the hardships of learning to lead/follow

Vince A

Active Member
#21
Dancelf said:
Ever lead a break? I'll agree that not leading is not proposing something, but "stop" is a leadable verb.
And a verb is an "action" word . . . if you haven't moved, you sure as heck cannot "stop." But as you indicate . . . lead a break??? Absolutely, but you can't lead a break unless you've started.

Dancelf said:
I call BS. The music is more than happy to tell you where it is going to be going next, given a minimum amount of polite attention. Easily enough advanced warning to think and plan.
Of course . . . if you know something about music . . . if you don't know "something" about music, you'll (maybe not you) be trying to interpret a foreign language. Try thinking in Chinese and speak Arabic at the same time!
 
#24
My dad taught me to swing and I don't swing professionally so take this for whatever you deam it to be worth.

The one really important thing Dad always told me was..There is only one lead and one follow. But in order to lead you have to know how to follow.. and to follow correctly you must never lead.

I really did not understand that until I started Ballroom. Now I am getting in trouble for keeping my frame to "stiff" in the arms when I get nervous and trying to out think my lead as to what comes next.

Do you think that is what dear old Dad meant? That we must be aware of what pattern and shape and look we wanted to lead and do and as a follow just trust that our lead knows what is best for our partnership?
 

pygmalion

Well-Known Member
#25
Firsttime Dancer said:
Do you think that is what dear old Dad meant? That we must be aware of what pattern and shape and look we wanted to lead and do and as a follow just trust that our lead knows what is best for our partnership?
It sounds to me like what he might've meant. He didn't give follows enough credit, IMO, but that's another thread. :lol:

Boy, are you lucky to have learned dance from your Dad. I learned my ad-lib, club dancing style from my siblings, who aren't old enough for the real- WWII-era, swing. My parents used to do it, but they never taught me. I guess it was just filed under their, "stuff we used to do as reckless youth," category. :?
 
#26
Yes I was very blessed to have learned from him. I also agree that he didn't give follows enough credit but maybe that was because of the follow he was working with...;-) hmmm??? giggle.

I don't know, or maybe I just blocked it out, how many times I stepped on his feet before I got the frame right. Figured out the connection and was able to relax and follow his lead. But once the connection was made wow!

Just to sit and watch him and Mom! Jaw dropping. I can still remember when tehy had to replace the living room light because they forgot how low the light hung and he lifted her over his head and she kicked the light off the ceiling!

But I am getting off thread! Sorry!
 
#30
Vince A said:
No, it means "What's this mean in English?" I guess "broken link" applies . . .
Many web servers are case sensitive - a lowercase .au in the url would likely work.

In any case, the intended meaning is "thanks, but apple juice"; the Chinese part is trivial, but I'm considerably less familiar with Arabic (unless you count Alf Layla wa Layla, and Lions of Al-Rassan at a stretch), and don't feel sufficiently motivated to spell words I cannot pronounce properly using an alphabet that I can't cipher.
 
#31
definitely do not agree that to be a good follow, you must never lead. IF what he meant was, never in your life in any situation.

certainly when you follow, you should follow. but learning to lead is a major step most advanced follows undertake to some degree, in many styles, to the benefit of both their dancing and their following.
 
#32
alemana said:
definitely do not agree that to be a good follow, you must never lead.
I assume he meant never back-lead, as I can't imagine anyone would think that learning the opposite lead/follow would be detrimental in any way...
 

Vince A

Active Member
#34
Dancelf said:
Many web servers are case sensitive - a lowercase .au in the url would likely work.

In any case, the intended meaning is "thanks, but apple juice"; the Chinese part is trivial, but I'm considerably less familiar with Arabic (unless you count Alf Layla wa Layla, and Lions of Al-Rassan at a stretch), and don't feel sufficiently motivated to spell words I cannot pronounce properly using an alphabet that I can't cipher.
I probably know more Chinese than I do Arabic, but I had to go to our office "translation program" that we paid $$$ for, to come up with something in Arabic.

I must say that is impressive if you can speak any of it!!! Way ahead of me, as I only do some Spanish, some French, some Latin, very little Japanese, and even less Chinese. So the Arabic is probably down to a few swear words!!!
 
#35
Vince A said:
I must say that is impressive if you can speak any of it!!! Way ahead of me, as I only do some Spanish, some French, some Latin, very little Japanese, and even less Chinese. So the Arabic is probably down to a few swear words!!!
Right, like any guy who hit puberty before 1988 hasn't got a few spare languages tucked away in case he runs into Jamie Lee Curtis's character from A Fish Called Wanda. Credat Iudaeus Apella, non ego.

I doubt that I'm ahead of you. Rusty highschool French, even rustier Chinese thanks to a few college semesters[1]. Oh, and I managed to successfully order for myself when we went out for dinner in Caracas.

The bookshelf includes French, Spanish, Italian, and Russian audio, as well as books for Hawaiian, Navajo, Cherokee, Persian, and Signing Exact English - plus my old Chinese dictionaries. But I've been a bit remiss in actually studying the things (at most the audio gets played while I'm driving).

Most of my smattering comes from trying to acquire the basic polite vocabulary when I'm working with a non English speaker ("thank you" being the most important), the rest is just what sticks in my brain from books, music lyrics, and movies: "Ist sein Tochter ochtzen bitte?"


[1] My first semester home, we agree on Chinese takeout for dinner, and Dad suggests I call in the order. <ring> "Hi, I like the #7, two #34s, a #17 and some white rice please? 20 minutes? Great!"[2] <click> "Impressed?"
 

Vince A

Active Member
#36
Dancelf said:
I doubt that I'm ahead of you. Rusty highschool French, even rustier Chinese thanks to a few college semesters[1]. Oh, and I managed to successfully order for myself when we went out for dinner in Caracas.
Well, that's where I received my education in French . . . oh, and Latin . . . Catholic School requirement wa-a-a-a-y back then.

Dancelf said:
The bookshelf includes French, Spanish, Italian, and Russian audio, as well as books for Hawaiian, Navajo, Cherokee, Persian, and Signing Exact English - plus my old Chinese dictionaries. But I've been a bit remiss in actually studying the things (at most the audio gets played while I'm driving).
I hope that you put these all to good use . . . say, like your profession?

You mentioned all of those languages, but I forgot two . . . Pig Latin and a recent exhaustive study of Eubonics - J/K . . .

Dancelf said:
[1] My first semester home, we agree on Chinese takeout for dinner, and Dad suggests I call in the order. <ring> "Hi, I like the #7, two #34s, a #17 and some white rice please? 20 minutes? Great!"[2] <click> "Impressed?"
Ah, ha . . . you're not as serious as I first thought!!! LMAO at that!!! I'll remember that one the next time I need a language joke at a meeting or conference!
 
#37
Dancelf said:
I managed to successfully order for myself when we went out for dinner in Caracas.
Yes, but was your selection based on what you actually wanted, or on what dishes of which you knew the names? ;)
 

cornutt

Well-Known Member
#38
alemana said:
you'd be surprised. i've heard that sentiment expressed on this board before.
Not from me, I hope! If you ever saw me write that, let me assure you that that wasn't what I intended to say, and I'll take twenty lashes for it having come across that way. I'm all in favor of every dancer learning at least a bit of the "opposite" role; my own clumsy attempts at following have taught me a number of things that I was never able to get out of either lectures or from being back-led.

My advice on leading generally starts with what my instructor always tells me: Dance your own part first. If you don't do that, there is no possible way that the follower can be expected to understand what is going on, no matter how much you may push or pull or wave your arms about or mutter magic words. Once you have learned to dance your own part, and do it in frame with a good connection, then you can worry about any particular inflections you may have to perform in order to communicate the step to your partner. Although, if you are properly dancing your part and have a good connection, a considerable percentage of the problem is already solved.
 

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