Salsa > It's definitely NOT over!!!

Discussion in 'Salsa' started by lily, Aug 13, 2004.

  1. lily

    lily Member

    Well, that's my little fling with Salsa over. I've just come back from my first Salsa night out and while I suppose I shouldn't judge by just one experience, it hasn't left me wanting to try again. At all.

    I have to say that I did not have one enjoyable dance. I know I'm a beginner but is it too much to ask of a lead to just dance simple moves with me without critisizing, giving advice, chatting me up or walking off in the middle of the song???

    I was left twice in the middle of a song. I was being my usual pleasant, smiling self but I just wouldn't dance with my body stuck to theirs. I explained that I was a beginner and that I didn't feel comfortable like that. But one guy said, "I can't dance like this." and walked off. I watched him dance with the girl he invited next, to see what I was doing wrong and he had one hand on her butt and the other moving up and down her back. As they danced he made no eye contact at all and spent the whole time admiring the body he was dancing with. Ok, so I don't want to dance like that. I'll dance very closely, but not with the torso and pelvis stuck together. Is it normal to leave a girl in the middle of the song if she won't dance the way you want her to?

    The other men I danced with all either asked me out (I had invitations to go to a restaurant, the cinema and on holiday to Spain) or corrected my dancing and gave me advice. I said to one guy, "Thanks, but can we just dance to the music?" and he replied, "It's for you that I'm telling you this, so that you'll be a better dancer and you'll know what to do." He then continued slowing down every time he did what he thought to be something difficult for me and so we were never in time with the music. Another guy would watch my feet every time I finished a move and then smile at me and say things like "good" or "well done" or nod his head in approval. Ok, I'm a beginner Salsa dancer and I don't mind one or two tips per dance. But I would just like to dance in time with the music without being critisized non-stop.

    Thank you, I feel better now! I really needed to get all that out :x :cry: :D
     
  2. twnkltoz

    twnkltoz Well-Known Member

    Wow, I'm sorry. I hope there's another club you can go to! This one sounds like a loser meat market.
     
  3. peachexploration

    peachexploration New Member

    Hi Lily. I'm sorry your first experience was not a good one. :( Let me just say this. People like that have no clue about what Salsa is let alone what it should be. I understand completely what you must be feeling but remember it's some people who have severe issues not Salsa itself. Maybe you should try a different venue, go with a group of friends next time particularly your classmates if you're taking classes. Gosh, I'm so sorry...... :(

    PS. There is a link somewhere regarding Salsa in Paris. Let me look.....
     
  4. Pacion

    Pacion New Member

    Lily, there are places like the one you described, everywhere :cry: please don't give up, yet. There are countless of us who are "good" dancers and even we have been left on the dancefloor, so whilst it does nothing for your confidence as a beginner, think of yourself as part of a very elite group :wink:

    I think I may have mentioned to you about Valerie and Cliford of Salsabor? Their website is: salsabor.fr Give them a try. They are beautiful people and beautiful dancers. Hopefully you will meet similar dancers at their events (birds of a feather flock together, kind of thing)
     
  5. peachexploration

    peachexploration New Member

  6. lily

    lily Member

    Well I certainly don't plan on going out to a Salsa club again in the near future. Next time I dance Salsa, it'll be at one of the venues I know that has a 3 dance floors (Swing, Salsa, Ballroom). I've never had a problem there before.

    It's a shame because I was really looking forward to my first 'all Salsa' night. Imagine going to a class where you think the teacher will be great and there will be dancing afterwards. Then it turns out that the tacher is really creepy and nasty and in fact there is just the lesson, no dance afterwards. That's how I feel, cheated and frustrated.

    But there will be other dance venues and other great dance experiences 8)
     
  7. Pacion

    Pacion New Member

    Yes, there will be other dance venues and other great dance experiences out there for you. To meet a prince, one generally has to kiss a few frogs :| and sadly, even in salsa there are wolves dressed up as lambs/frogs :(

    Best of luck with your dancing.
     
  8. cocodrilo

    cocodrilo New Member

    Sorry to hear that, Lily. :( I have had a lot of experience with snobbery at salsa venues and it's turned me off to the dance many a time, yet I LOVE the dance itself AND the music, so that keeps me coming back! Take a few lessons, (it's a cinch to pick up if you're a dancer) and you'll be able to keep up next time and hopefully not get the snooty remarks. I had a blast the first few times I danced salsa simply because I was dancing ALONE, just trying to get down the basics, and dancing in a little circle with my friends. Not intimidating at all! :D
     
  9. lily

    lily Member

    Thanks for the links and the encouraging words :friend: (I especially needed the latter; I hadn't realised just how low I was.)

    I know where to go dancing here in Paris as there's a great site www.danse-a-2.com which lists everything. What I guess I don't know though is the right place to go dancing!
     
  10. lily

    lily Member

    LOL True, very true :lol:

    Thanks!
     
  11. peachexploration

    peachexploration New Member

    Great Lily! Keep dancing..... :together:
     
  12. Anonymous

    Anonymous New Member

    Yeah, I hate to be groped and mauled by someone when I'm just trying to have a good time dancing. I don't let these experiences bother me though, because for every idiot there are always more good people. I could sit and beat myself up for any amount of things that I did wrong or that happened while dancing (I've started to practice a bit daily, just basic silly stuff to gain control of my body and muscles), OR reflect on all of the morons, but then... where would there be time for dancing?:)

    Chin up- at least you can fit into salsa clothes! LOL
     
  13. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    I'm sad to hear of your experience Lily! :cry:

    There are people and then there are people - animals. I have taken people dancing, that is encouraged them to go out for the first time. Actually a couple of times these ladies have only wanted to dance with me, or only a few people. And based on the experiences they have had I don't blame them.

    (1) I meet A and we dance at an outside event. then we go to the social dance. Dj, one of the organizers also, ends up creeping her out. Even though she didn't dance with him, I think. Big age difference etc...

    (2) I've danced with B, and danced in ways that B would never dance with anyone else. :wink: That is full body contact with grinding motion, kiss on cheek as in besito, and more with no problem. However, I can say that I have taught B to dance and never do anything that makes her feel uncomfortable. Some other people have creeped her out as they are too forward as you describe Lily. Even though B sort of knows them. :(

    Don't let those people take over your love for dance and control what you want to do. That has been my advice to both those ladies and while the first went to Italy a few days afterwards I know that the second has taken my advice and is so much happier now. :)

    So keep on dancing.
     
  14. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    Just remembered something else!! It's tough to go out into a new scene. I'm lucky now that I can introduce newbies (in dance and/or to the scene) to friendly and great people. This way they all feel more at ease. One way to avoid/minimize a bad experience is go with a couple people and so you have each other. Just having that makes even the worst not so bad, as I have discovered. :oops: :)

    As for leaving people on the dance floor I never do that. Never. See my comment on animals. I won't waste my energy on commenting on that as I already have ranted and raved about such people umpteenth times. However, I'm gald that you are getting a chance to get it off your chest. Especially if you keep dancing salsa!! All night! :wink:
     
  15. Big10

    Big10 Member

    As you quickly noticed, you came to the wrong forum to announce "it's over" for Salsa! :wink:

    All of us who have been dancing Salsa for awhile have had occasional bad experiences....but the good nights are so wonderful that we can't give it up! Please don't let one night spoil what can be a hobby that provides a lifetime of pleasure. What you experienced at that club was not acceptable, but I have to believe that there are places in and around Paris where you can have a good time and are less likely to run into rude men like that.

    At this point, I guess the thing to do is learn from other people's mistakes! :twisted: In other words, ask your dance instructor or people you met in your Salsa classes to tell you where (and what nights) they have had good times -- and bad times. If you haven't stayed in contact with those people or don't know how to reach them, then hopefully there will be some websites devoted to Salsa in the Paris area. It looks like there have been a couple of links mentioned in the thread already.

    I don't know what time of the evening you went, but it has also been my experience that if you arrive earlier in the evening, the people are generally more mellow, and men's actions are less likely to be tainted by alcohol. Unfortunately, some people are just plain rude all the time (and there are people like that in all sorts of dance venues), so you just have to get accustomed to blocking them out of your mind and look for the people who dance well and treat their partners with respect. There are PLENTY of "good" people in the Salsa world, so I'll keep my fingers crossed, hoping that you run into them soon!

    Best wishes to you!!! [​IMG]
     
  16. lily

    lily Member

    Thanks for all the kind words and encouragement :) I realised that by posting in the Salsa forum I was hardly likely to get, "Oh well never mind, just stop dancing Salsa then." as a response :p

    The thing is that I already love Swing and Ballroom so it's tempting to just give up on Salsa and stick to the safe world I know and love. But as so many people are so enthusiastic about Salsa I really want to give it a go and see what all the excitement is about! One dance experience is not called giving it a go, so I will keep trying until I find a friendly Salsa crowd!

    Thanks for the link to Salsabor, Pacion. It's a great site and it would seem that they specialise in Salsa Portoricaine which I think I prefer over Cubaine.

    "Don't let those people take over your love for dance and control what you want to do." You're right Sagitta, I'm not going to let a few sad creeps make my decisions for me. If I stop dancing now, last night will be my only memory of Salsa and that's not right. 8)
     
  17. Pacion

    Pacion New Member

    rotf Big 10! Thanks for showing us up! :lol:

    Good for you Lily, that you are trying it again. I (and countless others) have had our bad experiences too but have hung in there and look at us now :shock: having 10 Commandments! Isn't that enough to get you committed or what! :lol:

    I am really pleased you found the Salsabor website useful. I believe that they organise socials also? Or they do stuff with their students? Please believe me when I tell you that they are lovely, lovely people. (and I don't get commission for recommending them to people :wink: ) Even if you don't get to their classes - I don't know where their classes are in relation to where you live obviously - if you can make one of their events, you should hopefully get a totally different perspective to the one you have had.

    I would even suggest that you give Valerie a call and explain that you are a beginner to salsa (not to dancing), don't know anyone (obviously), would like to come to their event and whether she could put you in touch with some of their students so that you can at least make contact/find a friendly face on arrival.
     
  18. huey

    huey New Member

    Re: It's over

    Sorry to hear about your experiences, and it's interesting to hear about this sort of thing from a woman's perspective. I mainly dance Swing, but I have been to a few Salsa dances. Salsa dancing seems more overtly sexy and the man and woman are closer together, so I think some men sometimes see it as a place they can dance 'too close'. Some women might be happy to do this as well, but I think most women aren't. I think there is a thin line between very close dancing and having 'sex with no clothes on'. But both partners should sense which side of the line they both feel comfortable with. If they do enjoy mutual groping on the dance floor (for example, if they are in a relationship together), I think they should also consider what is acceptable to other dancers in the room.

    I hope you find somewhere else to dance Salsa where you feel comfortable.
     
  19. Pacion

    Pacion New Member

    Re: It's over

    I don't think it is any closer than the waltz :shock: :lol: I remember my dance teacher kept telling us that one half of our bodies are supposed to be connected so that the guy's knee goes through the girl's legs (knees) :shock: otherwise, the knees with keep being knocked together everytime the guy has to extend to his leg and vice versa :lol:

    I think the lambada is sexier than salsa :oops: but if danced 'properly' the lady has minimal contact with the guy, because you are constantly on the move rather than held in a closed embrace for most of the song :roll: :wink:
     
  20. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    I don't think it is the closeness really. Take AT for instance. It really only is the upper bodies touching most of the time. Now when one does all sorts of embelishments etc you have the legs doing their things. Now in salsa you can have the lower bodies glued to each other and you have the motion - :wink:
     

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