Tango Argentino > Milonga codes of Buenos Aires accepted in Hong Kong milonga

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by jantango, Sep 22, 2009.

  1. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    There'll usually be a tanda where the ladies get the chance to invite the men.

    Yes usually its the women making herself "available". As in life so in dance ... ;)
     
  2. Lui

    Lui Active Member

    @ Light Sleeper

    hbboogie1 gave the best explanation:

    I tried to encourage the guys to play around with the cabeceo. It's fun. Therefore, I was suggesting to try a cabezado on their way for a normal verbal invitation. In case of a successful cabeceo, any further invitation would be obsolete. If the women are totally ignorant of any cabeceo, they would not spend their night sitting and starring. It’s rather a cabeceo with a Plan B. BTW cabeceo is just the Spanish word for nodding.

    ...men and women pretty much invite each other by fishing for glances. Imagine this: You are, for some strange reasons, among the top most desirable male dancers and your dancing your first set that evening. As soon as your view travels towards the tables, it will be greeted by a wall of luring stares and sweet but razor sharp smiles, that clearly state: Don’t waste your time with her! The next tanda you better get your a.. over here! It’s quite obvious which woman want to dance!

    (I do not claim to have achieved this result at Bs.As.’ top milongas myself!)
     
  3. Light Sleeper

    Light Sleeper New Member

    Sigh.

    I'm in a bit of a funk about male/female relations at present. I so hate that word 'available' ... I'm having a feminist, polemic moment... why can't she be 'searching'?

    .. Lui describes men and women using non-verbal cues to get dances... but note how the woman has to compete...

    ... but it will ever be thus when female dancers outnumber male dancers..
     
  4. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    Slight Leeper, isnt that why they need codes in the first place... to try and control behaviour; whereas for us self contained brits go to let our hair down; we dont want codes, we want to dance with whomever we please, (and the prettier the better!)
     
  5. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Maybe! :cool: But from a male perspective it still seems to be the case that women dont actually do much "searching". They wait for the man to make the approach. And that's regardless of the numbers against them.

    *Sigh* hehehe :p
     
  6. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    I remember in this context: "women are the only prey that attack..."
     
  7. Lui

    Lui Active Member

    OK, let’s be polemic:;)
    ...sounds like a recipe for a pretty uncomfortable milonga for me. Older wealthy guys trying to get a hold on young chicks. Young chicks looking for an evening for free. Both groups in total disregard of the beauty of dance, annoying everybody else! The concept of “self contained brits“ will make excellent female dancers older than 50, (here in Berlin 30) sit around all night and quench the desire to perfect their dancing skills in young male dancers. The result: push and shove on the dance floor, frustration at the tables.

    The honor of a milonguero is to give any woman the best possible dance, to make her feel and look good without any regards of age, appearance and skill … and to proof this several times a night.

    If I had to choose ...
     
  8. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    in the proverbial porcine aural orifice; milongueros choose who they dance with.

    I his a henglish gentlemen and I will dance with any old slapper I mean lady.
     
  9. Lui

    Lui Active Member

    :confused: What’s your point ? :confused:
     
  10. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Your guess is as good as mine :)

    I expect that poor BTM is used to dancing with ladies of a "certain age". Thats the reality of living in the provinces. So forgive him if he goes a bit crazy at the thought of dancing with anyone below the age of 30... :p
     
  11. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    I was wondering if he found a pub with WiFi.

    :cool:
     
  12. tangobro

    tangobro Active Member

    I guess the same can be said about some people in New York City. Last week after doing a series of workshops Pablo Veron (who impressed me as a teacher) was at a milonga. I was not there but according to the agreed upon elements that I've heard - a woman asked Pablo to dance, he declined. One of the ladies he was seated with explained that was not how things were done in Bs. As. The woman said something about not caring about that, there was some verbal back & forth & the woman slapped Pablo - he hit her back & both were asked to leave the milonga.
     
  13. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    There is some question/debate about the facts. Though your post is the general accounting, the organizer insists that it omits much. Please, posters, let's just leave this one alone, and return to the OP's question.
     
  14. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    Milongueros are very very picky with who they dance with. This a friend has told me. They won't dance with beginners or poor dancers ( unless there is some ulterior motive)
     
  15. Joe

    Joe Well-Known Member

    Hey, when in Rome...
     
  16. Light Sleeper

    Light Sleeper New Member

    I guess we're sensitive souls and the reason we ask less is precisely the 'numbers against us'

    10 guys at a milonga, 1 girl - she's not going to be refused a dance.
    1 guy at a milonga, 10 girls - she's got more chance of being refused as he's got more choice.

    I personally would probably dash to the toilet to have a moment if someone refused me. (I have never refused anybody a dance, ever...
    mind you, for my own wellbeing I wish I had have done at times). As for making yourself available where there is no universal 'non verbal method of invitation'... pretty difficult. We can assume that looking attentive and interested in what's going on on the dancefloor may mean you're more likely to get an invitation. BUT isn't that just a coincidence? Seeing as other posters have said no amount of non-verbal hinting that they were avoiding dancing put some men off from asking.

    ... actually, all this is making me prefer 'non verbal methods'. As I said, I did it once at salsa but picked my moment carefully. I don't know whether I can find my balls enough to replicate the moment, either in salsa or tango.

    ... even notice my rather indelicate turn of phrase re finding the chutzpah to be the intiator of a dance. There's no getting over gender differences on or off the dancefloor... I think it's quite ingrained in women to sit and wait.. man is a hunter after all - we are the gatherers...

    ... on the other hand, I often find that men make really good followers - where does this come from? Men geared to following a general into battle unquestioningly? Hmmm....

    Interesting stuff.

    And as to the word 'available'.. it's roots are actually in Middle English meaning 'to be strong'.. funny how meanings change as it's connotations now seem to be 'passive/ waiting'...
     
  17. Light Sleeper

    Light Sleeper New Member

    So... sounds that because so few people who can 'do' tango also 'have tango' the number of Milongueros who have this code of honour are few and far between (at least outside Argentina?). Those of us with a sense of honour have to battle it out amongst the dancers with their own individual dreams and desires (e.g. to meet someone to bolster ego/ status/ find a bed partner). This is one reason that I find the salsa battleground too harsh for my sensitive nature. I am lucky that I have a regular tango partner, though I think he won't have the time to dance much longer.

    Tango is such a long, arduous journey, but worth it as I fell in love with the music....to end up with it becoming basically a cattle market is hugely depressing.

    Also, remind me not to go to Berlin as I'll be sat out all night, what with me being in my early 30s. Though I did get asked for ID to buy a bottle of wine last week and the girl who served me looked younger than me - ha ha ha -result! Is it any wonder women can find themselves get sidetracked by being obsessed with keeping up a youthful appearance when we're considered over the hill after 30? Jesus, I'm just getting into my prime!

    Anyway, rant over from Miss Jean Brodie ;)
     
  18. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Well yes but those are the extremes. Its much more likely that you will get say two or three ladies sitting in a cluster together. They will all be talking among themselves and at the same time watching the dance floor. What they wont generally do is scope the room, checking who is sitting out.

    Yes, its a shame we have to kiss all the frogs isnt it? :cool:

    That would be the equivalent of the guy going to the bar, then. Or pretending to see his best friend across the room ..

    Well you'll always get the blockheads. Still...

    Ive noticed a lot of ladies expect to get the attention of people on the dance floor at the end of a dance. "You look good I'll dance with you!!" But surely its better to catch the attention of somebody sitting out? The man leaving the dance floor is a) with another woman until he shows her to her seat and b) recovering from his last dance. The ones sitting out are ready to go. Maybe there's a belief that its the "losers" who sit out? Heaven knows.

    This incidentally is one thing I really like about BsAs milongas. The fact that everyone clears the dance floor between tandas. You dont get people "camping" on the dance floor. And so making it harder for everyone else.

    Maybe its a flipside of being a good leader - the ability to tune in completely to your partner... :)
     
  19. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    I can't answer for all men and all circumstances, but I am quite sure that looking attentive and interested in what's going on on the dancefloor will increase the chance that someone who doesn't know you will ask you to dance. It's something I am always aware of.

    Interesting book just came out (don't have the name for you) about the lack of research supporting differences in the brains of infant boys and girls. On the other hand certain biological differences do exist between men and woman and are the basis for some of our conventions. It's complicated.

    I'm not going to share my current status age wise, but, sometimes you just have to come to the conclusion that some cultural "truths" are not true at all.

    I disagree, and others have alluded to the "universality" of an informal cabezeo.
    I wish more women who tell me that I should ask them to dance more often would at least look at me and smile once in a while, or say, "hi". letting me know that at the very least they know I exist and are acknowledging me and might be interested in dancing with me.
     
  20. jantango

    jantango Active Member


    It is true that milongueros are selective with whom they dance a tanda at a milonga. They want to dance well or not at all. What excellent dancer wants to dance with an unknown dancer just for the sake of dancing?

    It is not true that milongueros won't dance with beginners. They dance during and after private lessons. A beginner quickly improves because a milonguero can make any woman dance well.

    What is their ulterior motive, Bordertangoman?

    A universal nonverbal method of invitation? There are as many varieties as their are men. Each finds a way that works for him -- a head tilt, a nod, a smile, movement of the lips (vamos). Women need to be alert since these are subtle movements that are not to be noticed by others in the room.
     

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