Dancers Anonymous > Would you take a job if...

Discussion in 'Dancers Anonymous' started by SPratt74, May 1, 2006.

  1. saludas

    saludas New Member

    Unfortunately, the jobs that are the most challenging are also the ones that demand the most skills and work ethic. That's why clerical pays less than management or administrative. You do realize that a job with less responsibility and more flexibility are the less important jobs, and the ones that have workers that are more 'interchangeable', don't you?

    'Work ethic' or more exactly 'lack of work ethic' is why you can't get those low responsibility, flexible hours jobs like telcom rep anymore here in the US - these jobs have gone to where people are happy to work hard and work within the constraints of today's business models, such as work hours based upon OTHER PEOPLE'S NEEDS and job conditions based on the JOB AT HAND. Fast food chains offer the most flexible jobs, with the least responsibility, and brain surgeon requires the most responsibility and least flexible hours - and tho you could argue that both jobs are the same (service, dealing with people, using cutting utensils) they are very different. That's why the fry cook at McD get $6/hr and the surgeon gets $5,000. True, the surgeon has amore pressured work environment, but he also gets REWARDED for his energy.
     
  2. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    You're not accounting for skill set or talent. I have a unique skill set which I worked hard to develop and be good at which has put me in a place to be picky and has put my employers in a place to be flexible in order to attract me to the job. I work smarter, not harder. If you make your combination of skills highly desireable, it gives you freedom to be picky and to set your hours. That doesn't mean I don't have a work ethic. I work hard (and incidentally moderately long hours). I just happen to have flexibility in choose which hours of the day those are. There are different kinds of responsibility. If you work with people, then times are important. If you work at a computer, then you don't necessarily have to accomodate other people's hours. Of course, there are deadlines, but those are typically measured in days, not hours.

    Working smarter gives a comparable degree of reward as does working harder, only with less effort. That's the way I took my career. I took it in a direction where I didn't have to work hard. Rather I work smart, and I'm good at what I do. And I do important challenging work that I'm proud of. But it sounds like according to you an important challenging job with good pay and flexible hours don't exist. If that's the case, then I guess I don't exist either. ;)

    However, maybe my case is an exception, or maybe I'm lucky. I think the things you've said are generally true. I'm just saying it's not universally true. However, I also think your priorities are not going to be the same as others' and that none are inherently wrong. I'm not going to judge people based on their work ethics. I think that poor people can have rich lives and vice versa. Everyone's heard the adage: "It's lonely at the top". i think it applies to more than loneliness. Some of the happiest people I know are definitely not the richest (monetarily). But that doesn't mean they have a poor work ethic either. Everything's relative.

    -hepcat
     
  3. SPratt74

    SPratt74 New Member

    I'm sorry, but I think that you are wrong. I was an Administrative Assistant for five years and believe me you need skills and good work ethic to be able to handle this type of job. This is why I get so tired of people that are managers and think they know everything when in reality it's the Administrative Assistants and/or secretaries that know how to run the show.

    In fact, I knew the college better than the President did. I knew how the students thought, because they would come to me when they would have problems and not know who to go to, and I was a student first before I was offered a position there. I knew how the teachers thought, because I was also their assistant when needed, and I also did their evaluations. I knew how to teach the classes, because I was a teacher as well as a substitute once in a while. I also knew what the problems were both staff wise. I knew how to order supplies including books since I was the one that would sometimes order the students books for them. I was the one that entered every library book into the new system that they ordered, and that was over 5000 books that I had to enter. I knew basically how to run the Registrar's Office, Administrative Offices, Bookstore, Library, and classes in general. (The only thing I tried to stay away from was financial aide lol.) And that's only part of what I did for them. I mean I was tossed everywhere!

    But this is what also frustrated me, because I felt as though I was not appreciated. I had done everyone's jobs for them, but was treated like dirt basically all because the managers thought they were more important. They didn't give the assistants good enough raises for what they did. But yet they expected you to be happy about it. This is why last year when my x and I finally split, I was so mad at that point that I said to hell with everything, but you know that I don't feel bad about it at all lol. I'm actually impressed with myself that I told them all where they could go. They have since gone down hill. I think that the school is fine, but some of the staff really needs to go.
     
  4. newdancer113

    newdancer113 New Member

    I'd kill for hours that were only 6:15 to 3 or 4 pm! (and only 5 days a week)

    My job requires that I get to work as early as 5 or 6 am and often stay as late as 8pm. I also regularly go in on weekends for 4 hours or so. Then sometimes I have to take call, and I'm up all night. I work an average of 80 hours a week. (FYI...I'm a surgeon)

    I didn't used to be a morning person. Now I am, and even on days I'm not working I frequently wake up early even when I don't mean to. The conversion has come about by years of having to get up early. I tolerate my hours because I love my job. And even with the hours I work, I still have time for fun..I manage to squeze in skiing, rock climbing, bicycling, dance lessons, going to the gym, etc. Even though I'm acutally still in residency and don't make really big bucks yet (and no surgeon makes $5000 per hour, thought its' nothing to sneeze at), having a decent income to pay for all this is nice.

    Yes, you'd have to go to bed earlier, but how much do you really go out late during the week anyway? You'd still have weekends, right? And being done earlier in the afternoon would give you opportunities too.

    If the hours are the major thing holding you back, I'd take the job and deal with the hours. If nothing else, the job could provide you valuable experience and could function as a stepping stone to moving your career along. Plus provide with funds to pay your bills, save some money and support your hobbies. You don't have to keep these hours forever.
     
  5. SPratt74

    SPratt74 New Member

    Well, it's not that I go out late at night. It's that I go to school at night and they are between two to three hour classes. That and then homework on top of that is what I also have to take into consideration. I also like to dance at night, but I don't have to go dancing every night. And when my studio does dance at night it's only for an hour not all night.
     
  6. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    School is inherently temporary though... How frequently do you dance 'til later than 10 on a weekday? There aren't that many opportunities to dance (swing) where I am. The only weekend option is 1 monthly dance. So I have two weekday dances that typically keep me up past midnight and an evening rehearsal with an ensemble, and lately with a new GF, I'm pushing my waking hours on the intervening days. I'm up late a lot. Ironically, I usually get to bed earlier on the weekend.

    -hepcat
     
  7. saludas

    saludas New Member

    At no time did I mean to put an admin assist into the lump that I put for clerical - if it was interprested that way then I'm sorry, as I thought that Admin Assist was part of Admin. And yes, you're right, the assists run the show!!
     
  8. saludas

    saludas New Member

    Well, then, the nights you are in school will not affect your dancing, at least until you leave shcool, so that should not be an issue, since you can't substitute dancing for the schoolwork.
     
  9. saludas

    saludas New Member

    there's a famous saying that covers this, BTW - because some of us MUST dance....
     
  10. SPratt74

    SPratt74 New Member

    That's alright. I didn't know about any of this until I took that job myself lol. No biggie! ;) And you are right for the most part that sometimes the Administrative Assistant can be part of Admin., but not necessarily in all places. My youngest sister is learning this too as she also is an Administrative Assistant, but she works for the media circuit, and is considered part of the management team where she works. So, it does vary depending on the place as to how you are looked upon. ;)
     
  11. SPratt74

    SPratt74 New Member

    Well, right now my dancing is more like a haven as how someone else put it. I want to take it seriously later on, which is why I'm taking everything in now that I can!!! It's just that I also want to get through school once and for all and start living the kind of life I want to first. However, things are moving along rather quickly, so all of this might happen sooner than what I think!;)
     
  12. Joe

    Joe Well-Known Member

    Biorhythms and circadian clocks are BS unless you're talking drastic schedules, like working 9pm to 6am. Anyone can adapt to a 2-hour time shift. All those people who never took early classes in college and slept in after binging all night--do you think they were unable to adapt to the business world's 8-5 schedule?
     
  13. delamusica

    delamusica Active Member

    I totally agree. Yes, I'm a student, but I also work. And I'm very good at what I do - with people calling and asking for my services, I am in a position to schedule them when it's convinient for me. I love my job, and I'm very good at it - it's challenging, rewarding, and I have worked extremely hard to be skilled enough to do it.

    I don't think challenging jobs with flexible schedules are really all that uncommon - Saludas is just being closed-minded in saying that those of us who want flexibility in a job have a poor work ethic.
     
  14. pygmalion

    pygmalion Well-Known Member

    I think hepcat and delamusica have a good point. If you have the skill set, you have a much greater probability of calling your own shots, schedule-wise... within reason.

    I also think that a lot depends on the job market. For example, in the industries with which I'm familiar, the job market took a nose dive, post 9-11. Things are starting to rebound, now. But for a good four-year period, it was an employers' market. Period. End of story. Those folks who got jobs offers took the job and considered themselves lucky not to have to change industries. And those folks were few and far between.

    I don't think it's a simple question that Spratt is asking. Or at least, I don't think there's a simple answer. :cool:
     
  15. saludas

    saludas New Member

    It looks like the job he was applying for was a teaching job for young kids. Apparently that is his training etc.

    I sincerely doubt that they will change the school hours and work conditions for him, for you see, many jobs are time and location based.

    Yes, there are many jobs that let you 'call the shots'. EMS technician, for one, does not. Either does rock musician (you have to play your gig when the venue has the time shceduled). Yes, some jobs allow for for sliptime, such as 'puter guy or such. But I was under the impression that THIS job had time constriants. And if it was a teaching job in a school, then that was a 'given'... even before the poster started his career training.
     
  16. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    Period? End of Story? Applies to everyone universally? hehehehe... How many times do I have to say everything's relative? I work in biodefense: anti-bioterrorism stuff. Does that change your opinion? I was working in biodefense before 9/11. My job market went up and it was not an employer's market for me. Remember the anthrax attacks?

    -hepcat
     
  17. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    I'm not disagreeing that people can't do a 2 hour time shift. The problem is that the events attended in the evening don't time shift along with the job. That's the problem with the time shift.

    I'm not so sure about calling biorhythms BS. Awhile back, I wouldn't have thought they were THAT influential on a person's desired schedule, but my opinion has recently changed. I think there's more to it and that it should be respected. I never used to "listen" to what my body was telling me. For example, I used to eat fast food all the time. My skin was always oily and I was always breaking out. I never put 2 and 2 together. But I had to decrease my triglycerides once for a blood test and the only thing I changed about my diet for two weeks was cut out fast food. All of a sudden, my skin was no longer oily and my complexion cleared up! So now I've recently noticed how my quality of sleep seems to change with the season. Granted, it's an empirical observation without hard proof, but I think it's worth investigating. I wouldn't be too quick to discount something like biorhythms. plus, I think it has more influence on a person the older they are. What a kid can do in college is not the same thing a 40 year old can do. I think everyone will agree with that. So citing the schedule of a 20 year old is not very convincing.

    -hepcat
     
  18. hepcat

    hepcat Member

    I'll concede the point. I'll admit that my statements haven't had a lot to do with SP74's specific situation. I just disagreed with the way some opinions were expressed as universal truths that apply to everyone.

    -hepcat
     
  19. SPratt74

    SPratt74 New Member

    I have to disagree with you here. There have been studies done and books written about this subject alone. (You tend to learn more about this while you are a student though.) Seriously I first heard of it on Oprah, but then I started reading about the subject, and I have to agree that with hepcat and everything they have said, so I won't repeat that stuff again. So, I tell you people that think that your body isn't a warning sign are the ones that end up dying early from heart attacks or whatever, because they simply did not listen to their body.

    Interesting topic! I didn't think this would be such a hot debate lol!!! ;)
     
  20. pygmalion

    pygmalion Well-Known Member

    Uhh... I said in the industries I'm familiar with. :cool:

    But yeah. You're right. There are exceptions to virtually everything. *shrug* It never occured to me that anyone would take that statement as literal, but as the generalization it was intended to be. Eh. Whatever. :cool:
     

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