Swing Discussion Boards > What kind of swing are Benji & Heidi doing?

Discussion in 'Swing Discussion Boards' started by kayak, Oct 12, 2006.

  1. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    There is a series of online video clips under the swing video section. I was wondering what kind of swing the 3 of Benji and Heidi fall under? Is it WCS to a fast pace or does it fall under a different catagory?
  2. DancingJools

    DancingJools Member

    That's WCS. At the championship level.
  3. victordancer

    victordancer New Member

    i would like to add that benji and heidi's performances were in the showcase division of the west coast swing championships which includes lifts. There is also a classic division which does not include lifts but is very exciting also and of which you can find examples on Youtube.
  4. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    Thanks, I figured it was and knew about the Open/Classic classes. Everyone in my area sure does it to much slower music. I kind of like dancing WCS to music with a faster pace, but people will sometimes tell me that WCS is supposed to be much slower blues type music. So I just was unsure if there was a speed limit? Looks like if my brain is fast enough to lead it and her feet are fast enough do the spins, we are good to go. I'm thinking that when the floor gets really crowded, that cartwheel thingy will come in handy for clearing us some space :)
  5. Dancelf

    Dancelf Member

    WCS performance tends to run a bit faster than the social music; Benji and Heidi trend toward faster music than most. Blues is optional.
  6. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    Thanks, that makes a lot of sense. The difference between good and great is probably at the extremes. Either show moves that are faster than most other can do or go very slow so they can see form that others can not hold.
  7. danceallstyles

    danceallstyles New Member

    The interesting thing about WCS is that the look and feel of the dance changes with the music and with the speed as much as with the people dancing it. Benji and Heidi are amazing, but if you watch other amazing couples you might feel they were doing a different type of swing all together. Check out Jordan and Tatianna, or Kyle and Sarah. There should be videos on YouTube somewhere
  8. leftfeetnyc

    leftfeetnyc New Member

    WCS use to be danced much faster music...say 120-180 BPM...that's nothing compared to Lindy Hop, but it's still decently fast music.

    Since 1998 the music has started to feature more and more contemporary music and 120 BPM is now at the fast speed.

    Also, just because something is blue doesn't mean it's slow. There's a lot of fast blues out there and many styles of blues music:

    Jump Blues, Delta Blues, Mississippi Blues, etc. Some aren't even swing-able.

    John Festa, when he still held his weekly WCS dance in NYC was starting to increase the speeds again as the faster music will help new dancers understand the proper connection for swing, something that learning and only dancing to slower music destroys in the learning process. People who understood the connection can keep it at slower speeds, but if that's what you start dancing too, it's harder to find and comprehend.

    I like slow music provided the connection is there, but I love fast blues. I think I've tapped out at about 200BPM. There's less room for fancy sholder shakes and interpertive styling. But there's still a lot of room to be creative, you just have to approach it in a different way than you do slow music.
  9. kayak

    kayak Active Member

    Thanks for the all the responses. So why do we seperate all the circular swings like EC or Lindy etc based upon speed and differences in styling, but WCS is just WCS all the way from super slow to as fast as you can go?
  10. leftfeetnyc

    leftfeetnyc New Member

    The differences between ECS and Lindy have nothing to do with speed. They are seperated by rhythmic attributes and basic steps. Both ECS and Lindy have a wide range of slow and fast tempo songs, as do other circular swing dances such as Balboa and Collegiate Shag.

    ECS and Lindy Hop are extremely similar dances. Their 6 count basic is the same. ECS was created for studios. It was often easier for the new dancer to pick up on and added a new dance to entice new students. Since it's creation there have been styling changes that help differentiate the two.

    Many long-time dancers will comment that ECS is nothing more than simplified Lindy. A discussion not worth going into as no one will ever agree.

    Just as they have a variety of tempos, so do slotted dances are already broken into Carolina Shag, Whip, Push, WCS, etc.

    All of them have movements and rhythmic patterns/basic steps that make them unique from one another. Since they're all forms of swing, you can often do one with another...i.e. a shag dancer can dance with a WCS dancer with some modification.

    Some dances like Slow Whip really do have a tempo requirement. Tempo requirements are often there based on what the body can handle at certain speeds. Necessary movement in WCS, like staying in the slot or pivoting during the whip cannot be done past a certain speed. It's possible to dance that way to faster speeds than is happening, but you couldn't do it to some of the top speeds that a Lindy Hopper could.
  11. Firephreek

    Firephreek New Member

    Just a nitpick, but the 'basic' step in lindy is the swing out, an 8 count pattern. It's more similar to a west coast whip than an EC Basic. While there are 6 count patterns, they don't comprise the standard set of movements or patterns. The 8 count is more natural for Lindy since it matches the music it's typically danced to. Plus the origins from Charleston etc...
  12. leftfeetnyc

    leftfeetnyc New Member

    I did not say "The Lindy Basic" -- I was comparing 6 count to 6 count since that is where the similarity lies...one does happen to be the basic step of the dance (ECS) the other is just a rhythmic similarity of the other (lindy) which is not THE basic step, but a basic step in the overall scheme of things.

    Which is why I wrote "6 count basic" instead of "the basic"
  13. Vince A

    Vince A Active Member

    I might add:

    WCS at a really slow speed is difficult, and can be very, very sexy. Yet, many individuals have trouble going real slow . . . I personally like them that speed and at the other end of the spectrum - very fast!

    I've danced with many Lindy followers who have never danced a WCS (so they said), and they followed very well, but I don't think most WCS-only followers could LH without an initial struggle . . .
  14. leftfeetnyc

    leftfeetnyc New Member

    Vince...we need to dance!!! Nothing like fast WCS!

    A good friend of mine and I dance both Lindy and WCS on the lindy nights we'll occasionally dance WCS just to see how fast we can get (I think we've topped out at 180).
  15. Vince A

    Vince A Active Member

    Sorry, I just caught this . . .

    I probably wouldn't be able to do it so fast w/o those few Lindy privates that I've had from d nice (a DF member) and about a half-dozen group lessons. He told me that Lindy dancers can dance to 300 BPM . . . good Lord! I don't even jog that fast . . . ;)
    Have you ever gone that fast?

    Yep, I agree . . . we need to dance!

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