Tango Argentino > What's the name of this move?

Discussion in 'Tango Argentino' started by Imbrace, Jun 9, 2012.

  1. Imbrace

    Imbrace Member

    follower back ocho, leader scadas her moving leg, she crosses left over right, he collects, he goes for a back ocho, she uncrosses and scadas his moving leg, she crosses left over right, she collects and goes for a back ocho, and so on.
  2. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Hi Imbrace, I dont know what you actually mean with collecting. Do you mean the neutral position? Excluding this I fear there is no single term for the sequence you´ve explained. It´s simply a sequence of that said moves. Only to add if the sequence is continuing in the same way several times we call it cadena.
  3. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Sounds like it might be a small/tight cadena. When you say he does a back ocho and she "sacadas" is she taking essentially a sidestep with her right leg toward him? Then he crosses his left foot back in front of himself instead of collecting on the back ocho as she either crosses with her left foot or takes a small forward step with her left foot?
  4. Imbrace

    Imbrace Member

    opendoor, you got it right. It's cadena, thank you :)
    By collecting, I meant putting feet together and changing weight, but maybe it's a side step instead. Here is a nice video.

    That is very interesting! What I saw some people doing and what I now see in the video above is this, froward - side - backward - cross and the cycle repeats. But You made me think, maybe it's possible to do side - backward - cross. If it is, you wouldn't change weight in the cross, but pivot towards your partner and uncross.

    Another thing is that it can be done either side, so the cross can be left over right or right over left. In this video it's right over left, unlike the one of the # 5 of the basic. I did not pay attention when I mentioned the left and right thing in my first post. It was a mistake.
  5. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Ok, I call it "going through the neutral position", or simply closing. Only heard "collecting" in context the of taiji (I once did).

    so far
  6. Subliminal

    Subliminal Well-Known Member

    Essentially that is a cadena. I believe the more traditional one is to the other side, but it doesn't really matter much as long as you understand how to build one yourself.
  7. Imbrace

    Imbrace Member

    I think you're right. When you transfer weight, it is called closing. In collecting you don't/don't necessarily transfer weight. Here is a couple of my references.


    And as I said, in the cadena, maybe it's better to take a side step instead of closing, so it's forward - side - back - cross ...
  8. sixela

    sixela Well-Known Member

    Done properly, you do more than collect as a leader in this phase. You do a side step accompanying the follower (which can be large in which case the follower's step looks more like the end of a forward ocho, or small in which case it looks more like a cross).

    But yes, as others have said it's a cadena (which exists starting on the position at the end of both back ochos). I rarely see them done in their entirety.

    For some videos (just to demonstrate principles, I didn't care to pick the best examples)...

    Here's one:


    Here's one on the other back ocho:


    [Note how the ones with a small step that he demonstrates at the start are more clumsy than the ones he shows we he starts to make them " flow" and takes side steps].

    There are bucketloads of variations. You don't have to catch the follower's leg, you can also send her in a foward boleo instead and then accompany her from there (in what I'd call a forward alteración). You can even go to the other side of that trailing foot.

    And there are radically different cadenas based on the "regular" alteración, as at 1:10 here, that don't have the follower doing anything that remotely resembles a cross.

  9. sixela

    sixela Well-Known Member

    Got my URLs crossed. The last one is obviously the one wheere the leader goes to the other side of the trailing foot (instead of doing a sacada).

    The one based on the more regular alteración is this one, at 1:10:

  10. dchester

    dchester Moderator Staff Member

    Collecting does not involve a weight change, (either that, or pretty much every teacher I've ever had, got this wrong).
  11. Imbrace

    Imbrace Member

    sixela, when I got the name, I went and checked all the videos. The 2nd video is even posted in post # 4. But thank you for explaining about the other variations which I could not catch myself, although I watched all these videos.

    That's a terrible scenario, isn't it?
  12. AndaBien

    AndaBien Well-Known Member

    I don't know what's terrible about it.

    To me, collecting is a common term. It means gathering ones feet and axis together after a change of weight. Some times the collection occurs only for a moment on the way to the next step.
  13. Imbrace

    Imbrace Member

    One minute, dchester said "Collecting does not involve a weight change, (either that, or pretty much every teacher I've ever had, got this wrong)", and I meant that it's terrible scenario that pretty much every teacher he's ever had, got this wrong ;)

    Also, I'm with with opendoor and dchester (at least at this moment) in that collecting does not imply or include a weight change. You might want to call the feet position after changing weight 'collection' too though, but even then the term is still about the fact or position of the feet after the weight has been changed regardless of this weight change itself.

    Here is my reference.
  14. Tanguera2

    Tanguera2 New Member

    Yes, That is one of several beautiful cadenas (chains). Hs collection is just part of the pivot into his back ocho, and should not be done as a separate move, otherwise his momentum is lost and her sacada won' happen without a lot of artificial tugging.

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