Captain Jep
Active Member
Quick question : How many people here rarely dance with teachers at a milonga? Especially if there's a good pool of social dancers available in your area?
Dancing with teachers at a milonga
- Thread starter Captain Jep
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Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
You mean their teachers or instructors in general?
There are teachers I never dance with. Others, all the time.
There's not a good pool of social dancers here. It's a rather small community. But I'd always welcome a chance to dance with a good teacher, no matter how many people are present.
Another question might be... how many teachers (here on DF or in your community) dance with students?
I know teachers who never dance with their students, teachers who make a point of always dancing with their students, visiting guest artists who don't dance at the milonga at all (except their demo), those who dance with locals they know from the classes or workshops, etc, etc.
My difficulty is when former students ask me to dance, but I find dancing with them unpleasant and I feel their abilities have decreased rather than increased. I don't want to bad mouth any of their current instructors, but I also don't want to dance with them automatically the way I did when they were taking lessons from me. It's an awkward transition.
Peaches
Well-Known Member
And this is exactly why I will never ask a teacher, but especially not my (now former) teacher(s) to dance. Ever. I know my ability has declined since I stopped taking lessons (and dancing as frequently), but more than that I won't impose. If they, or any other teacher, asks me then I will accept most happily...but I won't impose.
Same rationale as regards asking better dancers to dance with me, in a way.
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
I don't know about your situation, in our neck of the woods somebody being a "teacher" does not mean he is a better dancer than I am (or even a decent tango dancer at all). Some local instructors are in my permanent DND list because they are plain horrible. But personally I do not ask anyone in milongas anyways, I let the leaders do the asking.
I will dance with someone who used to take lessons and stopped for various reasons like financial or schedule constraints. It's the ones who dropped me and now take regularly from someone else that I don't know how to deal with. Especially if the person has gotten more painful (literally) to follow. (Only leaders are the problem) It's too small a community with way too many extra followers for me to easily turn someone down without it being obvious or an issue. I can only claim to be resting so many times. I've been trying to do the "avoid" thing to prevent it thus far.
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
Zoopsia, maybe you should start confronting the issue, at least in the most flagrant cases? Firstly, you are not having fun dancing with bad leaders (or hiding from them instead of enjoying yourself in peace), and secondly, the community does not grow and develop if the dancers do not improve. I have seen milongas and whole communities where walking horrors outnumbered sensible dancers and forced them to leave one by one.
I know it is easier said than done. I also use the avoidance tactic quite often.
Peaches
Well-Known Member
I should have been more clear...
The declining ability aspect bothers me in general, but it's not the main reason. Mostly, I won't ask because I don't want to put them on the spot...for whatever reason. I expect them to be dancing with me when I'm paying them to (in a lesson), but when it's their free time as much as mine it is entirely their decision who they choose to dance with. If they don't want to dance with me on their off time, it is absolutely fine and I'm not going to force the issue or hold it against them. I don't want them to feel that they "have to" dance with me or else offend me (or, when I was taking lessons, risk losing a student)...or feel like I'm expecting special treatment because I pay for some of their time.
Captain Jep
Active Member
Fair enough. It's obviously a minefield. And do you actually therefore tend to hide away at milongas? For example, by sitting near the DJ or in some relatively inaccessible spot?
And a related question : do you think that these ex students generally "expect" you to dance with them? ie they paid you good money and that that entitles them to a "warranty period" (lol) on their dancing?
Captain Jep
Active Member
This is where I'd like to get to. I want to dance with people I like. Whether they're teachers or not.
All too often though I feel that dancing with a teacher is just too much bother. Many of them seem to hide away at milongas so that you have to publically cross the floor and ask them to dance - face to face. Or they're so busy that I havent had a chance to get to know them as people. Either way they're strangers. Contrast that to asking someone I know who is both charming and happy to dance.
I am worried though that I'm rationalising things. Trouble is, teachers usually have great dance partners. And part of me thinks/ knows that I'm never going to be as good as their regular partner.
Something I should have got over - after all these years of dancing. But I fear it's something that still bothers me.
Lilly_of_the_valley
Well-Known Member
What I think it comes down to, at times teachers go to a milonga to milonguear, meaning to dance, socialize and enjoy themselves as anyone else would. Other times they go to a milonga to network, to do business, to attract students etc. And, of course, sometimes they do all of the above at once. In what proportion, depends on a night of the week, a particular milonga, or a specific person.
Instructor or not, to me it is just an another milonga goer. If he is a good dancer and a pleasant person, a welcome addition to the crowd and a potential for a nice tanda. But if he is there to schmooze (or whatever) rather than to dance, nothing wrong with that, either.
mshedgehog
New Member
Hmm. Thinking about it, I really can't say there's a rule. I wouldn't say it's rare.
Peaches
Well-Known Member
No, I don't tend to hide. I'm pretty unnoticeable enough (quiet, shy, have a knack for "disappearing" from a group or crowd) as it is. Anyhow, it's not that I seek to hide or not dance with them. If asked, I will happily dance with my former teacher...or other teachers...or pretty much anyone. I just won't ask them to dance with me. Being a girl, not being the one to ask is a luxury I happily take advantage of.
I don't know about other ex students, but speaking for myself...no, there isn't expectation. Hope, definitely. I don't think it's so much a warranty period sort of thing, but a teacher can be an important person in a student's life...which can lead to warm feelings towards the teacher, and a certain closeness (not talking about inappropriateness, just platonic). Even if those feelings aren't mutual, which is OK, they are there and they are real. It's kind of natural to want to dance with that person again.
bordertangoman
Well-Known Member
There are one or two teachers who i chose not to dance with, because they dance too much with their partner and are lousy social dancers, not naming any names, but in my experience its worth crossing the floor to ask, and risk being declined. I think being a visiting teacher is probably quite boring inbetween the times they are teaching so no harm being sociable..
I had one of my best dances ever with a visting teacher and I got the feeling that she enjoyed it too. she said Muy Bien at the end of the tanda and had a beaming smile. After that the couple did dance a lot more with people so sometimes I think sometimes ice needs breaking, possibly more so in smaller communities.
It is always easier to ask someone you know, but then I think there is a skill to hosting and introducing people to each other especially if they're visitors.
I also danced with Maria Solero without realising she was a teacher. I had that feeling of having got into a Ferrari by accident, instead of my own car.
Captain Jep
Active Member
I had that feeling a few times when I was in BsAs. When I danced with people who I also didnt realise were teachers. It made it sweeter that they only admitted they were when I questioned them directly.
I really need to get over this hangup ...
