Ballroom Today

[pnoisette]

Don't know if anyone else caught the review in the New York Times on "Burn the Floor?"
According to the critic, the show featring many of ballroom's top dancers, "with a canny understanding of each category of the genre, [takes] most of the dance out of these dances."

and . . .

"It is therefore time to say that ballroom today (at exhibition and competitive levels) proposes behavior from both sexes that looks not much like courtship and seduction but something alarmingly close to rape and whorishness. It does degrade women, and it makes its men look crassly manipulative. (All five “Ballroom’s Best” men simply look like creeps.)

Still, my chief objection to these visions of ballroom is not moral. (These people choose to do it.) What makes me wretched is that all these stunts, acrobatics, point-scoring and flashy displays of sexual availability are what matter. Musicality, phrasing, intimacy and actual sensuousness are what don’t."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/13/arts/dance/13ballroom.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&hpw

Some of this reflect my own reservations with the current trends in ballroom: too many tricks, too little good ballroom dancing; and in Latin numbers, particularly, tastelessness in what is supposed to pass as sexiness or sensuality.

Would love to hear from others.

 

[DancingJools]

I think the author missed the point, by a few miles at least. What is "quaint" is his point of view.
And what bothers me is that I am not sure he is qualified to opine on ballroom if all his exposure to it was some lessons he took in the '70's. Even though the author is the chief dance critic of the NYT, with stellar credentials in ballet and other forms of dance, his notions of competitive ballroom are very, very antiquated. What I could tell is that he confused Victor and Hanna's performance as "ballroom". In fact, it is cabaret, or theater arts, a separate branch of the genre.
Before I was exposed to dance ("educated" is a better word), ballet to me looked gross, unnatural, silly, and yes, demeaning to women. What's with all those tutus and walking on tippy toes? [I was raised overseas in a culture where ballet barely exists]. I believe there is still a school of thought, with certain validity in its own right, that still argues ballet is demeaning to women. But I doubt the NYT would invite a member of that school of thought, let alone someone like myself before I learned anything about dance, to review a ballet performance.
Many of the lifts and "tricks" that bothered the critic can be seen in icedancing. But that dance genre comes without the overt sexual flavor of ballroom, and I think this is what bothered Mr. Macaulay.
That being said, I do agree that recent ballroom performances are veering more and more towards theatrics and less towards dancing, but I wouldn't use the kind of harsh terms he did. And I think TV shows like SYTYCD are doing a phenomenal job of educating the general public about dance, theatrics and all.

 

[DL]

... the overt sexual flavor of ballroom...

Is that an intrinsic property of ballroom?

 

[DancingJools]

I'll add: The costuming is a separate item, and has more to do with marketing and a notion that the Broadway or TV public would be attracted by the flashy (sometimes vulgar) costumes. In ballroom dance proper, i.e. a comp, these trends come and go, and the trend NOW is that high-level dancers rarely appear in such miniscule costumes.

 

[DL]

Ballroom performances can be "sexy" in widely varying degrees. No matter where they fall on that spectrum, they can also fall anywhere on the spectrum between "classy" and "crass". IMO they are not always classy.


I have not seen Burn the Floor and don't mean to imply anything about it specifically, here.

 

[CANI]

Ballroom performances can be "sexy" in widely varying degrees. No matter where they fall on that spectrum, they can also fall anywhere on the spectrum between "classy" and "crass". IMO they are not always classy.


I have not seen Burn the Floor and don't mean to imply anything about it specifically, here.

I agree

 

[etp777]

I've certainly seen routines that I found crass (coomplained about one on another thread. ). But also seen routines that were completley sexy and sensual but with nothing like that.

 

[dancelvr]

Regarding "Burn the Floor", I've got the DVD. I watched it once, and now it's gathering dust on my shelf. Meh.......I didn't find it to be representative of my feelings about ballroom dancing. I was disappointed with most of the show in that respect. I'm sure it's an exciting live show, but it did not translate to me on video.

And, I don't see how one can comment on the entire genre of ballroom dancing by watching this particular show. The reviewer should spend some time in Ohio...

 

[j_alexandra]

NYTimes also published an article the same day about self tanning.

Life's little ironies.

 

[chica latina]

Burn the floor is a show, so in my opinion it exaggerates some aspects of ballroom dancing.. I dont think it is a good measure of what ballroom is today, but it's a great way to watch this amazing dancers perform a show.

but I do agree and have heard a lot of people mentioning that ballroom may be loosing it's artistry by the athletiscm/gymnastics dept...

 

[AMeader]

but I do agree and have heard a lot of people mentioning that ballroom may be losing it's artistry by the athletiscm/gymnastics dept...

Is it possible that ballroom is turning to athleticism to keep up with cultural demand? So much emphasis is placed on professional and competitive sports such as soccer and basketball, that perhaps that trend is influencing ballroom as well.

I don't necessarily think that an increase in athleticism is a bad thing - athletic prowess is certainly a feat in its own right, and the athleticism of dancers is certainly evident in their movement. The athleticism has always been present; artistry has simply overshadowed it.

 

[jennyisdancing]

Burn the floor is a show, so in my opinion it exaggerates some aspects of ballroom dancing.. I dont think it is a good measure of what ballroom is today, but it's a great way to watch this amazing dancers perform a show.

but I do agree and have heard a lot of people mentioning that ballroom may be loosing it's artistry by the athletiscm/gymnastics dept...

The NYT writer does have a point, to a certain degree. But yeah, the fact that he took some social dance lessons as a teen thirty years ago does not qualify him as a ballroom critic.

Everybody here on DF seems to understand that Burn the Floor is a stage show which is meant to be flashy and not a portrayal of typical social dancing. Essentially, Burn the Floor is Riverdance for ballroom.

Just goes to show that ballroom dance still is not seen by elite critics as equal to ballet or modern. Just imagine applying for a job as a ballet critic at the Times, if your sole ballet knowledge was a few lessons as a kid. They'd laugh you out of there.

And by the way, the NYT critic said he studied ballroom with someone named Muriel Ashcroft. I looked up her bio:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Murielle Ashcroft’s career in the dance world spans more than 70 years of teaching, examining, performance, and production. Classically trained, she first became interested in modern dance when Zelia Raye was developing her work in this field, and she was responsible for introducing modern dance in the Hammond School, Chester, where she taught for many years. [/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]From 1974–1998 she was Chairman of the Modern Theatre Dance Faculty, of which she is a Fellow. A member of Grand Council, in1979 she received the Imperial Award for outstanding service. She is a Life Member of the Royal Academy of Dance.
[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]So obviously Murielle Ashcroft is a modern dance expert - but I couldn't find anything that said she was specifically qualified to teach ballroom.
[/FONT]

 

[danceronice]

Is it possible that ballroom is turning to athleticism to keep up with cultural demand? So much emphasis is placed on professional and competitive sports such as soccer and basketball, that perhaps that trend is influencing ballroom as well.

I don't necessarily think that an increase in athleticism is a bad thing - athletic prowess is certainly a feat in its own right, and the athleticism of dancers is certainly evident in their movement. The athleticism has always been present; artistry has simply overshadowed it.

There's a line between "athleticism" and "gymnastic/contortionism", though. Someone (in a position to have a very sound ability to judge) described current Pro Smooth as "out of control". I had to agree--I could turn the sound off on some pro Smooth events and I would have no idea which dance I'm watching.

Skating has been dealing with an exagerated version of this problem. Should they be rewarding people for going from above-average flexibility (a nice layback spin, strong extension on a spiral) to grotesquerie (Zhang's back-breaking pearl spin, which requires extreme flexibility that you really have to be born to, or a full Charlotte spiral with the free leg at 90 deg. to the ice and the upper body flat along the skating leg.)

Ice dance has been dealing with quite a few rule changes and serious charges that it's become "pairs without the lifts" rather than dance, and there already were rules put in place to eliminate moves considered trashy rather than sensual--inverted split lifts, for example, nicknamed "gyno" lifts, were banned as inappropriate.

How far can you take athleticism before you lose the artistic elements that make skating and dance different?

 

[Another Elizabeth]

I'm not wild about the Charlotte spiral, but I went and found a video of Zhang's pearl spin and I thought it was absolutely gorgeous.

That said, I pretty much agree with the NYT reviewer, but I'm biased - I've never really cared for Latin, and I don't care for standard/smooth dancers who try to make their dances sexy by importing latin moves, either. I'd rather watch Sinkinson do a foxtrot.

 

[etp777]

OK, finally got a chance to look at the article. Now, with my admitted bias, part that annoys me most is his mention of craig and Natalie, since in my opinion, these should be the style he likes best. Keeping the excess lifts, etc, in the TA/Cabaret genre, where Craig and Natalie compete, helps keep them out of the more traditional dances and let them stick to the artistry and style of the dance (at least in theory). Dunno, least, tha'ts my opinion.