A hurt ego only holds yourself down.

Naddrin Kentlar

Active Member
story from a small milonga/practica I attend lately, from the 'other' dancing school.

A week ago went there knowing that I want to work mainly on my dissociated walk, my grounding, balance, and to try to control and transform the inertia in my body and my partner's body into a pleasant energy that I tried to put on music. I was minding my own thing, followers seemed to enjoy their time spent with me. (I assume that because I always cabeceo from a safe distance, therefore if they're in my arms I'm sure they really do want to be there, even if the reason they do is because there's nothing much else to do :) )

Then a rare face arrived. Last month we danced and most of the tanda she talked to me telling me how, my dance was repetitive and non imaginative, and how much better I would be if I would be joining the 'other' dance school, and that the so what I'm learning, is wrong. (I did know my dance is repetitive, but I did focus on other issues at that moment). Nevertheless I've seen her as pushy, bitchy, and arrogant and I personally felt very hurt.

Now, I cabeceo her again, she accepts, and I feel her starting to assess me. Oh boy, time to brace myself. The moment I felt in the embrace that she was starting to understand a pattern (didn't let her reach the next level - bored) I inserted chaos in my dance to keep her from getting bored. Change in pace, energy, attitude, dynamics and acceleration of the steps.

About 2 minutes later, I do feel a tension in her embrace, she stops me and asks me with a smug arrogant attitude:
- 'why do you use your hands to make me do pivots ?'
In my mind the reflex was like "What the fudge ???, not again". But I did realize that I was giving the pivots wrong. As the other followers were not as good, I instinctively started to use the hands to have more control over the followers movements in relation to music.
I say nothing, I let her show me how to give her the marks. (pretty much the same as I learned at my school)
I adjusted quickly and I realized that she did have some insane flexibility (at 20+ years, that's easier :P ). I was never before with a follower able to do about 140-150 degrees dissociation. And it felt easy and clean, without using me for support at any time.

We both seemed to enjoy the rest of our dance. I know I did. I presume she did because 1) I felt it in her embrace 2) she remained silent for the rest of the tanda.

And the point is.
If I chose to only get hurt and avoid her, would only hinder my own progress. It's hard and painful to accept, and analyze criticism from a source you particularly don't like. But it's more productive than from a follower that only compliments you, because she'll want to dance with you again, and hopes that by being careful with your feelings she increases the chances.
 
As much as I try, and with many years of experience in dancing, I must say that I still can not put myself in the position to say that I can read into someone else's feelings too well just through the dancing.

I know that if another person makes me feel uncomfortable, that I may not continue to dance with that person, as there are other people that I might choose before them. And it goes both ways. I try to be thoughtful that I might make the other person feel uncomfortable and that is the part that I have some control over. I can project a good feeling and hope the other person will reciprocate. But if I'm left feeling uncomfortable, I may not dance with that person in the future.

Moreover, if I get too caught up in trying to perceive what the other person is feeling, I find that interrupts my own ability to project my own good feeling into the dance. Perhaps as I get to know someone quite well, maybe we have been friends for a few months and have talked a lot, it gets easier to talk about the feelings, but definitely not with someone I don't know very well. I think it's not a good way to go.

I may have diverged a little from your original thought, so also sharing some of my thoughts.
 
It is important to differentiate bullshit from constructive criticism. ;)
Some schools focus too much on technique and other on figures at the beginning.

Some would just walk away.
 
Last month we danced and most of the tanda she talked to me telling me how, my dance was repetitive and non imaginative, and how much better I would be if I would be joining the 'other' dance school, and that the so what I'm learning, is wrong.
[...]
I do feel a tension in her embrace, she stops me and asks me with a smug arrogant attitude:
I have never experienced such a behaviour during a tanda, suppose that it's more about personal power play and submission than tango dancing. :oops:

Nevertheless can every follower tell me if something is uncomfortable and I'll try to change that w/o any diskussion.
 
140-150 degrees dissociation.
I can do barely 90. With this said, as fluor for the teeth, there comes a point where more does not help, and even harms. I once had a follower who IRL was a belly dancer, had almost illimited dissociation and as a result I could barely lead her any pivot at all, she would just dissociate instead of pivoting.


If I chose to only get hurt and avoid her, would only hinder my own progress.
Yes and no. First you've now become someone whose lead has been chosen by somebody else. Second this way of leading is not the ultimate answer. I know a follower, AT teacher, argentine, younger than your smug arrogant lady and with more dissociation than her, who would spit at your new way of leading.
 
Then a rare face arrived. Last month we danced and most of the tanda she talked to me telling me how, my dance was repetitive and non imaginative, and how much better I would be if I would be joining the 'other' dance school, and that the so what I'm learning, is wrong. (I did know my dance is repetitive, but I did focus on other issues at that moment).
....

About 2 minutes later, I do feel a tension in her embrace, she stops me and asks me with a smug arrogant attitude:
- 'why do you use your hands to make me do pivots ?'

Was this a practica or a milonga? If it's a practica, it's OK to discuss things, but in a NICE way. There's no need to humiliate your partner. OTOH, don't lead with your hands. I've met people like this; in most cases I never dance with them again. Even if you're learning something, it may not be worth the psychological effort and frustration. Just move on until you find someone you can work with. But that's your decision.
 
It is more often that men are the socially awkward nerds than women, but there are actually ladies out there who aren't smooth. She very well might be exactly as you feel... but OTOH she might actually think she is being nice and helpful. She might think you have great potential.

I have found asking the experienced ladies to critique my dance has been very eye opening and educational, even if it can be hard to hear at times. I have also found these ladies are very pleased about being asked to help.

Once the floodgates are open sometimes I get too much advice to process! For those ladies I'll say something like "Can you suggest two things I work on today?"
... she talked to me telling me how, my dance was repetitive and non imaginative, and how much better I would be if I would be joining the 'other' dance school, and that the so what I'm learning, is wrong. (I did know my dance is repetitive, but I did focus on other issues at that moment). Nevertheless I've seen her as pushy, bitchy, and arrogant and I personally felt very hurt.

Now, I cabeceo her again, she accepts, and I feel her starting to assess me. Oh boy, time to brace myself. The moment I felt in the embrace that she was starting to understand a pattern (didn't let her reach the next level - bored) I inserted chaos in my dance to keep her from getting bored. Change in pace, energy, attitude, dynamics and acceleration of the steps.

About 2 minutes later, I do feel a tension in her embrace, she stops me and asks me with a smug arrogant attitude:
- 'why do you use your hands to make me do pivots ?'
In my mind the reflex was like "What the fudge ???, not again". But I did realize that I was giving the pivots wrong. As the other followers were not as good, I instinctively started to use the hands to have more control over the followers movements in relation to music.
I say nothing, I let her show me how to give her the marks. (pretty much the same as I learned at my school)
I adjusted quickly and I realized that she did have some insane flexibility (at 20+ years, that's easier :p ). I was never before with a follower able to do about 140-150 degrees dissociation. And it felt easy and clean, without using me for support at any time.

We both seemed to enjoy the rest of our dance. I know I did. I presume she did because 1) I felt it in her embrace 2) she remained silent for the rest of the tanda.

And the point is.
If I chose to only get hurt and avoid her, would only hinder my own progress. It's hard and painful to accept, and analyze criticism from a source you particularly don't like. But it's more productive than from a follower that only compliments you, because she'll want to dance with you again, and hopes that by being careful with your feelings she increases the chances.
 
It is more often that men are the socially awkward nerds than women, but there are actually ladies out there who aren't smooth. She very well might be exactly as you feel... but OTOH she might actually think she is being nice and helpful. She might think you have great potential.
"

well, honestly, now thinking more about it you might be right.

More often then not, I'm very far from 'smooth'. I usually rely on my wife to give me 'cues' on how it's appropriate to behave in the social settings we're in. And if I ever have the slightest doubt about what I am supposed to answer to in casual talk, I just prefer to shut up.

Most likely I've been very triggered when someone expressed their negative opinion of my instructors, persons I've grown to like a lot. The girl most likely, as you said, she tried to be very nice, and expressed her honest views.

Nevertheless. The question is: Is there a way to make criticism hurt less ? :)
 
A hurt ego only holds yourself down.
BTW, a hurt ego is not worse than a fondled ego, the problem is the ego itself.
After a few years do I not experience more frequent "dream tandas" than after a few weeks in tango. I dance with much better partners now, for sure, but are no better humans, why should they. And on the opposite side do I not dance with others, former partners I've "left behind" me.

Striving to dance with better partners, even striving to get a better dancer, implies no real value. So do I try to learn slow in these days, just enough not to bore myself or my SO when we dance together...
 
Yes, get criticized more often, and realizing few people actually want to hurt you, but are trying to help in their own way.

Lady says "no" when you start = hurt feelings. Now it's "who else is available?" Public speaking is scary, but by the 100th time you might actually be looking forward to doing it. The Tango Distance was paralyzed by fear of hugs, now he does some close embrace.
... The question is: Is there a way to make criticism hurt less ? :)
 
Nevertheless. The question is: Is there a way to make criticism hurt less ? :)

A few years ago one leader told me that he had been watching my leading and that was awkward to see. He clearly stated some issues. He also told me that my following was nice!

I was quite upset for hours but later on I understood his motive - His favorite follower did prefer me and he wanted to get rid of some competition!

1.this part was actually positive feedback hidden under an attack.

2. Then I asked myself if the issues were correct? They were and I had been thinking of working on them.

3. I decided not to comfort myself but keep the rest of the pain as fuel or an engine to work on the issues until they were corrected. I think I was going on for weeks on that energy!

To accept facts as they are, has facilitated many situations for me. To think pain as fuel which I can use to reach my goals has also been helpful.
 
Yes, get criticized more often, and realizing few people actually want to hurt you, but are trying to help in their own way.
It is helpful to try at least to be equally as happy about flatteries as upset about criticism.
If you do not rely on positive feedback, you can also be stable in case of negative feedback.

Lady says "no" when you start = hurt feelings.
Now it's "who else is available?"
Yes, one should at least relax as soon as other partners enjoy the dancing.
 

Dance Ads

Advertise on Dance Forums Reach dancers, teachers, studios, event organizers, and dance-friendly brands. View ad options
Back
Top