All Corona related issues

[Well Rounded]

Thank you, so scared to post because it may seem 'inflammatory' but I should feel free to post what my life is, inside this ballroom forum. I know it doesn't mirror most of the folks here.... Thanks again.

I have often been reluctant to post about certain subjects for fear I would be misunderstood, and that I would not have the opportunity to clear up the misunderstanding before several people became hurt or angry.
I am glad that you are posting. It takes courage. I've found most people on this forum to be helpful and supportive even though the clarifying process can be difficult.

 

[ProgressNotPerfection]

Americans are no longer vigilant because racism is not a rampant prevalent blatant murder situation anymore. But all of our lives are still infected by racism. Social barriers, glass ceilngs, opportunities available or unavailable. This leads to money and health. You didn't get the job, therefore you are poorer, therefore you can't afford the healthy lifestyle that more privileged people can afford, and perhaps you die a few years before your richer counterparts. We are just murdering slowly. Robbing a person's self esteem or opportunity for a better life over many years, generations. I am very thankful that I have been brought up in a more tolerant generation, but honestly, we have a ****ing long way to go, people! Don't be complacent, America, and the rest of the world!

This was posted here in April 2006. It makes me sad that there has been so little improvement in 14 years (if any). It is even more sad that the first quoted sentence is wrong.

What does this have to do with dance?
Well.
Maybe we all have to answer that question for ourselves.

In the meantime, some additional practical suggestions might be helpful. This was mentioned previously:

As Lucia points out, individuals can do a lot with respect to widespread prejudice. If hotel staff are hassling a black dancer at a competition, point out things like the hair sparklies mentioned in Danceisjoy's original post that make it clear that she's one of the customers. That way the staff can be more careful to look for rhinestones and ballgowns instead of skin color the next time around.

What are some other specific steps to take, things to say, habits to create, etc., that could help address this issue within the ballroom dance community?

 

[lucia_l]

Traffic infraction or not. We discuss how to keep each other safe, what to do, what to say, while slowly realizing it makes no difference if my skin color is already criminalized.

FWIW, I totally believe this.

I absolutely know based on my own experience, that being a white woman gives me latitude in police stops. Heck.... I was once stopped speeding on I-80. (I absolutely was speeding-- like nearly everyone.) I handed the policeman my driver's license. I-80 was at the time a BIG corridor for meth traffic by hispanics. Now... your looking at my image and saying... uhmmm sooo.... But the cop seems my first name and pauses..... He says "Lucia Margarita..... Interesting name..." I know exactly what he means....

So I say, "Yes. My grandmother was Cuban and I was born in El Salvador. So my parents picked that name" But he sees the white skin. White. Very white.... He looks around the car. But you know... I'm white. Very white.

Does he ask to search the car? Nope. Does he escalate in anyway. Nope. Of course not. 'Cuz I'm white.

He asked, why are you in such a rush? I said: I work in Iowa. My husband lives in Illinois. I want to get there. So he says, "I wish my wife was speeding to see me." So obviously, my story is not a story of any sort of danger or trauma.

The smoothness of the stop, the lack of threat absolutely, totally, completely would not have happened in quite such a friendly way if I were not so totally white.

Well... I did get a ticket. But honestly, he looked like he wished he didn't have to write it.

So why do I know it wouldn't have happened if I were darker? When I was a kid, we would frequently have family friends from Guatemala or El Salvador visit, and I can assure you we knew this wouldn't happen to them. They were more or less white-- but not Irish-Scots-English-UK looking white like me. They might have olive complexions. They didn't "match" the appearance of the UK background family. They had accents.

It made a difference. Abso. Freakin'. Lutely. And I know it. I've seen it and have since I was 6 and we moved here.

Also: FWIW. When I was 7, the boys nicknamed me "peeltan" which meant that the color had peeled off. It was nowhere near the problem actually being brown would have been. (Also, eventually the boys forgot the nickname.) But I was entirely aware that color mattered in the town where I grew up. Our town was very white, but even a small amount of color, or being associated with color mattered a lot.

 

[Danceisjoy]

This was posted here in April 2006. It makes me sad that there has been so little improvement in 14 years (if any). It is even more sad that the first quoted sentence is wrong.

What does this have to do with dance?
Well.
Maybe we all have to answer that question for ourselves.

In the meantime, some additional practical suggestions might be helpful. This was mentioned previously:

What are some other specific steps to take, things to say, habits to create, etc., that could help address this issue within the ballroom dance xommunity?

"To dance is to live"(Isadora Duncan) Steps that can be taken:

1. Acknowledge that everything in life affects our dancing. Just like new shoes, remembering choreo, stage presence, breath, musicality, injury, lead and follow, lack of sleep, not enough food, relationship with partner /pro or your self-esteem... the energy needed to overcome a traffic stop, and or a hotel worker saying 'you need to leave, this is a private function' when you go look at the floor before the comp is off the charts. It's yet another 'thing to deal with' that can impact dancing. I've been there, the emotional toll is no joke. Dancing humiliated from my dance mistakes is one thing, add humiliation due to racism on top of that... It can be done, I've danced well despite this but the anger certainly can dull the trophy.

2. A smile can go a long way, a hello even further. Conversation even greater like 'where are you from'? But just being seen is huge.

3. Years, decades of dealing with racism that we have to shove back down to survive takes it toll. If someone bites a huge bullet and decides to post their experience, just listen without editing. It may not come out the way you wish. Not gentle enough, syntax issues, not clear, too angry in tone (given that it's a personal experience) but it's tough living these experiences and then forced to think of another's 'well being and saying things nicely' when you are in pain. I think these things are a great start.
And thank you to all who took the time to ask. I appreciate it.

 

[Bailango]

No one was triggered. It takes time within an established community for everyone to get familiar with a new poster’s style of communication. And I don’t think that members here asking for clarification or teasing out the meaning behind your words overshadows the horrors you experience daily.

I haven’t read the remaining posts following above yet.

This is not the time or place to try to be even handed. To illustrate what you wrote above and before that in the post about ”clarity in communication” comes across to me personally as -victim blaming. In case I am not clear it is like questioning a victim on why certain clothing was worn when the said victim complains about an sexual assault. If above is meant as an impartial advise it comes across to me as patronizing within the context in which it has been provided.

When talking about “clarity in communication”, that advise should have been directed at the poster who jumped to the conclusion and made a direct accusation. In my books that poster was indeed triggered. A better way for that poster would been to ask what the sentence in dispute meant!

None of us while writing can imagine all possible ways a sentence may be misconstrued or misinterpreted. Attempting to clear and precise, means writing a long complicated sentence or set of sentences. Which itself creates more opportunity for ambiguity. A better way is for a reader to pause and ask for clarification within the context of a discussion.

 

[fascination]

it is my hope that we don't expect anyone to bear a greater burden than anyone else in making their best effort to be precise, non-inflammatory and respectful of one another...the title of this thread does not pertain to whether or not df or the dance community are racially sensitive enough...it is about politics decimating the dance community...as a general rule df has some prohibitions on discussing politics and the wisdom of that has been borne out time and again...I am hopeful that we can now return to the original topic rather than continue to chew on how it ran aground...but I again give my thanks to danceisjoy for sharing her perspective as being exposed to the lived experience of a diverse population betters the entire group

 

[scullystwin42]

Well, I did not spread covid to anyone else, not even my kids and husband who live with me! Very lucky. I got some mild symptoms but am finally on the mend. looking forward to being out of isolation starting later this week.

As to the above post - i did not have sever symptoms but i did get a bit of brain fog. wear a mask and stay safe!

 

[ProgressNotPerfection]

Looks like Ohio Star Ball is on for November.

Home

The place where dance legends are made! Welcome to November 17-22, 2026 ** 2026 Standard Registration Now Open! ** For 2026 OSB Dance Camp info, click HERE! ** Click HERE for our Latest News! ** Click HERE for our Latest News! ** Click HERE for info on Video, Photo & Livestream availability. **...

ohiostarball.com

IFP and her husband/partner are competing at this (pro/pro).
Also, StandardPro and one of his advanced students are competing pro/am.

I asked StandardPro what the mask requirement is. He said they don’t have to wear masks on the dance floor, but masks are required everywhere else, as soon as you step off the floor.

1. That makes zero sense to me. The dance floor is where people will be breathing heavily. And it seems kind of like saying you’re going to swim only in the non-peeing end of the swimming pool.

2. When they return from OSB, I wonder if StandardPro will be required to stay home for 14 days, or if he will be allowed to teach lessons at the studio as usual. I assume the former; otherwise, the studio’s mask requirement is a farce.

 

[IndyLady]

Have watched a couple of virtual competitions in the last few weeks. Looking at a screen with several small rectangles, displaying yet smaller dancers, has finally, finally put the nail in the coffin of my burning desire to have a black Standard gown. Because if I can't see a damn thing those small ladies in small rectangles wearing small black gowns are doing, I'm betting it's a challenge for a judge, too. And if the judge can't see me (assuming I ever did a virtual comp), then what the actual.

Le sigh. I would love a black Standard gown. But not enough to disappear in one. I feel bad for the competitors I've seen recently, who were invisible against their partners.

I'm late responding here, but I had the same thought regarding black gowns as I watched the HOA comp.

1. That makes zero sense to me. The dance floor is where people will be breathing heavily. And it seems kind of like saying you’re going to swim only in the non-peeing end of the swimming pool.

On that note... so the comp I had been planning on in December, but which had been cancelled, is allegedly back on (though I see that is not yet noted on their website). I was intercepted when I walked into the studio yesterday evening to let me know about it. I told them I would look at it (mainly because I want to see the actual pricing, which always seems to be a classified state secret until it's time to sign up), but for a host of reasons - including ridiculous workload, not feeling ready to get on a plane and fly across the country, it had already been removed from this calendar year's budget, and the fact that we do not even have a full set of formal comp routines yet, I'm not thinking this is going to make it onto my agenda for 2020. Not for the level of effort and scrambling and money involved.

 

[lucia_l]

1. That makes zero sense to me. The dance floor is where people will be breathing heavily. And it seems kind of like saying you’re going to swim only in the non-peeing end of the swimming pool.

It makes sense if someone believes the dominant mechanism for transmission is 'droplets' (biggish particles) and they believe air flow in the room doesn't create scale structures that can transport these large droplets long distances before they land on the floor and stick. This falls in the category of "don't worry that the drops of water from your shower will mix with the air in your entire bathroom."

It might make sense if you thought there was some "aerosol" transmission. (Aerosols are just drops that are small enough that gravitational settling isn't the dominant method of clearing them.) But it would only make sense if you thought the air handling system brings in enough fresh air to keep the concentration of aerosols "low enough" near people. (We would need to know what low enough is.) This falls in the category of "yes, someone peed in the pool, but we are constantly changing the water so the concentration of pee is always no greater than peeing in the ocean. Since we don't worry about whale pee, ... well... we don't worry about that. Public pools actually rely on this because, lets face it, some people do pee in the pool.

It makes no sense if there is lots of aerosol transmission, and the room is small and air refresh rate low. Or if there are large flow dominant flow structures imposed by the HVAC. (The latter is like a restaurant that had an AC system that created a horizontal flow system of cool air out blowing across diners.)

If you are concerned about exposing yourself and the studio does allow the pros to teach lessons you should cancel lessons for 14 days. You could talk to the studio, but I imagine they have already decided on their policy. If we had quick turn around saliva tests there could be more options to request. But really.... self isolation is the only policy.

NYG (my pro-- New Young Guy) and his wife, NSP, (Not Secret Pro) are going. I'm going to risk continuuing lessons with masks. They went to another comp and I did that. Yes. It's a risk. I've got my eyes open. But I really don't expect them to not teach willing customers for two weeks to quarantine themselves and I don't want those unwilling to take the risk to prevent me from taking lessons when I know they could just chose to cancel their lessons and get the protection they want. So... sigh....

I wish there were cheap, quick saliva tests. I'd ask them to take them the two mornings a week associated with my lessons. (Or every three days. That's supposed to be enough). I might even pay for theirs myself! But.... there aren't any such tests available.

 

[Warren J. Dew]

1. That makes zero sense to me. The dance floor is where people will be breathing heavily. And it seems kind of like saying you’re going to swim only in the non-peeing end of the swimming pool.

It says to me that the organizers think masks are "pandemic theater". I don't think that, so I wouldn't go, but I'm not a fan of OSB anyway.

Europe's fall wave has shot up to several times the daily cases and deaths per capita that we have in the US - even Germany is getting close to the US in terms of deaths per capita. While mask usage rates are apparently higher in the US than in Europe, I expect our new cases are increasing, too, so I'd be leery of events this fall.

That said, I'd probably be okay with lessons after they return if they wear masks effectively. I've also been made aware that aerosol virus transmission varies strongly, inversely, with absolute humidity, so if either OSB or the studio did some humidification, that would help quite a bit.

 

[worddancer]

If both dancers wear masks, even if one is infected:
1) The odds of infection is much much lower. (If not, what is the point of masks?)
2) Even if infection happens, the viral load is much lower. And viral load matters.

 

[mnldoc]

Ohio is requiring proof of a negative test for those who wish to dance without masks. Otherwise, you will have to dance with a mask.

 

[IndyLady]

Ohio is requiring proof of a negative test for those who wish to dance without masks. Otherwise, you will have to dance with a mask.

I'm genuinely curious - how are they planning to enforce this? With so many people coming off and on the floor for various heats. Or do you get one of those bracelets if you test negative, like what they give out at concerts/events to show you're over 21 and can buy alcohol?

 

[mnldoc]

I am curious too. I can post an update next week. King’s Ball is doing the same (requiring proof of a negative test in order to dance unmasked).