General Dance Discussion > Women asking men to dance.

Discussion in 'General Dance Discussion' started by Spitfire, Oct 20, 2003.

  1. Bailamosdance

    Bailamosdance Well-Known Member

    Newbie, yes I see your situation, I guess, but what has her expectations got to do with yours? Socially u cannot refuse a dance. If you do, yes, it affirms that old saw about being a lady who does not get to dance.

    However, I attend events where women sit for hours, apparently awaiting an invitation. Then, as they leave, their bitter feelings come out with comments about how they didn't get to dance.

    In this case, I have zero sympathy for a lady (or a man) who does not attempt to dance at a social.
    opendoor likes this.
  2. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    I agree that a women who makes no effort has no right to be bitter...
    Bailamosdance likes this.
  3. toothlesstiger

    toothlesstiger Well-Known Member

    So, what we see here is that it's complicated. :)

    We have cultural expectations built up that, regardless of the circumstances, it is the man that should do the asking and the suggesting.

    In dancing, as in life, if you wait to be invited, your opportunities will be cut down to 1% of what they could have been otherwise. Subscribing to the notion that women should wait to be asked is sexist.
    Bailamosdance likes this.
  4. Bailamosdance

    Bailamosdance Well-Known Member

    That is SO true, T. These 'rules' DO seem made up to put women in the subservient position, and make men the dominants. I cannot imagine a woman making that rule...
  5. opendoor

    opendoor Well-Known Member

    Do not agree, again. My experience: dancing turns the balance. Dancing is the supreme discipline. If you got money: No chance with pretty women. I´m absolutely average, got no money (divorced) and beyond 55: haven´t noticed yet, because I can dance (salsa, tango).
  6. dbk

    dbk Well-Known Member

    Or, you know, women are individuals with all sorts of various, and completely legitimate, preferences.
    leee likes this.
  7. jfm

    jfm Active Member

    cabaceo/mirada, people!!!!!
    It gets rid of all this trouble!
    This is why the tango people are always banging on about it!!
  8. FancyFeet

    FancyFeet Well-Known Member

    No, that's what matters when I'm looking for a date! (Well, except for money. I can make my own, and tend to set the bar at 'gainfully employed or with the potential+willingness to become so.)

    When it comes to a dance at a social event, it's about dancing. (And maybe a little bit about height, esp. for standard.)
    SwayWithMe and dbk like this.
  9. toothlesstiger

    toothlesstiger Well-Known Member

    Umm, got to disagree on that. I have seen plenty of men with all those qualities hurting for a date, or a dance, where "lesser" men have all the female accompaniment they want. What do those "lesser" men have? Once upon a time, they would have called it charm. The ability to make a lady feel special. Whether it's his dancing ability, or his ability to talk and charm and flirt, the man who has this will always do better than the once that doesn't.

    Incidentally, that does go both ways. ;-)
  10. Joe

    Joe Well-Known Member

    That's just nonverbal acceptance/rejection. What makes you think the women who currently don't get asked would suddenly find themselves with a plethora of partners?
    Bailamosdance likes this.
  11. jfm

    jfm Active Member

    the original post and much of the discussion is about women not feeling comfortable asking.
    Women can initiate eye contact too. It's more of a suggestion than an invitation anyway-a non verbal 'you fancy this?' no verbal asking, no walk of shame, no awkward feeling that someone agreed to dance with you because you put them on the spot.
    If they can catch someone's eye it's often not clear who looked first either. I would NEVER verbally invite someone as I would be too embarrassed that they might be forced to accept. If I look at him, he can avoid a horrible dance or I can avoid embarrassment of rejection.

    Also there is no 'rejection' unless you are a total jerk about how you avoid eye contact or you do that horrible *****y thing Christina Ladas said to do on that awful video!!!!!!!!
    If I don't want to dance with someone I don't meet their gaze, they don't know whether it's because I'm not wearing my glasses, or I'm not looking around, or if I'm looking at someone else. I don't make eye contact and then slowly break it or shake my head because that's actually quite nasty.
  12. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    however, if I am speaking with someone, I always pay them the respect of looking at them, so if someone is wanting to catch my eye to dance, it isn't going to happen...they are going to have to come over and, when I am not talking with someone I have done everything short of wearing a sign that says, i don't bite or smell or criticize, please ask me to dance :) the end, I usually have to ask
  13. Steve Pastor

    Steve Pastor Moderator Staff Member

    As I often point out, the AT/milonga/Buenos Aires people (and overseas emulators) have taken a basic, non verbal way of communicating - the simple act of looking at something we favor, or not looking at something we don't favor - and made it both a requirement and a skill to be developed.

    I've heard this one often enough, and had little reason to doubt that it's true!!
  14. toothlesstiger

    toothlesstiger Well-Known Member

    So here is the fundamental problem. As I recall from an old 'Cathy' comic, she informs her boyfriend Irving that whenever there is any possibility of personal humiliation, it is the boy's job to initiate.

    As I said before, if you wait for invitations, your chances of an encounter that you wanted drop by 99%. Yes, it sucks to get rejected, so why is it the other person's job to run that risk?
  15. fascination

    fascination Site Moderator Staff Member

    well, I think that because no one knows how much anyone else still honors convention, it is difficult sometimes to make a decision about what one should do
  16. samina

    samina Well-Known Member

    I don't care how cosmetically challenged or youth challenged a man is...for me, it's always about the dancing. And money? The question doesn't even make it into the room.

    As for ladies who invite being lesser dancers...I don't hesitate to ask, it is not a loaded matter for me for any reason...and I know I'm no slacker in the dance department.

    So much for a few of the generalizations made thus far... :)
  17. danceronice

    danceronice Well-Known Member

    Of height, looks, age, and money, all matter if I'm looking for a date (regarding age, that means older as I don't date down in any of those categories). Of the four, only height matters if I'm looking for a social dance (and that's mostly because I'm not very good at compensating for a shorter partner in Smooth/Standard.)
    dbk likes this.
  18. samina

    samina Well-Known Member

    I will clarify my statement above and add that it was made in the context of social dancing, not dating.
  19. Sagitta

    Sagitta Well-Known Member

    I disagree. I prefer not to do that, ever. I don't see the problem of just going over and asking someone rather then having winks, eye connections, head movements....a code that one must learn.... It amkes things even more complicated then they should be imo.
  20. Bailamosdance

    Bailamosdance Well-Known Member

    Obviously a MAN made up this complicated code to prevent women from having any power or choice, and make women the weak part of this misogynistic 'code'....

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