engage in unwanted, unwarranted and inappropriate conduct that is sexual in nature. For myself, "perv" is only a catch-all shorthand for that.
  13. nucat78

    nucat78 Active Member

    God save the Queen and all, but Victoria wasn't exactly an attractive woman. Do they get ANY dances?
  14. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    I understand P - my problem is that some people might interpret the term to include gays and even adulterers in the term 'perv' - it has been used that way in the past. Since this is an open forum I really think we should offend as few people as possible and, yes, this particular term does bother me. If I am alone then fine, but I would be very surprized if that was the case. Actually, thinking a bit about it it may be that 'perv' was used much more broadly when I lived in England - as a derogatory term for anyone that did not fit into the 60s norm of a nuclear family. Maybe that is why I am reacting the way I am.

    There a little self analysis! I won't say any more on the subject.
  15. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    Oh. Ohhhhhh. Wow. Talk about things that never once crossed my mind. Huh. Yeah, that puts your objection into perpsective.

    No no no no no...not meaning gay people, not meaning adulterers, not meaning non-normal nuclear family. (Interesting that it never crossed my mind that "those categories" would be included in "perv.")

    So...any suggestion for a less offensive catch-all shortcut word for things? :)
  16. DeanofDance

    DeanofDance New Member

    It's difficult sometimes and I get frustrated with some ladies. I try to remember I was a beginner and make it a point to dance with the newbies. Some that have been around and don't make an effort to learn how to follow cause problems for me, I've had to be blunt; " I'm sorry but we don't seem to connect well on the floor." I've taught myself to say "no" and also learned that I can put up with almost anything for the length of one song.
  17. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    Just keep in mind Dean, and everyone who is not overly familiar with AT, that, as Peaches and I have both pointed out, the custom in Argentine Tango is to dance an entire "set" of music, or tanda, with a partner. That is usually 3-4 songs.
    Saying "Thank you", and ending the partnership before the "cortina", or non tango music that is used to signal the end of the tanda, almost always is interpreted as a way of saying that something was not right between the partners. This is usually taken as an insult of sorts by the party who is being "dumped".
    One dance? Sure. But not usually in AT. At least not without consequences. This makes it different than almost all other social dances, and accounts for some of the perceptions of casual visitors to these AT threads.
    Frankly, dancing several dances with someone you know and want to dance with is a great idea when it comes to AT, since "the connection" can take some time to establish. AT is very much a lead / follow dance and the connection is essential to this. There is no falling back onto a basic step, because there isn't one.
    The problem is when, unlike in Buenos Aires where people may have known each other for years, you end up with a bunch of people who either don't know each other, or barely know each other trying to use some of the conventions from BA, but not all of them.
    This thread would not be here if the women where gssh dances used the cabeceo to arrange dances, or if the men there insisted that they won't accept dances that were not arranged non verbally.
  18. elisedance

    elisedance New Member

    thanks for understanding P. Doesn't the suggested term 'groper' cover almost all such cases? And I think its instantly understood...
  19. Gssh

    Gssh Well-Known Member

    HuH? Somebody called? I am actually doing the cabeco for roughly half my dances - but that is not really an option all the time. Several of my friends don't wear glasses at a milonga, and i have been explicitly asked to just walk over and ask them, as they are not likely to notice a nod.

    This segues nicely into the easiest solution for this problem - simply dance with somebody else. Just like followers who can become very difficult to get a dance with if they are continuously on the dancefloor the same is true for leaders. I have noticed this most when we both actually wanted to dance with each other, but there were so many other people to dance with that at the end of the night we just ended up promising each other that we would reserve a dance the next time.

    In a way this is just fair - looking around at milongas you can see a fair number of men who have elevated sticking to a follower they want to dance with to a high art. It is good for the soul to suffer the reverse once in a while :).

  20. Heather2007

    Heather2007 New Member

    Apparently, Vicky was quite a traffic stopper in her youth, so I suspect she adopted a permanently vexed frown when Albert died. ;-)

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