A practical practice routine

[Mario7]

Life is good..all of a sudden dancers are coming from all over to San Miguel to dance A.T. on Tues. nights... I like to think that I had something to do with it as I have been publishing announcements of everything on the web. Anyway, I now have more than 2 and possibly 4 NEW practice partners! Eureaka!:friend: Most are beginners but have other dance experience and pretty good balance and musical feel...so I'm lucky.
I'm thinking of specifying exactly what and how we will be practicing and I've written this description this morning with the intent of sending it to them for their feedback... I'd like to get the forums feedback and any changes that you would make....from spelling to actual things that you would change in terms of what to work on...and any other critique you would offer... all is welcome and all is appreciated. the post below will contain the description in discussion;

 

[Mario7]

Hi, please take a look at this and tell me what you think? thanks

"As I'm now having the opportunity to practice with more than one practice partner, I'm going into some detail here about what I have developed as a typical practice routine.
First, the dance Argentine Tango originated in the social dances of Buenos Aires and the social dance is still how they dance it there (as distinguished from stage performance Tango). The fundamentals of Argentine Tango are all contained in the social dance.
The social dance is simply two people sharing their enjoyment of the music and dancing to it with a warm connection, while keeping in their line of dance as they make a rotation of the dance floor.
The stage perfomance tango is not so much interested in connection as it is in looking good, exciting, glamorous..and it's fun, too!
OK, I focus on the social dance which is basicaly walking and turning in a closed embrace as is danced in BsAs.
Note: BsAs has approx. 120 Milongas a week. All but 3 or 4 of these are danced in the traditional closed embrace social dance style.
Also, there are well-known classes in BsAs that begin with 45 mins of just walking..each person walking alone..that is how
important walking is to the dance. In my opinion, walking backwards correctly and circling the man using the steps of the grapevine are important skills for the woman.
OK, each practice session consists of dancing to 20 different songs. Each dance (song) will try to highlight one particular facet (skill)
of the dance. The idea is that; the dance itself is the best context for gaining fluency in the dance. Exercises (repetition) are important too,
and so each dance has a focus on some repeated movement. Note: If you wish to change the progression and practice something for a longer period of time, just mention it and we will do it. Also, you can come to the practice with a different agenda and we will follow your agenda that day.
The idea of the practice progression is that it contains each configuration that a man and woman are likely to experience in a night's social dancing. So that, no matter where you find yourself at any point in the dance, you will have been there before and it will seem familiar to you and you can dance it.
The different movements emphasized are:
1. Parallel walking outside the woman's right side. (2 songs)
2.............................on the inside (2 songs)
3..............................outside the woman's left side. (1 song)
4.Crossed footed walking outside the woman's right(1 song)
5. ............................on the inside (2 songs)
6........................................outside the woman's left (2 songs)
7. Giros, both clockwise and counterclockwise (3 songs)
8. Walks to the cross and variations afterwards (2 songs)
9. Walking onto the woman's left side (2 songs)
10. Freely improvised including some of the above (3 songs)
tot. 20 songs
This schedule is gruelling (1hr.15mins) constant dancing and will take weeks to work up to being able to do the whole progression.
The beneficial results should become obvious after each 2 sessions of a completed practice."

....................................................

www.tangoandchaos.org
www.youtube.com/watch?v=if8NaP5bKGo

 

[Zoopsia59]

I question the value for either of you in regimenting each song in this way. They will not learn to follow, and you will not improve your skills at improvising. You will also not need to "lead" the moves because the followers are on automatic pilot.

My suggestion would be to vary your sessions considerably based on the skill and experience level of the partner you are working with that session. For instance a very new dancer will not be ready to work on giros and ochos. An advanced beginner or intermediate dancer will be.

I think it would benefit you both more to pick at least 3 moves from the repertoire that you can both handle, and dance for a shorter period of time mixing those elements up equally on every dance. The less experienced your partner, the shorter the time would be. Towards the end, you can add new elements.

Remember, your ultimate goal as social BA style social dancers is about leading, following, navigating, and doing all that while improvising. That means getting in and out of movements seamlessly. I don't think the workout you have described will help with ANY of that very much. For example, you will improve at parallel vs cross walking outside partner much better if you switch back and forth within a dance rather than do one then the other for several songs as you describe. You will understand the torso involvement better if you go from one side to the other rather than stay on one side for a dance then do the other side. Get my drift?

In addition to mixing it up and making the sessions a little less regimented and grueling, I also suggest getting two followers (or another leader) together with you. Then you can have the 3rd person move around in a way that required you to navigate other people. If you know another leader, you could even have 2 couples dancing the whole time and switch up. If you'd rather not involve another leader, then get two followers. Ideally one would be a more advanced follower to help a beginner follower, but if scheduling is a problem, do what you can.

I think this would all help you more in the long run than working with only one person in a session doing a very regimented routine such as you described.

I'd also lose some of the intro to your email... they'll either want to work in this style or they won't. You can talk about the history and practice of tango in BA while you take a break during your routine. After one session, it should be clear that you are not going to be working on ganchos and flying boleos)

You need to make this FUN. At the moment it sounds a little too much like WORK and rather serious.

 

[Lilly_of_the_valley]

OK, honestly?
If my prospective practice partner handed me out that list, I would believe that he is, at very least, a terrible nudnik, and I better stay away from him.

 

[Mario7]

OK, honestly?
If my prospective practice partner handed me out that list, I would believe that he is, at very least, a terrible nudnik, and I better stay away from him.

Well, that's what I am, should I try and hide it? no thanks:cheers:

 

[Mario7]

I question the value for either of you in regimenting each song in this way. They will not learn to follow, and you will not improve your skills at improvising. You will also not need to "lead" the moves because the followers are on automatic pilot.
My suggestion would be to vary your sessions considerably based on the skill and experience level of the partner you are working with that sessionRemember, your ultimate goal as social BA style social dancers is about leading, following, navigating, and doing all that while improvising. That means getting in and out of movements seamlessly. I don't think the workout you have described will help with ANY of that very much. .

Thanks for the detailed input Zoops... Let me see if I can make some sense here... these woman are all beginners....never have had a lead walk outside of them... I'm not capable of always doing it right..so, exercises are necessary...I'm putting them into a dance context as much as possible... ie: turns, pauses, etc. These woman are also mature and want demanding exercise..they are staying thin and I pick up that concern from their conversations... Again, the walking warmup is a big part of some reputable classes in BsAs, I'm trying to make it even more effective by going directly to the task...walking together. These woman have never walked to the cruzada...we have to work on it from a basic level and here again the exercise becomes the dance.... If/when we become competent in any task, it will be taken off the list and an improvised dance will be added to it. Little by little, until we are working mostly the way you described above...but we have to crawl before we can walk..capice? Do you soften your stand a bit, now? I hope

 

[AndaBien]

I don't see the need for this. What purpose does it satisfy? It's important that your practices sessions to be enjoyable, so you'll keep doing them. And, why not have fun? I suggest you just work on whatever seems appropriate or necessary at the time.

 

[Zoopsia59]

but we have to crawl before we can walk..capice? Do you soften your stand a bit, now? I hope

I see your dilemma. However I would still change things a little.

First of all, her walk to the cross is the same whether you are in cross or parallel feet outside to her right. (what happens immediately AFTER the cross might change) So having you mix this up shouldn't affect her too much unless YOU are doing it wrong.

In order to get her walking correctly, I would work the moves without music so you can break down for her what's going on, then do it to a song. Then you discuss it and try again. This will help you get the full body mechanics into YOUR head before you dance as well.

I still think having another person there would help. For instance, she needs to be reaching back properly without drifting in or out of her proper line, but you will not be able to tell easily whether she is doing so. The other person can get directly behind her and check that.

I thought you had at least one practice partner who was a little more experienced? I have to question the value to you in practicing with someone that you have to teach from scratch. Especially since you have no experience as a follower. The variety of things that can be going wrong on her end include an endless amount that you most likely would never even think of. They are fundamental things she needs to get right no matter what you are doing, and without meaning to be insulting, I don't think you are going to be able to feel them, see them, or possibly even notice them.

Remember my post awhile back on how different levels of skaters analyze why someone fell on a jump? The casual observer says "He fell". The slightly more knowledgeable observer says "He was leaning in the air". THen you go through about 5 more levels until you get to the coach who can say that the problem started on the steps prior to the entry edge when the shoulder was tipped or the hip was slightly up, blah, blah like "the house that jack built" creating a domino series of "causes" that were all actually "results".

I recently taught a total beginner follower who is married to one of my male students. He has been dancing awhile and he wants her to be able to go out with him. I explained to her some of the body mechanics she needed to use, forward pressure, and about passing through neutral in her walking, etc and had her walk without me. Then in the course of a couple of songs in less than 10 minutes led her in straight forward walking, outside partner both parallel and crossed and led her to the cross in each of these ways. She had no trouble with it even when I mixed up my steps.

What's important for her is the fundamental technique she needs to be employing. After that, if you are doing your part well, she'll do hers even if you change from parallel to cross, etc.

BTW - even mature women want to have some fun. Speaking as one, ya know!

 

[opendoor]

Tango does not take place on the dance floor only.

Learning tango is a stage of life. It happens under, above, and beyond the dance floor.

There is a syllabus of steps, but there is a syllabus of communication, too.

To get along with tango means to get integrated into a tango community. Means to learn how to get along with your dps in agreement.

Mario, 341 times I came with my to-do & to-learn & to-practice list, and 337 times the ladies said: lets do this or that today instead, lets go to cinema, lets just chill, and so on...

But these remaining 337 times belong to tango as well !

 

[newbie]

1. Parallel walking outside the woman's right side. (2 songs)
2.............................on the inside (2 songs)
3..............................outside the woman's left side. (1 song)
4.Crossed footed walking outside the woman's right(1 song)
5. ............................on the inside (2 songs)
6........................................outside the woman's left (2 songs)
7. Giros, both clockwise and counterclockwise (3 songs)
8. Walks to the cross and variations afterwards (2 songs)
9. Walking onto the woman's left side (2 songs)
10. Freely improvised including some of the above (3 songs)
tot. 20 songs
This schedule is gruelling (1hr.15mins) constant dancing and will take weeks to work up to being able to do the whole progression.
The beneficial results should become obvious after each 2 sessions of a completed practice."

IMHO this looks more like something that would be posted by someone who owns a practise. We have a teacher who does this once a week, a practise with specific themes and patterns, different each time. As for myself, I've never found a follower ready to repeat methodically a movement until it works. At best we try the sequence of our last class once, then she wants to "just dance".

Also I am not sure that it's a good idea that the follower already knows what you will lead.

My conclusion is, it's a good idea that you prepare what you will be practising, but keep it for you, don't post it.

 

[ant]

Originally Posted by Mario7
The social dance is simply two people sharing their enjoyment of the music
v

This schedule is gruelling (1hr.15mins) constant dancing and will take weeks to work up to being able to do the whole progression.

Mario the two just don't correlate to me.

The beneficial results should become obvious after each 2 sessions of a completed practice.

I don't see what is obvious about beneficial results with your schedule. I think all you will be doing is alienating the followers and at the end of the day you have lost the essence of the dance.

dancing to it with a warm connection

In my opinion you should just walk in a simple parrallel system and concentrate on getting a good connection with each other.


Then maybe add in some different walking patterns, ochos, giro etc. occasionally based upon your knowledge of the followers experience.

I am also wondering if these practise sessions are linking to any classes as I would have thought any person attending the classes would like to spend some time practising what has been taught.

Finally I have found that when you are practising with partner on a regular basis the sessions are far more organic than you appear to anticipating. Either one of you may want to practise something or try something new out and some things just arise when you are practising together.

 

[bordertangoman]

Finally I have found that when you are practising with partner on a regular basis the sessions are far more organic than you appear to anticipating. Either one of you may want to practise something or try something new out and some things just arise when you are practising together.

i would agree with this; my best private lessons have been where we worked with what is;

it could be something quite small like posture or pointing a foot, or dissociation
or something larger like ocho cortado; or changes from parallel to cross system;
organic means it can be more playful as well.

 

[Dave Bailey]

i would agree with this; my best private lessons have been where we worked with what is;

it could be something quite small like posture or pointing a foot, or dissociation
or something larger like ocho cortado; or changes from parallel to cross system;
organic means it can be more playful as well.

I also agree with the Ant-y one.

With my practice sessions, we usually have a couple of dances, then that'll always throw up a few things to work on. So we work on those.

The only time I have a specific plan is when I'm teaching. And even then, with 1-to-1 sessions, we often stray off plan.

Practice sessions are usually improvised. The key is not the syllabus, it's getting the right practice partner.

 

[Peaches]

Here's an idea: take her needs into account. You're pretty definite about what YOU are going to work on...what about what SHE wants or needs to work on? What about what ideas SHE has for practicising and dancing? You know, make this something about more than yourself.

 

[Mario7]

Here's an idea: take her needs into account. You're pretty definite about what YOU are going to work on...what about what SHE wants or needs to work on? What about what ideas SHE has for practicising and dancing? You know, make this something about more than yourself.

Obviously you didn't read the whole thing...don't be a hater.