Salsa > Partnering Question for Women(or anyone)

Discussion in 'Salsa' started by Marvellous, Nov 19, 2003.

  1. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    :D :D Its all about being sensual, smooth, and making the woman feel that the next 4 minutes she is going to be in heaven :together:
  2. Marvellous

    Marvellous New Member

    Reading some of these thoughts is really enlightening. Several months back I read a lot on Eddie's site which was in the same vein. I motivated me to decide to develop the sort of lead/dancing that would give women pleasure. Unfortunately, it is so easy to get sidetracked. The problem is, I do not see much of this going on in the environment that I am in. I take L.A. Style lessons because after trying a few others, I discovered that L.A. Style suits me best, and I have an amazingly talented teacher(in terms of dance skills, teaching skills, and knowledge of the brain/body, etc.)

    However, on a night like last night where I watch my teacher and a couple of other guys that are good in my group, it really becomes clear that what I see going on is very far from what some of you are talking about above. There is nothing sensual about what they are doing. It is very fast-paced and complicated and technically impressive, but you might say it looks more like "sport" than "dance". I remember a woman telling me once that she preferred Cuban Salsa to L.A. Style because for her L.A. Style was more like "sport" or "gymnastics". Thus, I think it is bit difficult for me to cultivate a different way of doing things if I am constantly in such an environment.

    Having said all this though, I will say one thing. I am a fairly keen observer, and I honestly believe that many women, particularly the better ones at my lessons(in my dance group) love this style, and love what some might call the "abuse". It's not that hard to read a women's facial expression when she is dancing with someone. With some of these women that I am talking about, I swear I have noticed that they are not happy unless the guy is doing something all complex and wicked with them. Sometimes I am dancing with one of them, doing just nice easy stuff and they seem bored or like they are not enjoying themselves, so I put them into some semi-wicked pattern and they start smiling from ear to ear.

    I believe their is a certain "type" of women that actually loves the nature of this L.A. Style. On the same note, there are many lessons and teachers to choose from in my location. If these women did not like the style that is being taught by my teacher, and did not like the style of his male students' dancing, they could quickly and easily go elsewhere. However, they don't go elsewhere, so.....

    Any thoughts on this subject?
  3. pygmalion

    pygmalion Well-Known Member

    I had thought about that advice, too, boriken. There are two ways to make up woman sit up and take notice. 1. Pay attention to her. 2. Pay NO attention to her. What's that cliche about letting someone go free? If they are really yours, they'll return to you. If not, well, sad to say, but they won't. Dance with others, but watch HER reaction. If she likes you, you'll see it.

    And boriken's right about studio/club dancing differences. The awkwardness may be about her adjustment from studio to real dancing situations, and not to do with you at all. Give it some time. You never know. (A little jealousy can't hurt, either. :wink: :p :lol: )
  4. salsachinita

    salsachinita New Member

    I tend to agree with the studio LA style executed by most lack sensuality that salsa is MEANT to have :x !

    People (students & teachers alike) can get too caught up in the 'high' that came with the fancy, fast-paced moves; especially when there's a crowd that watches with utter admiration! Most of us have experienced that.

    I believe environment factor can produce the behaviour you have witnessed, Marvellous.

    If it wasn't for our local Latino community, and the recent arrival of Cubans, the salsa scene in my city would also be all acrobatic, no sensuality.

    Having said that, I have noticed in recent years a large numbers of students being churned out by the studios tend to socialise/dance amongst themselves (enough numbers for this to happen now!) therefore missed out on absorbing the flavour ('sabor') from dancing with people from other schools (say, Cuban schools) & latin communities.

    Sensuality is not something that can be taught. It has to be FELT by the individuals in the depth of their being (often called upon by the music itself) then RECORDED in one's veins/muscle memory.

    On the other hand, the studios offer great techniques that cannot be taught solely in the club/social environment. Most of us (Latinos included) can benefit from enormously.

    That is exactly what I am doing right now. I am talking to people from all backgrounds & putting them in touch with each other. We can start small by saying hello, then hang out and/or dance together. We can all learn a lot from each other :wink: !
  5. salsachinita

    salsachinita New Member

    :p Oooooooo.....! :p can I dance with you......?

    *mental note to self*: Must learn to dance on 2 :wink: !
  6. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    Ok, let me say a little something so we can follow human thinking and why we don’t deviate when dancing. Lets look at religions, the western hemisphere is a Christian world. Which says our train of thought is Christian, and that means that outside of Christianity we don’t have any knowledge of anything else. On top of that the Christian belief of superiority rules our thinking, ultimately telling us that anything that we don’t think or know isn’t correct. The same applies to dancing. When we have been dancing a given style all our dancing life and all we see around us is one style, how can we venture outside it and do otherwise? We as humans like to follow, although we are free thinkers many of us aren’t willing the break the mold and create our own paths, hence we say adapt and call its result; overcome, when in reality it has been adapting and following.

    Just because you were raised in world of theft it doesn’t mean that you have to become a thief. You already know that what you want is to be sensual, now what you have to do, despite what everyone is doing, is do your thing. Create an energy field that will cause others to want to be involved in it, just because you are being different. Hey, you need to become the heretic of LA Salsa. hehe

    When you dance with a woman and she is looking around and doesn’t seem to be very interested in what you are doing. It has nothing to do with you, she is dancing salsa because she can, not because she feels it. A person that feels salsa will look like they are in love no matter who he/she dances with. You have to start looking for passion in the person you seek to dance with. You also have to know how to get their attention once in a while in the dance floor in order to engulf them onto your energy field. You can try many things, but it ultimately is up to the other person. If they are one of those dancers who are all technique and no feeling then you are pretty much screwed, they don’t know how to feel the music hence it will take you a million years of dancing to teach them how to feel and stop stepping around.

    A person cannot choose to do something they don’t know about. Even in NY City there are 100s of instructors, yet you’ll seek to no end and will eventually die of thirst seeking for one that teaches salsa as a sensual dance. The worse part is that they’ll mention the sensuality of dancing salsa but when you see them dance, there is nothing sensual about their dancing. The definition of sensuality has been lost through bodily expression. They really think that their “wam bang thank you ma’am” is a sensual love making session. Had there been more instructors in LA who sought the sensual side of dancing, that too would be apparent in the LA Salsa scene, but it isn’t. Which means that all of those instructors that you have to choose from rather display the showboating that brings in the dough, than the simplicity of being sensual. The Ego, follow it and you’ll end up in a gymnastics class, follow your soul and you’ll be dancing.

    Yes, there are many people who prefer one style to the other, but they also welcome a change. Women are emotional beings, more so than males, after you break them out of the dancing prison and bring them into the freedom of your world they’ll always want to dance with you. Always know that all women want to be treated like a lady, a queen, if you can achieve so while at the same time lift them to world very few dancers have taken them, they will always seek a dance with you.
  7. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    :bouncy: Yes, yes, yes, we can dance :bouncy:
  8. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    I understand the use of religion and Christianity in general, but just want to make the following clear. Just as in dancing we are encouraged to feel the music and salsa, not necessarily do just what everyone else is doing the same applies to religion. True faith is not simply blindly following what everyone else does, and staying in one's world, but demands critical questioning, thinking. Just as in dancing a good dancer does not think of being superior, so in Christianity, or any other religion for that matter, a true believer does not think of his religion as superior.

    Thanks :)
  9. borikensalsero

    borikensalsero Moderator

    Let me see if I can include religion to the least, as it is a very touchy topic.

    The notion isn't per se believing/faith but being alienated by our own thinking. Where it doesn't matter how a critical thinkers we are our thinking is governed by rules, rules which themselves aren't complete, a set of rules whose basic foundation is held together by religion. Rules we don’t even know we follow or have. It isn’t what we think, but what controls that which we think. Because of rules we can't think or see outside of what is going on and what we know. We haven't been exposed to different dancing, so how can we see that there are indeed other ways of dancing? Keep in mind that most of us won't know of something until we come across it.

    It doean't matter how critical thinker a person is, he/she is limited by that which its known to him/her. That is the comparison with dancing. Not just dancing but only dancing what we have been taught, and what we have seen. Despite the difference in details of a given dancer, the core of our dancing, as well as our philosophy are pretty close to the same in geographical regions. Our basic belief of how salsa dancing is done relates as a christian would his belief at church. No matter how many details differentiate dancers, our core philosophy of dancing is pretty much the same only because the surrounding philosophy of our geographical region says that this is the way salsa is danced. It didn’t matter that you were a critical thinker what mattered was that there was something already embedded in our culture which unconsciously grew in us.

    Ultimately why NY city dancers dance one way, LA another, Cubans another and so on. Just like Buddhists think on way, christians other, and muslums another. Our surroundings and unconscious philosophy of salsa dancing takes roots in us before we even start dancing. Despite how much of free thinkers we are, we are going to do that which is common not just to everyone but what we know. There is no way to get away from the only rules a person has danced by all his life and the life of the dancers before him unless they are taught others, or he just happens to be the “Jesus of Judaism”.

    We can't go outside of that which we live because we haven't seen it, experienced it, nor thought about it, and will most likely never think about it. Just like a given religion only teaches about its dogmas, and it leaves us oblivious to other dogmatic views of the world. Not at shortcoming at all, just the way knowledge works. It is only there as knowledge what you do because of it is another two cents. Some do what Galileo, Socrates did and come up with something new, others will never, even though they know of the same knowledge. That little something that separates the great dancers from the good dancers, it is something that can’t be taught, nor reasoned, all the knowledge in the world won’t get you there… It isn’t what you know but how you use what you know…
  10. salsachinita

    salsachinita New Member

    Well said, Boriken!
    :notworth: :notworth: :notworth:
    We tend to stay within our own comfort zone don't we...? (even more so in dancing) :roll:

    If only we could get everybody to read this on the forum........ :wink:

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