Tango Argentino > Milonguero style

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by jantango, Aug 10, 2012.

  1. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    I don't know. It would depend on your personal preferences, and also on the person you would have been talking to.

    I do appreciate that you declined to dance again. I wish more women would decline to dance with leaders who are discourteous on the dance floor. If all women declined, it would keep those guys off the floor altogether.
  2. LoveTango

    LoveTango Member

    Maybe I can say...later, when there is more space...
  3. LadyLeader

    LadyLeader Active Member

    I understand by back leading that the follower initiates next movement and I usually don't appreciate it. But if the follower makes the movements slower than initiated by the leader or takes shorter steps, I accept it as her style and way of dancing (if it is so all the time).
    This happened to me when I was dancing in South Korea. Some of the ladies were dancing more slowly, more elegant too and they never accepted the faster dance I offered. I think it changed even my dance permanently to the better!
  4. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    That would be a nice way to say it.
  5. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    This is MOST re-freshing coming from 'you'. I cannot understand how you can post this here, and something so contradictory in the Musicality thread. Yet, I am glad to read this. Great post.

    A-M-E-N !!
  6. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    You don't always realize who is going to be a jerk on the dance floor...or don't always remember. There have been times where it was only after I'd started dancing with some guy that I remembered that I disliked him/dancing with him.

    ...and that's where social conditioning to never make a scene, or the conditioning to try and never hurt anyone's feelings, or the conditioning to be
    nice kicks in...
  7. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    I'm glad I'm not the only one with that affliction.

  8. Peaches

    Peaches Well-Known Member

    This happened to me just this evening. Some guy asked me to dance, I had misgivings but said yes, and then when we started I remembered the reasons for the misgivings: crappy posture, plus crappy embrace, couldn't find the beat to save his life. Finished that tanda with a very very sore back. Rather put the kaibosh on dancing after that. (General hint: if the girl is going to some effort to keep the embrace open, DON'T use more force to try to pull her in close. God almighty. I dance close by default, and with as much forward presence as I can get away with. For me to actively try to pull away means there is something very wrong. In retrospect, should have said "thank you" and moved on after the first song.)
  9. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    Oh, if we 'all' could only do this... on the dance floor and on the dance-forums. ;)
  10. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    And of course, after a certain amount of time goes by, you have to allow for the possibility that someone may have improved. I certainly hope I have improved over time, and I hate it when someone who danced with me quite awhile back still refuses to dance with me only because when they first danced with me 5+ years ago, they weren't thrilled. So if I expect to be given another chance at a different point in my development, I have to give others that chance too.

    Of course, if you've danced with someone repeatedly over several years, and they are still doing whatever obnoxious thing they were the first time, eventually it makes sense to give up on them! ;)
  11. tangobro

    tangobro Active Member

    YaY!!! Zoopsia is back :banana:
  12. jantango

    jantango Active Member

    A milonga is a dance place for adults. We aren't teenagers at a sock hop feeling rejected if the boy or girl we like doesn't invite us to dance. Adults make decisions about with whom they want to dance and don't have to explain them to anyone. That's why invitation by head movement instead of verbal invitation works so well and doesn't put anyone on the spot.

    There are dozens of men in the milongas who haven't invited me to dance. That's fine. I don't lose any sleep worrying about it. I know there are others who try to invite me, but I look away. That's my decision to make.

    If we want quality in tango and not quantity of tandas, it pays to be patient waiting for the right partner and the right music.
  13. LadyLeader

    LadyLeader Active Member

    Zoopsia, nice to have you back! I have been missing your postings.
  14. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member


    I need that blushy smiley that dchester uses sometimes!
    dchester likes this.
  15. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Jan, you have to remember that many of us aren't dancing in large metropolitan areas with multiple milongas, large tango communities and people who you don't really know. In my area, we don't have "dozens" of leaders even attending! If I were rejected by a dozen leaders at our weekly practica, that would mean I'd been rejected by people who weren't even present!

    It's not at all like BA (and yes, I've been). We all know each other. Many of us are friends outside of tango. We have ONE local milonga per month and to dance on any other weekend, you have to travel a minimum of an hour. In fact, during the summer our own monthly milonga takes place at a venue that many of us have to travel an hour to. Even at the milonga, there aren't so many people that being rejected by dozens would leave you with any partners at all.

    Most of us rely on the weekly practica to do any regular dancing, and I certainly think practicas are no place for snobbishness. I also think it is to the followers' advantage to encourage new leaders and help them develop, so that we have more good leaders. The only reason the leaders get to be choosy is because of the huge imbalance of leaders to followers here, not because they are "adult". IN fact, I would argue that often it is those being the choosiest who display the least maturity in their attitude because they are also often significantly inflating their own skills.
  16. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    Thanks Lady. I don't know that I am "back"... I have limited time (and patience ;) ) these days.
  17. sixela

    sixela Well-Known Member

    Uhm, would you actually describe most porteƱo men as adults? Tongue in cheek, many seem to me to be mentally stuck in puberty despite the age of their bodies, with all the advantages and disadvantages that derive from it ;-).
  18. Zoopsia59

    Zoopsia59 Well-Known Member

    I wanted to edit my post but I couldn't type fast enough to fit into the 5 minute editing window that DF apparently no has. :( Nor could I delete my post and put the edited version in as a separate post. So here's my attempt to add the stuff I was trying to do by editing:

    Most of us rely on the weekly practica to do any regular dancing, and I certainly think practicas are no place for snobbishness. Practicas have different rules and codes than milongas, and probably milongas account for less than 20% of the dancing that people here do.

    The only reason the leaders get to be choosy in any of these events is because of the huge imbalance of leaders to followers here, not because they are more "adult". In fact, I would argue that often it is those being the choosiest who display the least maturity in their attitude because they are also often significantly inflating their own skills.

    The best leaders here are not the most arrogant ones. We even have some leaders who refuse partners during the rotation in classes! Not because those women are likely to prove hazardous or rude, but just because they aren't deemed "good enough" by the leader, who apparently only wants to practice the move with a follower who can already do it, even though theoretically everyone is there to learn. This is especially galling when there are already more followers in the class, which happens frequently. I can accept that some couples don't rotate in a class (although I think they are making a mistake) but if someone IS rotating, they can't just refuse to dance with someone unless that person is rude or injurious. The leaders who do this, do so by simply walking away, sitting down or not returning to their place in the circle when they see they are about to match up to a follower they don't like. It is obvious to everyone that the follower has been abandoned and it is quite rude.

    My point is that for you, being patient and waiting for the right partner and music probably means waiting a bit later that night or maybe waiting until the milonga you go to the next night or so. For me (and probably others here) it might mean waiting 2 months and still having no gaurantee that you will ever get to dance!
  19. Lilly_of_the_valley

    Lilly_of_the_valley Well-Known Member

    I wish to say something about the class situation you describe. The class instructor can do something to turn the situation around. If a student decides to pass a follower in the rotation, it may mean she gets to dance with the teacher. The lady, instead of feeling abandoned, receives personal attention in class, and the rude guy in question gets a chance to see that a skillful leader can lead virtually anyone. If there are several followers without a partner, the instructor can organize them in a mini "ladies technique workshop" for the duration on the song. Also the teacher may encourage ladies to lead or at least give them an exercise they can do in pairs. So again, they get instructions, work on their skills, and the snubs are the ones who are excluded (well, they excluded themselves).
  20. Lilly_of_the_valley

    Lilly_of_the_valley Well-Known Member

    I know it is an assumption, but I cannot help but think, the abovementioned situation prone to happen more in classes that introduce patterns rather than technique. Otherwise the leader has actually lead the move, and it should make little difference whether the follower knows the move or not. It takes more skills, clarity etc, to lead less experienced follower (and vice versa). So people who are in the class for the skills, not for the moves, would appreciate practicing with partners of various levels.

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