who's really qualified to teach

suburbaknght said:
don't evaluate the teacher's dancing. Instead, watch their students.
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Absolutely. The tree is known by its fruit.
So what about beginners who don't know what to look for?
I was one such beginner. I regard my first year in tango as wasted - God knows what I was taught - but I kept my eyes open, I went to different milongas and slowly, slowly I formed my opinion of what is good, bad or ugly.
 
tangotime said:
Hows about having both !
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Yeah well in an ideal world :p

I do agree there is a skill to teaching and teaching dance specifically. So in an ideal world all full time dance teachers should be working towards a quali. However that can be a general quali - it doesnt have to be specific to their own dance. More along the lines of teaching movement and controlling groups etc etc. They can do this while they work.

However .... it shouldnt be a case of getting the quali before they can be employed in a studio. Trouble is, the moment you propose a qualification, that's just what happens.

Tango teachers are a rare resource. If someone is mad enough (or brave enough) to be one, we want them out in the field, teaching us!
 
hbboogie1 said:
Make a black list and pass it out at milongas warning people about certain teachers we don’t like?
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Here would be a convenient place for a list of bad teachers but for some reason as soon as you say something bad about a teacher, a mod comes.

At worst a bad teacher can make you lose two years in your learning. One year of classes with him and year to get rid of the bad habits. Once you wander around and you know a lot of teachers worldwide, you choose the ones you prefer and that's it. What are two years lost when seven are needed to develop a leader? It will be nine years instead of seven, that's all.
 
jantango said:
Those who take a private with a milonguero go to the milonga with him. Women dance with him at a milonga, and they are invited by other men simply because of dancing with a milonguero. That's why women come to BsAs--to dance in the milongas.
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OK, that's good advice for the women. Now what should a guy do?
 
I think the some criteria should apply to students too

For instance:
Will you remember what was taught in last week's class.
Have you practiced anything?
Will you be making the same mistakes in three months?
 
Captain Jep said:
However that can be a general quali - it doesnt have to be specific to their own dance. More along the lines of teaching movement and controlling groups etc etc. They can do this while they work.

However .... it shouldnt be a case of getting the quali before they can be employed in a studio. Trouble is, the moment you propose a qualification, that's just what happens.
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Thats the value ( or it used to be ) of developing ones skills in an English b/room school of dance. The requirements for teaching were quite rigorous... before an assoc. exam..1 yr working in an approved school under the guidance of a fully qualif. ( members minim. ) teacher.

An additional 3 yrs before the Members exam .5 more for Fellows.....
today.. its instant everything .
 
suburbaknght said:
A teacher's history as a dancer is no indication of his or her ability as a teacher.

Now a word on certification. I should state that I unequivocally support a law requiring all would-be dance teachers to have teaching certification from a nationally recognized dance organization .
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Para 1... agreed.. and yet, its the " yardstick " that all go by..

Para 2.. Certif/ Qualis, are still no guarantee.. teaching is a people business. the attendant skills required to achieve results are of course necessary.. but.. it comes down ultimately to HOW one handles people..and how you impart the information .

There is the case of a world class coach who had a reputation for being "handy ".. I personally knew several comp. people who never went back after one lesson ( many did ) .

The quali. thing has been a bone of contention in Salsa and T/A for ever, with the same, sometimes convoluted logic, that "standardisation " would be the death knell, when there is already a basic format in place that seems fairly universal in both genres .
 
who is really qualified to teach tango? Milongueros.

I know people who take lots of group classes in Buenos Aires. They have only a short stay and take from different teachers in order to learn more, or so they believe. The problem is they never have time to practice what was presented in the class. As soon as they walk out the door, they forget what was taught.

I had piano lessons from the age of 8. My private lesson was every Monday at 4:00. Then I had to practice every day for a week to prepare for the next lesson. If I didn't play the lesson well, I had the same lesson to practice for another week.

A milonguero is a self-taught dancer who has danced in the milongas since he was a teenager. There are only a handful of milongueros who teach. They have more than fifty years experience in the milongas. They had to learn to dance in tight spaces and dance well. A milonguero can dance well with any woman because he has danced with thousands in the milongas.
 
jantango said:
A milonguero is a self-taught dancer who has danced in the milongas since he was a teenager. There are only a handful of milongueros who teach. They have more than fifty years experience in the milongas.
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Teaching is much more than " dancing " for any specific amount of time... I know thousands of " dancers " with multiple yrs on the floor.. yet.. they cannot break down "movement" .

There are hundreds of " monkey see monkey do " teachers (?) in Salsa ( and many in B/R ).. the product result is invairably flawed ..
 
Milongueros who teach

tangotime said:
Teaching is much more than " dancing " for any specific amount of time... I know thousands of " dancers " with multiple yrs on the floor.. yet.. they cannot break down "movement" .
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I agree. In order to teach well, one has to have a good eye and know how to make adjustments where needed. Many dancers have learned how to dance from teachers who never explained how or why something is done a certain way. They are limited in their teaching by what they were taught. There are many copycat teachers who don't know how to teach beyond the steps they learned in classes.

Then there are the milongueros who taught themselves how to dance. They had to learn what worked for them and figure things out. They wanted to dance well. They had to practice before they went to dance as teenagers. They didn't want to look bad dancing in public. It was very important to dance well.

I taught social dancing in Chicago. I tried to encourage several milongueros to teach tango, but most of them only want to dance. Tango isn't about money for them. The few with whom I have taught do an excellent job of teaching or I wouldn't have bothered assisting them. I see what they are able to accomplish in two hours. They want their students to improve and enjoy tango. It's not about the money for them as it is with many teachers.

There are only a few milongueros who teach in Buenos Aires. All of them learned to dance from the age of 14 or so.

Pedro Sanchez (73) - tango, vals and milonga con traspie
Beto Ayala 68 - tango and vals
Ernesto "El Flaco Dany" Garcia (73) - milonga con traspie
Roberto Angel Pujol (71) - tango and vals
Roberto "Pocho" Carreras - 78 - tango and milonga con traspie
Eduardo Masci 68 - tango and vals
Jorge Uzunian 78 - tango, vals and milonga
Ruben Harymbat - 72 - tango, vals, and milonga con traspie

My YouTube channel includes videos of them.
 
tangotime said:
Para 2.. Certif/ Qualis, are still no guarantee.. teaching is a people business. the attendant skills required to achieve results are of course necessary.. but.. it comes down ultimately to HOW one handles people..and how you impart the information .

There is the case of a world class coach who had a reputation for being "handy ".. I personally knew several comp. people who never went back after one lesson ( many did ) .

The quali. thing has been a bone of contention in Salsa and T/A for ever, with the same, sometimes convoluted logic, that "standardisation " would be the death knell, when there is already a basic format in place that seems fairly universal in both genres .
Click to expand...

You're partly correct: they're no guarantee but they do make it far more likely someone is an at least acceptable teacher. Certification is an obstacle to teaching, one that people who are serious about their craft will be able to overcome, and one that will keep out the dabblers or the six-class would-be-teachers referenced in earlier posts.

The downside of universal certification is that it immediately retards the evolution of the dance, but it does not halt such evolution. The creation of grammar books and dictionaries has not stopped language from evolving, though it does occur at a slower rate than it used to. What many opponents of syllabi forget is that syllabi are constantly updated to reflect how the dance is being executed on social floors, performances, and competitions. Compare this paso doble from the 1960's to this one of Max and Yulia from last year.

The way to get the best of both worlds is, as I said, allow more than one group to certify and use more than one syllabus.
 
buyer beware... pay attention and choose instructors that resonate with your own objectives. IMO, any instructor who has students who show up and say "please teach me what you know" should have the freedom to teach what they know.

additional certs would be helpful, as in the ballroom world, but why *restrict* teaching to those that have them? as others have said... there is no guarantee
 
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