[RANT] Photographers

G

Gssh

Forum Master
I just realized that i really am starting to dislike when people take photographs at milongas. I was planning to go to a milonga tonight and my first thought was not "I hope there is a good crowd" or "I hope the DJ does a good job", but "I hope there are not too many people taking photos". Recently there has been weird influx of people whose main objective at milongas is to take photographs (with flash), or film the dancers (sometimes even with really, really annoying spotlights mounted on their semi-professional digital cameras). Now if there is only one person doing this it is semi-bearable, but sometimes there are four or five of them, and the click-click-click of shutters starts to be almost as loud as the music, and at least one of them is crouching somewhere trying to take cool shots of feet, and of course they are completely invisible and make me worried about stepping on them, and others think walking onto the dance floor and tracking people, or standing in the middle and taking panorama shots is ok. And it is obvious that they don't think they are a problem - it is the same logic as used by people with bad floorcraft - they don't realize that the real problem for the flow of the dancefloor is not bumping into people/being bumped, but the ripple effects that they create in their wake as other people maneuver to avoid them.

Gssh
(feeling a bit better now :) )
 
What I really hate is when one of those clowns then posts thumbnails (proofs) on a website and tries to charge for them.

soapbox.gif
 
Gssh said:
... but "I hope there are not too many people taking photos".../quote]

Agree completely. I think it should be the sponsors responsibility to inform these people that flash photography or interfering with dancing is not permitted.
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+1, in the ballroom world, during classes and during social dances.

If you *must* wander the floor taking pictures of individuals, at least have the decency to make eye contact with me and ask permission.

If you *must* take a picture of the whole floor -- take ONE. Quit annoying me with the flash.

To venues that say "dance here and you agree we can put a photo of you on our webpage" -- I still object to the photo being offered for sale. Photos for publicity purposes I can grudgingly (albeit minimally) understand; but attempting to exploit my image for direct financial gain -- having charged me admission in the first place -- really riles me.
 
DL said:
+1, in the ballroom world, during classes and during social dances.

If you *must* wander the floor taking pictures of individuals, at least have the decency to make eye contact with me and ask permission.

If you *must* take a picture of the whole floor -- take ONE. Quit annoying me with the flash.
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+1.

I was at a social awhile back and I was momentarily flashblinded about 5 times. Since then, any time I see a photographer, I try to lead DP away as far as possible.

Meh, maybe holding up your middle finger anytime someone aims a camera at you? :twisted:
 
Rude photographers are a nuisance anywhere they go. The problem is not with someone taking pictures at the dance, it is the behavior of certain people who do. (sorta like the nuevo isn't automatically a problem, its that some dancers are a problem regardless of what they dance, but they happen to dance nuevo) Just think how annoying these photographers would be if they were actually dancing on the floor with you! Rude, oblivious people thinking only of their own needs are obnoxious. Period.

I sometimes take photos during dance events and I always clear it with an organizer. I also specifically clear it with both an organizer and the performers if there is a pro couple doing a demo that I'd like to photograph. I never use a flash. Ever. And I've gotten many really crappy shots because of the combination of dim light and fast movement. Oh well, them's the breaks. Still not gonna use a flash at a dance, no matter how dark it is.

If I crouch to get "shoe shots", I do it in a corner, well out of the way, because I know the leader can't see me down there. I stand well out of the way to get general shots. If the music is quiet (during a demo or tanda) I wait for a louder section. If I'm shooting a demo, I stand well away from other people if I can.

And I also never post (or turn over to an organizer for website use) pictures that are not flattering to the subjects. I usually give a free print to the subject of any really nice shot I manage to take. I've never had a complaint, but I have had surprise and genuine gratitude for the picture.

I have untagged myself in other people's photos though. Why does anyone ever post a photo of someone that is unflattering unless they WANT to annoy them? Baffling.

Photography isn't the problem... it's the people who do it that are sometimes a problem.
 
Zoopsia59 said:
Rude photographers are a nuisance anywhere they go. The problem is not with someone taking pictures at the dance, it is the behavior of certain people who do. (sorta like the nuevo isn't automatically a problem, its that some dancers are a problem regardless of what they dance, but they happen to dance nuevo) Just think how annoying these photographers would be if they were actually dancing on the floor with you! Rude, oblivious people thinking only of their own needs are obnoxious. Period.

I sometimes take photos during dance events and I always clear it with an organizer. I also specifically clear it with both an organizer and the performers if there is a pro couple doing a demo that I'd like to photograph. I never use a flash. Ever. And I've gotten many really crappy shots because of the combination of dim light and fast movement. Oh well, them's the breaks. Still not gonna use a flash at a dance, no matter how dark it is.

If I crouch to get "shoe shots", I do it in a corner, well out of the way, because I know the leader can't see me down there. I stand well out of the way to get general shots. If the music is quiet (during a demo or tanda) I wait for a louder section. If I'm shooting a demo, I stand well away from other people if I can.

And I also never post (or turn over to an organizer for website use) pictures that are not flattering to the subjects. I usually give a free print to the subject of any really nice shot I manage to take. I've never had a complaint, but I have had surprise and genuine gratitude for the picture.

I have untagged myself in other people's photos though. Why does anyone ever post a photo of someone that is unflattering unless they WANT to annoy them? Baffling.

Photography isn't the problem... it's the people who do it that are sometimes a problem.
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For the win.

Am I the only one who just doesn't care about people taking photos? I haven't encountered anyone taking pictures of a milonga that has been disruptive.
 
Flashes are annoying. Otherwise I don't care, as long as photographers do not go onto the floor. It would be also nice if whoever took my pictures in milongas, shared them with me. I would like to have some for memories.
 
Personally I much prefer seeing video. But that's another topic ... ;)

No, rarely bothered by photographers. The only times I have been aware of it have been the open air events. Like the one at Regents Park in London. But then IMO you have to accept it when dancing out in the open - it just comes with the territory.

I think it's crazy taking photos at a milonga - as has been said, the combination of low light and movement makes it hardly worth the effort. Much better to take photos at a tea dance , where there is lots of light and people are more relaxed.
 
They way it was and the way it is today in BsAs

The milongas of Buenos Aires were different years ago before the steady flood of tourists with digital cameras. Ten years ago it was rare to see a camera at a milonga. For this reason, there are few photos and recordings of the milongueros. It just wasn't done. The milonga was a place to dance. Tango was the priority.

There are still organizers who won't permit filming in their milonga. It is always best to ask first. Many believe that dancers would appreciate being filmed for posterity, but when you know that many are escaping from their spouses to dance, it sheds a different light on the subject. They don't want to be discovered on the internet! It's more likely today than ever with all the documentary films being made about tango in BsAs. This goes on all the time.

When milongueros are dancing, they are oblivious to anyone filming them because they are in the music. I ask permission first before filming anyone as a matter of courtesy.

Unfortunately, foreigners conduct themselves in Buenos Aires as they do at home. They think nothing of taking photos and videos in the milongas without the permission of the dancers. The result is thousands of exhibition videos on YouTube.
 
dchester said:
What I really hate is when one of those clowns then posts thumbnails (proofs) on a website and tries to charge for them.
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Actually, they have no right to sell an image of someone who hasn't given permission. The subject of a photo must either share profit from the image or waive rights by giving them (or selling them) to the photographer. It's called a Model Release, and unless the photo was taken on public property, anyone identifiable in a picture must give permission for the photographer to profit from the image.

Attempting to sell the image to the subject is legally different, but I agree it's annoying. (and if there are other identifiable people in the picture besides the person paying for the photo, the model release rule still applies)

Most Tango events are held on private property. There is a grey zone I'm not clear on between "Public property" (such as a sidewalk) and "Open to the public" (like a restaurant). Many places that are open to the public are still actually private property. I always err on the side of getting permission, even on public land.

Note however, that the way paparazzi get around this is that the photographer must be on public property, not necessarily the subject (if the subject can be seen from public property) Also, there are exceptions that I don't quite know the law of for "Public Figures" who have a reasonable expectation of being photographed anywhere they go. I doubt even the most famous tango performer/dancer would be considered a public figure.
 
dchester said:
What I really hate is when one of those clowns then posts thumbnails (proofs) on a website and tries to charge for them..
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dchester, but sometimes really transcendent moments are captured

For instance take a look at the TangoMagia (Amsterdam) album of my fb friend Mathias http://matutephotography.com :
I like this one of Gaston and Moira http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hpho..._481810796694_532861694_6413663_4537486_n.jpg

And I also can identify with the foto he took of me http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos..._389376141694_532861694_4520541_1838676_n.jpg The fotos taken at that evening are somekind magical http://www.facebook.com/album.php?fbid=389374341694&id=532861694&aid=175645
 
The photographers and video cameras rarely bother me. I just don't like it at all when someone tries to charge for the pictures. If you took a picture of me (without my permission), just give me a copy (or post it on-line for free). Don't try to sell me a copy of it.
 
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