Tango Argentino > Reasons to quit tango

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by Captain Jep, Apr 4, 2010.

  1. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

  2. magicmiles

    magicmiles New Member

    There really is only 1 reason....

    Crickey Indeed!

    Thanks for the link to the article. I appreciate that.

    Let me clarify something, and I'm sorry I created something that depressed you, however I want to create a bit more clarity...which I'll end up doing later with a follow up post, which is this:

    That 1 reason is a VERY powerful reason and trumps everything else!

    When you get right down to it, that sole reason is also the reason that we dance in the first place: TangoBliss!

    10 seconds of that, and you really don't need much else. There is no drug, no addiction, no want, need or desire that can be more powerful than TangoBliss. Cocaine or drug addiction comes close, but in those cases, its usually a downward spiral after a few hits. Tango, it only gets BETTER with time...and has other positive rewards.

    Once you have a small taste of it, you will move mountains to have another taste. It is an ailment for which there is no cure, except MORE of the ailment!

    And what a lovely ailment and a predicament to find yourself in.

    Some people spend their whole lives never knowing the possibilities of bliss, let alone tango bliss. Be appreciative that you have the facility to hear it when it calls your name, be rapturous when it walks in your door, be ecstatic when it takes you into its embrace, be thankful after it has left. But while you're in it...stay as long as you can. For it will not come your way again.....until the next tanda!

  3. Mario7

    Mario7 Member

    Well said! ...and it only happens in Close Embrace, right?!
  4. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Hi Miles!

    Yeah well I am an addict ... so I agree with your last point ... I'm just not sure I should!

    Will give reaction to individual points once I can connect again to your site. Slow connection at the moment ..

    (BTW There's another recent article on this theme ... for those of us who understand Spanish ... http://enlamilonga.blogspot.com/2010/04/la-milonga-la-adiccion-el-amor-y-el.html )

    retreats into a darkened room hehe
  5. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    OK got connection now.

    I wont quote from the article - a) to preserve your rights and b) because I'd have to match up your pros and cons, and I'd rather direct folks to the article itself.

    I never really get bored of tango. God knows why. I should. Yes there arent enough places to dance , not enough good dancers, floorcraft can be rubbish.

    I think at the end of the day I hold onto this : that one good dance can make an evening. That once you are good enough and "known" enough that you will get to dance with the good dancers. And that experience can make it all worthwhile.

    Still - I have to say - the floorcraft outside Buenos Aires does (mostly) suck ... :)
  6. magicmiles

    magicmiles New Member

    The Companion Piece....

  7. spectator

    spectator Member

    oh my god Miles! you are alive! welcome back to cyberspace! I hope things are going well for you and that you are not having such a hard time any more!
  8. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Hi Miles, welcome to the forum. Like you, my login doesn't do too much to hide who I am either.

    I guess I feel fortunate that most of the reasons for quitting that you listed, don't apply to me, (and the few that might are not enough of a problem to make me quit).

    One of the reasons you listed "BAD", was intriguing. Fortunately it doesn't apply to me, although if it did, maybe I would quit. As a leader, the skill level of other leaders doesn't in any way influence my desire to dance (except for extreme floorcraft issues). For the followers, I don't need too much to have a good dance (a nice embrace, step on the beat, wait for the lead). Anything else is a bonus.

    I guess the thing that concerns me is that it seems like some people when they reach a certain level (and I'm not sure if this is a real level, or just a perceived level), seem to lose the ability to enjoy a dance that does not reach the "bliss" state. If I actually believed that would happen to me at some point, it would actually make me not want to get better.

    Currently, when I go to a milonga, I typically have lots of enjoyable dances, and occasionally (not every milonga), hit that "bliss" state. While certainly, I'd like to hit that bliss state a lot more, I still want to be able to have lots of enjoyable dances as well.

    This tango thing is supposed to be fun, after all.
  9. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Ha Ha.

    FWIW, more than one traveling teacher (from BsAs) has commented on the floorcraft in Boston, and they weren't exactly compliments.

  10. jennyisdancing

    jennyisdancing Active Member

    I can relate to this one:

    I never sit at Salsa (swing, ballroom etc.). There’s always someone to dance with. With Tango I sit a lot. I can’t ask anyone to dance, or when I do I get shot down. I feel like a social leper half the time like Im high school. Salsa (swing, ballroom, etc.) is just easier. Its more fun. I have a better time there.

    I haven't "quit" tango; I still love it. But to be honest I don't dance it anymore. There are just too many of us followers (in my area) and we do, in fact, sit a lot. Why should I pay $10 or more for a milonga when I don't get the same value from it (time spent dancing) that the leaders can enjoy? I don't see how I can experience "tango bliss" if most of my milonga time is spent sitting and not dancing.

    As for the argument that milongas are for socializing, too - meh. I can socialize for free at non-dance events. At a dance, yes I'm friendly and pleasant and I enjoy a little chitchat, but after all, I'm there to dance.

    Granted there are some salsa, swing or ballroom events that also are follower-heavy and I avoid those as well. But with those other dance styles, usually I can find at least a few venues where the gender balance is good and I can dance as much as I want. Just my two cents. If I was in a different location with more leaders, absolutely I would do more AT.
  11. Angel HI

    Angel HI Well-Known Member

    Welcome to the DF, Magic.
  12. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Hmm ... interesting .. well I agree with this - up to a point.

    - Proficiency and skill They help yes - but I think it's more important that the leader is clear with his intention and that there is never any doubt in how he communicates that lead. You dont have to be an expert or even experienced. It's easier anyway when you're young .. your heart hasnt been broken :) ...

    - Know the Music Personally I dont agree with this one. I've danced long enough that I am familiar with most of the popular AT tunes, but I dont go beyond familiarity. I like to keep some mystery in there. I dont want to become one of those old-timers who always dances the same way to each tune because they really do know their music. I dont want to intellectualise, I want to feel.

    - Vocabulary Yes definitely less is more. Sometimes you dont have to do anything except walking. Though usually the music makes you do more. The music dictates everything.

    - Ethereal Yes you need to be in the "zone" and "tuned in". In our lives it can be hard to be truly altruistic. We can be in a tango embrace.

    - Physical Yes yes and yes ...

    I notice you dont mention a couple of other things .. including floorcraft ... lol!... so I will ...

    - Setting and location You already like the location. You're fond of the organizers. Ooh look at this nice touch! Before you even have a dance you're happy.

    - Floorcraft As a leader you want to feel free on the floor. The guy in front of you isnt moving back into you. He's moving forward at a constant pace. The guy behind you isnt trying to crowd you.

    As a follower you can feel that the leader is aware and in control. Even if there is some loon behind you, you're not going to go into him. You can have complete faith in your leader.

    Even better than this is that rare state when the dancers in the room are moving as one. When you become part of a larger group, a larger unity. Sometimes this lasts only for a song. Sometimes for the evening. But it always heightens your experience. And can make even the mundane dances special.
  13. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    I dont think this is a good reason to stay. You might as well buy a lottery ticket....bliss can be acheived other ways far more easily.....in blues dancing for instance, you can just close your eyes with the right partner and go into that wonderful space..

    I'd settle for a couple of wonderful dances in a milonga, and generally I get more than that.. being appreciated.....musicality is important but knowing the title, composer, orchestra etc. isnt necessary. I know a lot of tango music intimately but knowing every title is a waste of memory space
  14. Madahlia

    Madahlia Member

    I can certainly resonate with this one too. That was a BAD moment, when I realised that all my enthusiasm to learn & exerience was likely to evaporate sitting on the plancha.

    Things have improved enormously with time (eventually it's possible to build up a network of "regular clientele") but my willingness to drive for hours and spend my money on the chance of having a handful of mediocre dances is now non-existent. The result is that my tango development is a lot slower than it could have been.

    I'm not a great believer in tango bliss - I'm aiming for tango contentment. I think I used to experience tango bliss after 6 months to 18 months of dancing AT. I don't much any more - I notice my own and my partners' shortcomings too much. Sometimes it is better to travel hopefully....
    On the rare occasions when I dance with anyone with skill levels remotely above average I'm usually too terrified to actually enjoy it, anyway.

    My own personal definition of tango bliss would be a dance that makes me completely unaware of how much my shoes are hurting towards the end of a long milonga. I used to be able to get "into the zone" much more easily, especially in MJ, but, heyho, all things must pass.
  15. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    I certainly agree with your comment about "willingness to drive". It's what at the end of the day makes me focus on the weekenders. You get better dances there and you have time to relax into the dancing. I'd rather go to a weekender in the New Forest than drive half the distance to go to Negrachas - any day :p

    For me the biggest "reason to quit" is the relationship one. Is tango a healthy habit at the end of the day? Does it make us better emotionally?Or does it make us lazy about love and commitment? I guess it depends on what your relationship status is, but to me it's the dimension that most worries me. Bleh - I analyse too much :rolleyes:
  16. Captain Jep

    Captain Jep New Member

    Close your eyes?! Are you allowed to?

    I guess blues also has that advantage that much of the music is stuff we've all grown up with. Maybe not our preferred genre, but we've all heard it on FM radio. Tango music doesnt quite have the same resonance. For me with tango the dancing has always come first.
  17. Mario7

    Mario7 Member

    Hi Miles, looking at yoiur Blog it seems that you have now taken the
    direction of Close embrace social dancing rather than open as in the past.
    Would you comment on when this happened and how and why?
    ..Also, would you name the cities, in your experience, which have the most
    solid Close Embrace style of dancing community? Are you getting support for
    your move to CE and which direction do you see the USA going in ? thanks!
  18. bordertangoman

    bordertangoman Well-Known Member

    in blues dancing if you choose to dance in close embrace you can dance on the same spot.

    I agree that tango music and blues are different genres. I wouldnt say one is better than the other just different. The blues has its own musical scale.
  19. Madahlia

    Madahlia Member

    How do you mean, exactly? More notes than the sol-fa scale? Different musical intervals? Quarter tones?

    You're not but I am! :D
  20. Madahlia

    Madahlia Member

    Absolutely. I've been to Negracha's maybe 3 times and am unlikely to bother again. My most enjoyable, stimulating and productive tango experiences recently have been at residential tango events although they were very hard to adjust to as a complete beginner. I've never been to the New Forest events, though I would love to, partly due to the logistics of finding a partner for the event, then transporting and accommodating them there. Many's the time I've been grateful for the simplicity of throwing my sleeping bag down on the floor of the communal dorm at Totnes!

    How can it make us worse emotionally? If you didn't dance would you be more willing to commit to someone, or commit closer to someone or would you just spend more unproductive time on your own? Would it be possible to relate to a wider number of congenial people in some other way? Does dancing stop you relating more deeply to a small number of people? Would there be another activity - bellringing, for example, or trout-fishing - that would help you to relate closely, cooperatively and sensitively to a range of other people?

    I guess involvement in the dance world means an constant supply of potential replacement partners if you're of a mind to be restless - and clearly many people are. But I don't think it would be right to blame this restlessness on the dance itself, it comes from within. It's obviously possible to be in committed relationship and still enjoy tango anyway.

    I think I am more developed emotionally as a result of involvement in dancing, though not specifically tango. Whether I would have got to the same place by absorption in another hobby, or just by 10 more years in the school of life, I don't know. Perhaps the issue is where I could have got to by absorption in people, rather than in a hobby?

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