Lifted from a post by Paul Shrivastava, who has a tango radio program eminating from Bucknell University.
Chicho Frumboli interview in El Tangauta (Dec 2009)
- Thread starter jantango
- Start date
I am saying that, if he is talking about his own cohorts, it doesn't square with how much fun certain movements can be.
Dave Bailey
Active Member
But that quote isn't talking about style of dancing, it's talking about codigos...
Sorry, but it's hard to avoid the impression that he's, basically, talking rubbish.
Mario7
Member
Gee, strange how English can become Greek all of a sudden.
He mentioned the codigos because he was saying how his own rebellion had changed...that he now sees their need. That he is now a Milonguero and he laughs...(I can't believe that I'm having to explain this)...then he goes on to talk about the generation of dance that he, himself, pied pipered in..he and the other couple of guys...Hmm maybe, it is best that you don't go and read the whole interview.
Dave Bailey
Active Member
Well I'm not going to comment on second-hand interpretations.Gee, strange how English can become Greek all of a sudden.
He mentioned the codigos because he was saying how his own rebellion had changed...that he now sees their need. That he is now a Milonguero and he laughs...(I can't believe that I'm having to explain this)...then he goes on to talk about the generation of dance that he, himself, pied pipered in..he and the other couple of guys...Hmm maybe, it is best that you don't go and read the whole interview.
Basically, this whole thread seems kind of pointless.
opendoor
Forum Master
Something New ?
We could carry on the latter: http://www.dance-forums.com/showthread.php?t=34861
I have not read the ElTangauta article bc I dont want to sign up for another server.... So, is something fundamentally different said compared to the march interview we talked about here, at all?
Still, ..
But this counts for Chicho, too. Grant it.
wr OD
We could carry on the latter: http://www.dance-forums.com/showthread.php?t=34861
I have not read the ElTangauta article bc I dont want to sign up for another server.... So, is something fundamentally different said compared to the march interview we talked about here, at all?
Still, ..
A rare moment, Im with Jan !
But this counts for Chicho, too. Grant it.
wr OD
Because of the music they are dancing to. If Chicho is accomplished in milonguero style, it is quite odd (IMO) to not use that set of skills why dancing to Di Sarli.
jantango
Well-Known Member
Chicho says he learned the essence of tango by watching the milongueros in the milongas when he became interested in tango. He doesn't say he learned the "milonguero style" which doesn't exist although it is marketed as such. Chicho may have observed the milongueros long enough to become interested in tango and then he and the others in the new tango movement went on to create something entirely different for other purposes.
The new tango movement has nothing to do with social dancing. Neither Chicho Frumboli, Fabian Salas nor Gustavo Naveira could show up today at a milonga in BsAs, invite an unknown partner with the cabeceo to dance, and then follow the ronda around the floor dancing musically to whatever orquesta was played. That is what the milongueros do every night of the week.
Light Sleeper
New Member
Be careful, you're edging towards libellousness there. I did see Chicho doing just that actually... will try and find the clip.....
Light Sleeper
New Member
Here we go....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYyLQfesAKM
...okay, edit to add - it's Mariana Montes not a stranger.... but the point remains IMO
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYyLQfesAKM
...okay, edit to add - it's Mariana Montes not a stranger.... but the point remains IMO
I hope you won't be offended, if I take Susana Miller's opinion over yours. She is the one who is credited with creating the term Milonguero style. A lot of people get confused about that term, as a few people think that she was saying all milongueros danced that way. That's not what the term means, though. Most people understand what is meant by a style. Just because someone doesn't understand it, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
This is similar to how some people claim that Villa Urquiza style doesn't exist. IMO, they are both different subsets of what some people call salon.
The only way you would know this, is if you (or others) had followed them around to see them try it and fail. I doubt that you have.
bastet
Active Member
Video clips don't seem to be the best way to make a decision.
There's been a few clips I've seen recently where odd things begin to happen when people know they are being video taped.
In this video, Chicho seems to be going against line of dance, relative to the camera and the 2 couples he was next to in the video I was using as a reference to watch. He was dancing small, but he also may have noticed he was being videoed, and as I've seen in several clips- videoing can make strange things happen, so it's probably not the best representative of things, I guess. Only if you could talk to people who dance near him at milognas could you really get an idea of how he dances and if it's with thr ronda or not.
That being said, I've also seen clips on Jan's channel where the people she was videoing exited lanes, crossed the middle of the floor and cut in to come round again because they knew the camera was on them...so no help there either if we're trying to talk about milongueros who exemplify respect of the floor and codigos (at least the floor codigos I learned, can't speak for anyone else).
Like I said, being videoed may make people do things that aren't the best representative of what someone's trying to say. Whether they are right or wrong we just can't tell from a video.
Captain Jep
Active Member
Absolutely.
At the start of the vid its a bit confusing. Is he in the outer lane or the inner? Then as it goes on it looks as if he's on the inner. However, I also think there's a cut in the filming, so it's hard to get a sense of the continuity of his dancing.
Anyway, Ive seen much worse crowding on the floor at Canning, so Im not sure I would regard this as a definitive test
At the start of the vid its a bit confusing. Is he in the outer lane or the inner? Then as it goes on it looks as if he's on the inner. However, I also think there's a cut in the filming, so it's hard to get a sense of the continuity of his dancing.
Anyway, Ive seen much worse crowding on the floor at Canning, so Im not sure I would regard this as a definitive test
Light Sleeper
New Member
Bastet and Cap'n J - excellent points, all
However, Dchester wins
:cheers:
However, Dchester wins
Posted by jantango
The new tango movement has nothing to do with social dancing. Neither Chicho Frumboli, Fabian Salas nor Gustavo Naveira could show up today at a milonga in BsAs, invite an unknown partner with the cabeceo to dance, and then follow the ronda around the floor dancing musically to whatever orquesta was played. That is what the milongueros do every night of the week.
:cheers:
jantango
Well-Known Member
The Faguchi* trio will never show up at a milonga in BsAs, like many others who are busy teaching choreography or exhibition tango. They are used to having the floor to themselves and don't know how to dance among others. I have seen Gustavo in a milonga on only two occasions in the past 13 years. The only time I saw Chicho dance was an exhibition in Salon Canning. The way they dance an exhibition is the way they dance. None of the social rules apply for them when they dance, i.e., keeping feet on the floor, etc.
The tango I know in the milongas is another world from the new movement. The Faguchi women are puppets responding to puppet masters' hands.
*Faguchi is a term that was coined years ago by someone on Tango-L for the new movement trio: Fabian Gustavo Chicho.
The tango I know in the milongas is another world from the new movement. The Faguchi women are puppets responding to puppet masters' hands.
*Faguchi is a term that was coined years ago by someone on Tango-L for the new movement trio: Fabian Gustavo Chicho.