Beginning follower needs advice

[bluestar]

Hi everyone! I'm new to these forums- what a super resource for learning, and fun to read as well!

After a couple months of group ECS lessons, it's becoming apparent that I am not a natural follower. I find myself going in the direction I know I should go, instead of trusting the connection and doing what I'm led to do. This interferes with what the more experienced leaders try to lead, and surely diminishes the fun for my partner. Is this normal for a beginner, or do I need therapy for my control issues? Thanks for any advice.

 

[pygmalion]

Hi bluestar! Welcome.

 

[fascination]

welcome as well...and no, that is not unsual...especially for responsible take charge women...I am six years in and still needing to consciously keep that in check

 

[jennyisdancing]

Hi everyone! I'm new to these forums- what a super resource for learning, and fun to read as well!

After a couple months of group ECS lessons, it's becoming apparent that I am not a natural follower. I find myself going in the direction I know I should go, instead of trusting the connection and doing what I'm led to do. This interferes with what the more experienced leaders try to lead, and surely diminishes the fun for my partner. Is this normal for a beginner, or do I need therapy for my control issues? Thanks for any advice.

Relax and be patient with yourself. Think of following simply as a skill to be learned, because that's what it is. If you didn't grow up doing partner dancing, and you've spent your life so far doing solo dancing (or no dance at all), then following is just not going to feel natural for a while.

A couple months of group lessons is not very long. If you feel you really are challenged, you could also consider private lessons where you focus on improving your following. Just make sure that with group or private, you have a teacher that actually teaches this. From your post I'm not clear whether you are being specifically instructed on following skills.

 

[bluestar]

Thanks for the responses and encouragement! It's good to know others have felt this way. I will consider taking private lessons if this issue continues; I sure don't want a reputation as a poor follower. Our teacher does teach how to follow, and dances with us as leader often. Perhaps I'll ask her for some more follower- specific tips; maybe the other gals in the class could use them too.

 

[waltzgirl]

It's a challenge to learn to follow well in beginning classes, because the leaders are beginners too and often lead poorly or not at all. So followers are often given the choice of doing their part on their own and just standing there waiting for a lead (and embarrassing the guy).

Is the problem that you move too early, before the lead has actually led the move, or do you respond to a lead by going through a pattern you know when in fact the leader was leading something else?

 

[Steve Pastor]

Welcome, bluestar.

The only "therapy" you need is "practice".
(Which, I guess, you could think of as a form of "therapy".)

To develop any new skill you have to practice, practice, practice. The more time you spend in classes "following" the further along you will get.

With East Coast Swing, which has a consistent number of steps, I think it might be helpful to practice the timing of those steps on your own. As new "moves" come up in your class you will see that you can take those steps in different directions. The more you get used to taking those steps (triple, triple, rock step?) the less you will have to "think" about doing it.

And "not thinking", but "reacting" is what you are trying to learn to do.

Another way of thinking about it is that you'll be paying less attention to stepping, and more to your partner and the lead.

And, yes, see if your teacher has more to offer to the followers. NOT teaching useful skills to them is way too common.

If you want to talk about other things that will make you a better follower, just ask!

 

[abifae]

And "not thinking", but "reacting" is what you are trying to learn to do.

That's what I'm trying to learn You have to learn to be sensitive to your partner and feel them moving. They tell you where to go if you can learn to listen.

 

[kmaitland]

Hi everyone! I'm new to these forums- what a super resource for learning, and fun to read as well!

After a couple months of group ECS lessons, it's becoming apparent that I am not a natural follower. I find myself going in the direction I know I should go, instead of trusting the connection and doing what I'm led to do. This interferes with what the more experienced leaders try to lead, and surely diminishes the fun for my partner. Is this normal for a beginner, or do I need therapy for my control issues? Thanks for any advice.

The issue may not be whether you are a "natural follower" - the problem may be what/who you are following: the leader or the music. Remember "more experienced" does not necessarily mean *better* You would be amazed how many so-called experienced leaders - and followers - can't truly lead/follow or count.

I'm fine in ECS (I've been doing in for 15 years) by I count myself as one of the bad ones with WCS, a dance I prefer - I can count but I am not always the best follower.

Patience and patience is the best medicine.

 

[tsb]

I find myself going in the direction I know I should go

you *know* you should go? this makes me curious as to how your class is being taught. not all instruction is the same. it may well be that:

1) in your class you are being taught "steps" vs. learning how to dance (lead and follow) and this becomes more obvious when you dance with leads who are not taking the class(es) you are taking;

2) you are used to being taught from an authoritarian viewpoint that emphasizes that there is only *one* correct way to do something. i have found it helpful to reframe the perspective to "it's most traditionally done this way, but it's not necessarily the only way";

3) you are being taught and repeating a specific pattern of figures and you are subconsciously expecting that pattern to repeat in open dancing;

if you are serious about developing your partnering (following) skills, i suggest the following exercise:

dance with a lead you trust while keeping your eyes closed - and without music. this will force you to rely totally on the connection with your partner to determine tempo and direction of motion.

if you find the size of your steps to be significantly smaller than when your eyes are open that suggests that you do not trust your partner to lead you/keep you safe. if this persists when you really have no reason to mistrust your partner, *maybe* that would be worth exploring with a trained professional.

 

[Asiatias]

Welcome, bluestar.

The only "therapy" you need is "practice".
(Which, I guess, you could think of as a form of "therapy".)

To develop any new skill you have to practice, practice, practice. The more time you spend in classes "following" the further along you will get.

Great response!

Welcome Bluestar,

Often groups focus on patterns. Technique is sparing. In groups both dancers are learning and doing the same pattern. Be aware that this can also lend itself to promoting you to take charge...

Something all of us Female dancers have to fight..

A few private lessons combined with your groups will definately change the whole ball game for you.

With privates and/or groups.. the was best said above by Steve... practice!

 

[tsb]

Great response!

Welcome Bluestar,

Often groups focus on patterns. Technique is sparing. In groups both dancers are learning and doing the same pattern. Be aware that this can also lend itself to promoting you to take charge...

Something all of us Female dancers have to fight..

A few private lessons combined with your groups will definately change the whole ball game for you.

With privates and/or groups.. the was best said above by Steve... practice!

i disagree; i submit that practicing it with incorrect technique merely makes it more difficult to unlearn.

 

[LCbaseball22]

Hi everyone! I'm new to these forums- what a super resource for learning, and fun to read as well!

After a couple months of group ECS lessons, it's becoming apparent that I am not a natural follower. I find myself going in the direction I know I should go, instead of trusting the connection and doing what I'm led to do. This interferes with what the more experienced leaders try to lead, and surely diminishes the fun for my partner. Is this normal for a beginner, or do I need therapy for my control issues? Thanks for any advice.

Sounds to me like you are anticipating...and I've noticed this is very common, not just with beginners either, I've danced with some more experienced girls who backlead from time to time even. My dance teacher's theory why girls do this is because they might be used to dancing with guys who don't lead very well so they just do their own thing...get used to leading themselves. If the problem is that guy is not giving you clear leads or they are incomplete, don't help him out...just follow as much as he leads...he should eventually get the hint. Otherwise you may think you're helping but you're actually doing the guy a dis-service and he won't learn to lead properly.

Otherwise, I'm not sure what to tell you other then simply wait for the lead. If it's an outside turn for instance don't move when he raises his left hand...he hasn't given you a direction yet, wait for the lead from the right hand. Yes, you can probably tell it's an outside turn right away...but with a more advanced dancer it could be something different. I think eventually girls learn to stay put if they keep anticipating wrong, lol. On the guys side of things there are certain patterns I will do intentionally to confuse the girl if I realize she is backleading but in general it's important to keep mixing it up just so she doesn't know what's coming. When the guys gets into too much of a predictable routine is when you tend to run into this problem.

Often groups focus on patterns. Technique is sparing. In groups both dancers are learning and doing the same pattern. Be aware that this can also lend itself to promoting you to take charge...

Yes, that too. It's often more of a problem in group classes where the women know the patterns, especially if it's called out beforehand. Which is why sometimes my instructor likes to do this thing where he gives each of the leads a sheet of paper with a randomized list of patterns and he'll just say like, "ok guys, I want you to do pattern #3" and because the girls are not aware of what #3 entails they tend to follow much better...amazing!

Oh, and the dancing with eyes closed drill that has already been mentioned seems to work wonders too...our teacher likes to employ that one also.

 

[snapdancer]

"and the dancing with eyes closed drill that has already been mentioned seems to work wonders too"

+1. Most people are accustomed to communicating either visually or audibly. Partner dancing is about communication, but the visual and audible communication channel is secondary to the kinesthetic channel. (Had to do some Googling to find "kinesthetic" as an equivalent word for visual and audible -- that sort of highlights the issue in a way).

 

[MrPlow]

Otherwise, I'm not sure what to tell you other then simply wait for the lead. If it's an outside turn for instance don't move when he raises his left hand...he hasn't given you a direction yet, wait for the lead from the right hand.

The first time a follower did that to me, and I recognized it for what it was, my understanding of leading jumped to a new level. This thread is about followers but what they do while learning to follow sometimes helps the leaders.