Bal

leee

Well-Known Member
#41
Steps & counts (for leaders):
1. L back
2. R back
3. L gather
4. L step forward
5. R forward
6. L forward
7. R gather
8. R back
 

bookish

Active Member
#42
For the "slow" (2-beat) steps, weight transfer right away is a downhold and delayed (on 2) weight transfer is an uphold. Tapping and kicking are not required, you can also just hover a bit, but they're things to do while delaying the weight transfer. (Isn't at least part of the rationale behind "double swing" that a tap-step helps beginners stay on time because the tap takes a beat?)
 

Siggav

Active Member
#43
Yeah basically what bookish said, it's called an uphold when on the hold step you transfer your weight on the second beat and downhold when you transfer your weight on the first beat.

You can do different things in the first part of an uphold type step but if you're keeping it really neutral, neat and tidy you'll just hover your foot half an inch above the floor for a beat before setting it down, maybe gather your foot a little bit, it's a place where there's lots of footwork variations that you can do, both for leads and follows

One very common "basic" I run into has a downhold on the 3-4 and uphold on the 7-8

The hold step would be the slow in a quick quick slow type counting
 

Steve Pastor

Moderator
Staff member
#44
Isn't at least part of the rationale behind "double swing" that a tap-step helps beginners stay on time because the tap takes a beat?
Right. You are marking every beat. It's interesting to note that Cab Calloway mentioned "double Lindy" in 1934. I'm pretty sure it was something that was just there.
Are uphold and downhold part of "Bal" vocabulary now? I've never heard those terms before.
 

bookish

Active Member
#46
Yep. Really, it's just 2 ways of interpreting QQS rhythm, which is why I said you can pretty much boil everything down to one of those 2 and then create variations by taking the steps in different directions, with different qualities of movement, and different things during the uphold (tap, kick, slide, etc.) There are lots of ways to do it. Whereas the name "Maxie basic" implies a version inspired by the way that specific dancer did his steps, albeit simplified for teaching, so actually not exactly the same way.
 

Steve Pastor

Moderator
Staff member
#47
Anyone care to comment on this quote from 1935?

The foxtrot of today is definitely faster, more vigorous, and varied than that of even five years ago. At the exclusive Charleston Colonial Ball we found the debutantes and cadets doing what they called the Shag. This daring little hop and kick with sudden lunges and shuffling turns.
Though the West the same steps could be traced under the names of Collegiate, Balboa, and Dime Jig.
 

twnkltoz

Well-Known Member
#48
My instructor uses "up hold" and "down hold" and he goes to quite a few bal events and workshops. I'm assuming he got it somewhere.
 

bookish

Active Member
#49
I can't tell you where it came from but uphold/downhold is the common teaching terminology now. It's been around for a while.

Here's another perspective on basics: http://taintwhatyoudo.wordpress.com/2010/05/10/what-basic/

Anyone care to comment on this quote from 1935?

The foxtrot of today is definitely faster, more vigorous, and varied than that of even five years ago. At the exclusive Charleston Colonial Ball we found the debutantes and cadets doing what they called the Shag. This daring little hop and kick with sudden lunges and shuffling turns.
Though the West the same steps could be traced under the names of Collegiate, Balboa, and Dime Jig.
"Same steps" might be a simplification, but this does seem in line with what Peter Loggins said about the derivation of Bal being from foxtrot/two step (as opposed to swing).

More on "basics" or the lack thereof in original Balboa dancing:

 
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leee

Well-Known Member
#53
I finally tried Balboa socially yesterday, though I called it pure pure Bal, because not only did I avoid Bal-swing moves, I avoided anything that's not a Bal basic.
 

leee

Well-Known Member
#55
As much fun as doing the same move can be for a few 8s. Obviously it was a lot easier to do it than e.g. Charleston during the fast song I was dancing to.
 

tangotime

Well-Known Member
#57
Anyone care to comment on this quote from 1935?

The foxtrot of today is definitely faster, more vigorous, and varied than that of even five years ago. At the exclusive Charleston Colonial Ball we found the debutantes and cadets doing what they called the Shag. This daring little hop and kick with sudden lunges and shuffling turns.
Though the West the same steps could be traced under the names of Collegiate, Balboa, and Dime Jig.
Hi Steve.. I can assure you that, WCS and Shag basic are not comparable with Balboa.

I had the distinct pleasure of learning my balboa from one of the best. In matter of fact , ( He ) learned from Ruth Silvey ,who was DD in the Wiltshire studio thru the 50s and 60s.

The fwd and back basic, was counted as.. rock step tap step, repeat . I think I have an old 50s step list..must dig it out .

I actually choreod a Balboa routine for the staff at the AM studio in Houston back in 1962. It was filmed, but I never got a copy !..

As to FT.. The dance went thru many changes from its inception, and yes, the music speed was faster than todays versions.
I was taught when the suggested tempo was 32 bars pm.. its now down to 28 ( a tad too slow for my likes ).
The American style social, is more geared towards 34/36
bars pm . I teach this style to my English students
 

Steve Pastor

Moderator
Staff member
#58
If you do find that step sheet from the 50s, would sure like to see a copy.
Lauré Haile wrote up the dance in her Dance Code, but the copy I have is undated.
According to Blair, there were two different basics, the "tap" or hold being on 3 or 4.
I believe this is another of the dances that had many variations with one becoming the predominant one once the original dancers stopped dancing and people being taught in studios or workshops were the only ones on the floor.

A new dance will bring new challenges, and just like a rookie, I'm a bit apprehensive about walking into a new class (although the studio is very familiar to me.) I wonder exactly what they are going to teach.

Oh, and in case folks haven't seen it...

 

Steve Pastor

Moderator
Staff member
#59
Nice, stress free lesson (for me).

Basic taught was:

B tog (Tch) F f Tog (tch) b

Close to Lauré Haile's version, which has a "place" rather than "together" (making it a rock step). Note that Balboa was the first dance she taught at Murray's in 1945.

The first variation they showed us was Forward on count 3, followed by a hold on 4.
That was followed by 4 "s_ TOG"'s = step Right on Right foot, slide left foot together.
Haile had these listed as RHYTHM BREAKs - item 5 in the Balboa section of her Dance Notes.

I'll be practicing the basic all of this week.
 

tangotime

Well-Known Member
#60
Nice, stress free lesson (for me).

Basic taught was:

B tog (Tch) F f Tog (tch) b

Close to Lauré Haile's version, which has a "place" rather than "together" (making it a rock step). Note that Balboa was the first dance she taught at Murray's in 1945.

The first variation they showed us was Forward on count 3, followed by a hold on 4.
That was followed by 4 "s_ TOG"'s = step Right on Right foot, slide left foot together.
Haile had these listed as RHYTHM BREAKs - item 5 in the Balboa section of her Dance Notes.

I'll be practicing the basic all of this week.
Steve.. I forgot to add.. the music I used for the routine was " Green onions "..I'm in the middle of relocating, but will see if I can find the list .
 

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