Are milongas getting shorter?

[itwillhappen]

I recall that ten years ago, an evening milonga would last around 6h. Nowadays, five hours is the norm here - effectively more like 4.5h — while afternoon milongas run for 4h. I even attended an encuentro where every milonga lasted just 4h. And there are now quite a few "mini-encuentros", "half-marathons" or "double milongas" that last only a single day rather than a full weekend.
At the same time, there is a clear trend shifting from four-song tandas to three-song tandas.

Are we getting older and facing physical limitations, or is our attention span shrinking due to TikTok and the like?

 

[Eleven!]

My local milongas (UK) have been 3 track tandas for many years. Even before COVID. Here its due to the large excess of followers so the number of tracks was kept shorter so that there would be more tandas in a milonga and therefore more people could get to dance (in theory). I was told that was the reasoning by all of the organisers when I asked them several years ago. 4hr milongas have also been common for many years. Both afternoon and evening as this doesn't seem to make a difference. So I am not seeing any changes here.

When I travel to muti-day events (Europe) average of 2 x 6 hour or 3 x 4 hr milongas a day is common still. Although I deliberately apply for events with more dancing time so that may be self selecting my experience. There is a growing trend for Vals now to be 4 track tandas which I heartily approve of. The 4th track is generally greeted with delight and applause for the DJ every time it happens. I have only noticed 4 track Vals the last couple of years initially it was just the one DJ who loves Vals and if I saw her dancing I knew it would be 4 tracks and if she was still at the DJ station it would be 3 so I started watching for it. But in the last year I have seen multiple DJs adopt the occasional 4 track Vals. At multiday events I have not been to any that have dropped from 4 to 3 tracks for tango.

 

[brujo]

In the Pacific Northwest in the US the only three song tandas I’ve encountered were at a beginner friendly Milonga and at an alt tango event. Everywhere else has been four songs

 

[Brummbaer]

Haven't noticed any change - except for one where a change of venue requires them to clear up and vacate earlier. It seems more about when they start (people need to travel there) and when they need to get home - when the public transport stops, or for sleep, or work next day. Not everyone lives in a tango metropolis with a night culture.

My UK experience is that 3-dance tango tandas predominate. The argument was that you got to dance with more people. Some do have 4-dance tango tandas. Europe, IMHO, tends to 4. There are also 2-dance speedtandas. There's no real 'tradition' for any number; it's just about where US tango radio required advertisments with recorded music. The earlier 'tradition' was about collecting payment. Fewer dances; more clients and payment. Some places have just moved on from that old radio broadcast formula.

The argument for 3-dance vals and milonga was that there wasn't sufficient music of that genre.

Of course, an older 'tradition' with live music was when the band/orchestra wanted a break. Might be 2, 3, 4, 5... of the same genre. Some attempt to replicate that, but it's about reading the floor and the mood.

Alt-tango - how do you tell what's a 'cortina'? Some just flow, or you stop when it suits.

 

[TTanguero]

I recall that ten years ago, an evening milonga would last around 6h. Nowadays, five hours is the norm here - effectively more like 4.5h — while afternoon milongas run for 4h [...] At the same time, there is a clear trend shifting from four-song tandas to three-song tandas.

I haven't noticed a shift in either in the events I attend, but then I would rule out any festivals or encuentros with short milongas.

In the UK, four-song tandas are still the norm, although some DJs will switch to three-song ones when there is a significant shortage of leaders.

 

[Brummbaer]

in either in the events

four-song tandas are still the norm

Really? On that sample basis.

I can think of about 10-15 I go to throughout the UK. They're all 3-song tandas.

 

[TTanguero]

Really? On that sample basis.

s/either/any

 

[opendoor]

I am 69 years old now and..

I have the feeling, that the milongas are lasting longer. The tandas also seem to go on longer and longer. Therefore, I usually only start dancing from the second piece onwards.

 

[Rabbit]

Are we getting older and facing physical limitations, or is our attention span shrinking due to TikTok and the like?

I suspect venue hire charges inflating and people wanting more consistent sleep schedules

 

[opendoor]

..people wanting more consistent sleep schedules

I think it also depends on whether the milonga ages along with its regular guests, or whether it can attract the younger dancers. My former house milonga was able to attract the renewable raw materials, according to the red queen rule: you always have to run faster to stay in place. I no longer go to any milonga that fills up only from 11pm on, but the precariat, freelancers and the university students exactly love that time. Me and My cohort already has switched for dancing to after-work or coffee milongas.

(Also, my last DJ gig will be on July 6th. Lately, I've absolutely hated not getting to bed until 3 a.m.)

 

[itwillhappen]

(Also, my last DJ gig will be on July 6th. Lately, I've absolutely hated not getting to bed until 3 a.m.)

A major downside of the DJ job is that you have to stay until the very end - whether you like the music or not.
My girlfriend then often prefers to drive her own car.
The manager of my resident venue says that, largely due to the pandemic, guests are heading home half a hour earlier.


A DJ guide from the early days of the tanda system leaves the decision regarding the number of tracks up to the DJ.
From a sample milonga there:

1. Miguel Calo: 5 tangos (17:00-17:14)
2. Juan D'Arienzo: 3 valses (17:14-17:22)
3. Ricardo Tanturi: 5 tangos (17:22-17:38)
4. Pedro Laurenz: 3 milongas (17:38-17:46)
5. D'Agostino: 4 tangos (17:48:18:02)
7. Ricardo Malerba: 3 tangos (18:10-18:20)
8. Quinteto Pirincho: 3 milongas (18:20-18:28)
9. Donato/D'Arienzo: 5 tangos (18:28-18:42)
10. Rodolfo Biagi: 3 valses (18:42-18:50)
11. Miguel Calo: 4 tangos (18:50-19:02)
12. Teofilo Chantre/Arthur Ebeling: 2 special milongables

http://www.tango-encuentro.de/resources/DJmanual2010.pdf

(Nowadays, however, the author mostly plays 4T-4T-4V-4T-4T-4M sets.)

As a DJ, I often switch from 4-track to 3-track tango tandas about two-thirds of the way through a milonga.
Why? Because I consider it the right thing to do, and the decision is mine to make.

 

[brujo]

As a DJ, I often switch from 4-track to 3-track tango tandas about two-thirds of the way through a milonga.
Why? Because I consider it the right thing to do, and the decision is mine to make.

The way I seen it done it’s the other way around. Where you start with 3 songs at the beginning and then move to the 4 songs. The reason for this is that there are usually more beginners at the start. They might have stuck around after a lesson and the floor tends to be a bit more empty. This lets them get some tandas in and they usually leave after an hour or so. Then the more advanced dancers usually take over and having 4 songs is what they would expect.

 

[ArbeeNYC]

In the Pacific Northwest in the US the only three song tandas I’ve encountered were at a beginner friendly Milonga and at an alt tango event. Everywhere else has been four songs

Here it's the DJ's choice. So we sometimes get three songs and sometimes four songs (milonga and vals always three). I'm okay with either one.

 

[itwillhappen]

When I travel to muti-day events (Europe) average of 2 x 6 hour or 3 x 4 hr milongas a day is common still. Although I deliberately apply for events with more dancing time so that may be self selecting my experience.

I probably have a bias in the opposite direction. I see no reason to dance more than two three-hour sessions a day; my concentration suffers, and I’m not getting paid for "dance as a service". Besides, my SO runs through the good dance partners by then and starts having trouble with her feet.

Instead of weekend events, we’re now more inclined to accept a longer drive for good milongas or one-day events.

 

[JournalInTime]

Reporting in from Montréal:

Typical event length is about 4 hours, though at my favorite place, only start times are firm, with end times being "until there aren't enough couples left for it to be fun, and the organizer quietly asks the DJ to play La cumparsita." There, I always attend a Tuesday night that's 20h30 until around 00h30, and a Friday night that runs about half an hour later at both ends. I sometimes attend a Sunday night that's 19h15 (yeah, I know) to 23h00 (sharp, which is unusual here). And I occasionally get to other events, one of which runs from 21h00 until people decide to leave, which has been as late as 02h00 but which is generally closer to 01h00. One organizer occasionally tries to run all-nighters because he has a vision, but they always end at around the 4- to 5-hour mark.

So, 4 hours.

This is a slight change. Where I used to tend bar from 2013 to 2017, the Friday milonga ran from 21h00 until "when people went home." As the barman chasing the last people out the door quite often, "when people went home" was regularly as late as 03h00 . . . the other bartender and her husband the sometimes-DJ got home just before dawn, because they had to drive to another community. After closing and cleanup, I once or twice saw twilight on the walk home. But 6 hours wasn't the norm everywhere, only at that place.

Tandas here are still mainly 4T-4T-3V-4T-4T-3M. A few DJs prefer 4V to 3V, which everybody loves (not sure why more DJs don't do it . . .). One omits most or all of the milongas, which almost nobody likes (not sure why he does that). A few will switch from 4T to 3T if the roles are unbalanced – in practice, that means too many followers – to facilitate more frequent partner changes, but it doesn't work, because the same people who always get to dance just dance more, shorter tandas while the same people who rarely get to dance sit out more, shorter tandas.

There have been on-again, off-again "speed tanda" events with two-piece tandas, where the idea is just to dance with lots of people as a meet-and-greet. I only ever went to one. The fact that they are more off than on, and relatively rare, suggests that the format doesn't work around here.