New NDCA Bronze and Silver rules

RiseNFall

Well-Known Member
#1
Somebody just pointed this out to me:

NOTE NEW RULE TO BECOME Effective July 1st, 2018
For all American Style Smooth Bronze and Silver levels all couples must start in the traditional Ballroom closed hold, including the lady's left hand being placed on the man's right shoulder, and the first four bars they dance must be in this hold. Double Hand Hold and other Alternative Hand Holds do not count towards this requirement. For all Bronze and Silver levels 12 complete bars, including the required four bars to commence, of the first minute of music must be danced in the traditional closed hold as already defined.

Drat. This is going to be a pain, at least for FADS silver students. At least for smooth. My plans at the moment only include one set of NDCA/FADS comps in close succession, but I feel for students who go back and forth. It's going to make it more difficult to use a comp in one system as a prep for a comp in the other system. Having the same choreography for both would likely be too much of a compromise for some of the dances.

Fortunately, I'm not the one who has to figure it out. ;)
 

RiseNFall

Well-Known Member
#3
For each level there are 10 figures per dance of usually between 8 and 16 measures with allowable variations. Some could be used as is or with minor additional modification to fit the new requirements, some cannot. Typically, as you go through the syllabus, you drop the earlier figures from a competitive routine. The ones that would make an optimal competitive FADS routine at a particular time may not work. This was always the case, just more likely now.

Note that I only said "drat": it ranks as a minor annoyance for me, and I can think of it as a push to be flexible, but it would make my head hurt if I were trying to do a lot of NDCA and franchise competitions.
 

kckc

Active Member
#5
This is how I found out about it. https://www.facebook.com/groups/320321294841825/

DP and I had tweaked our routines awhile back so that we specifically didn't start in closed hold because it was snooze-worthy, but after going through our routines this week, we only had to re-tweak a few pieces to get back to compliance with this. We already had a good mixture of closed and open so it wasn't catastrophic. My biggest disappointment was just changing the openings again.
 

kckc

Active Member
#7
I'm not sure what you mean by "Opens" but it is just Bronze and Silver closed divisions that are affected. When I said a mixture of closed and open, I just meant not traditional ballroom closed hold but still in the silver syllabus.
 

cornutt

Well-Known Member
#8
I may be in the minority, but I approve of the general idea. I've seen too many Smooth routines, particularly in Foxtrot, where the couple was never in closed hold at any time. There's also too many routines around which have "showcase opens", which last for 30 seconds or more, take up a bunch of room, and block traffic.

The requirement to start in closed hold does seem a bit drastic. I guess the idea is to make the invigilator's life a bit easier -- they know that everyone has to dance four bars closed to start. Still, I foresee problems enforcing this.
 

cornutt

Well-Known Member
#10
Well, most comps have "open bronze" and "open silver" events; I wonder if this applies to them, only the closed syllabus heats.
 

RiseNFall

Well-Known Member
#11
I may be in the minority, but I approve of the general idea. I've seen too many Smooth routines, particularly in Foxtrot, where the couple was never in closed hold at any time. There's also too many routines around which have "showcase opens", which last for 30 seconds or more, take up a bunch of room, and block traffic.

The requirement to start in closed hold does seem a bit drastic. I guess the idea is to make the invigilator's life a bit easier -- they know that everyone has to dance four bars closed to start. Still, I foresee problems enforcing this.
I agree with you that I like to see at least some closed hold at all levels. There was already a 50% in closed hold rule in place for bronze and silver; maybe the routine with no closed hold that you are thinking of was gold or open?
 

kckc

Active Member
#12
I may be in the minority, but I approve of the general idea. I've seen too many Smooth routines, particularly in Foxtrot, where the couple was never in closed hold at any time. There's also too many routines around which have "showcase opens", which last for 30 seconds or more, take up a bunch of room, and block traffic.

The requirement to start in closed hold does seem a bit drastic. I guess the idea is to make the invigilator's life a bit easier -- they know that everyone has to dance four bars closed to start. Still, I foresee problems enforcing this.
What Cornutt said. I had a coaching session with a judge/invigilator yesterday and he said this is precisely why it needed to happen.
 

cornutt

Well-Known Member
#13
I agree with you that I like to see at least some closed hold at all levels. There was already a 50% in closed hold rule in place for bronze and silver; maybe the routine with no closed hold that you are thinking of was gold or open?
No, definitely silver. And I've seen it more than once. If the NDCA already had a rule, I don't think anyone was aware of it. It wasn't an issue in bronze -- silver fox and tango (waltz somewhat less) are where I've seen a lot of it, both in NDCA events and in independent comps that (claim to) go by NDCA rules.
 

RiseNFall

Well-Known Member
#14
I just double-checked and on each of the smooth dances in the "restrictions" section for silver it says:
" Single or double hand hold in facing and shadow positions may not comprise more than 50% of a routine. Routine must be comprised of at least 50% Closed Position." The bronze rules are more stringent. It won't be the first time, however, that I have suspected that my propensity to at least read rules puts me in the minority. ;)
 
#15
Now I see it is in the Rule Book published in January 2018. On page 55, at the top of Appendix 1, it states 'The following is a list of the allowable figures, elements and or restrictions for the Closed Syllabus events at NDCA recognized Events. This list of allowable figures, elements, and restrictions was developed to ensure a fair and even playing field for anyone entering closed syllabus competitions.' So, it does not apply to 'Open Bronze' and 'Open Silver' heats.
 

Mengu

Well-Known Member
#17
Given that the lady doesn't actually place her left hand on the man's right shoulder in closed hold...
Lol, I thought about tango when read it, but you're right, hopefully they clean that wording up, or everyone's going to be breaking that rule.

I don't mind the change. But I do wish they would pick a rule (preferably an enforceable one), stick with it, and invigilate it.
 

NURDRMS

Well-Known Member
#19
Yeah, pro and I reworked all our closed smooth routines last week to abide by this new rule. And in the process realized our foxtrot had previously included very little closed hold. So it was a good thing, I guess.
 

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