Closed/Open events

[BeefHero]

Ok. I think someone might have asked this question a long long time ago, and I may even sound stupid just even mentioning it again. However, if I don't figure this out I can't sleep well~ :x

I have been looking through lots of NDCA competition websites. The thing that majorly confuses me is the closed/open bronze events. I mean, if it's "bronze," why is it open? If they are making it an "open" event, why is it bronze?? Same thing applied with closed/open silver and closed/open gold.

Also, they have these division A and division B events. What are they? I think they are multi-dance events (mostly 5 dances) for a style of dance. That they are, are they closed or open? Moreover, what's the purpose of these division events?

Hope someone can clarify these questions for me.
Thanks!!

 

[Joe]

so how is open bronze not the equivalent of plain open?

 

[Another Elizabeth]

so how is open bronze not the equivalent of plain open?

Because it's possible to place out of it. Think of it as pre-pre-pre-prechamp.

 

[Chris Stratton]

so how is open bronze not the equivalent of plain open?

Because it's possible to place out of it. Think of it as pre-pre-pre-prechamp.

Do they actually hold am/am events in levels like this?

I've usually heard 'open bronze' as a pro/am level, and I thought in general it was not possible to formally place out of a pro/am level (though there is that rule about not repeating an event at the same comp where you previously won it)

But the idea of it as a lower level event seems to make sense.

 

[twnkltoz]

so how is open bronze not the equivalent of plain open?

The point is that in open bronze you're only expected to dance to the level of a bronze dancer. Open silver expects a higher level, open gold higher than that, etc. Open bronze gives relative newcomers to competition a chance to do choreography and step outside the bounds of the bronze syllabus without being expected to compete against open level dancers.

 

[Chris Stratton]

Do they actually hold am/am events in levels like this?

not am events, but student/student events.

Which have the same lack of a formal profiency system as pro/am events, right?

 

[setsuna713]

What's the difference between am/am events and student/student events?

 

[Warren J. Dew]

What's the difference between am/am events and student/student events?

At competitions I've been to, very few people enter the student/student events; most of them seem to be from studios who would prefer to keep their students dancing only within their studio circle, and don't tell those students about the amateur competition categories. The student/student competitors I've talked to at NDCA competitions have all decided to do the amateur category next time because there's generally more competition (more than zero) there.

Some competitions don't offer amateur categories, only student/student - most Arthur Murray and Fred Astaire competitions are like this, unless they've changed recently.

 

[twnkltoz]

What's the difference between am/am events and student/student events?

At competitions I've been to, very few people enter the student/student events; most of them seem to be from studios who would prefer to keep their students dancing only within their studio circle, and don't tell those students about the amateur competition categories. .

I don't think that's the case. I think it has more to do with the fact that they aren't ready for the amateur comps--you have to be dancing at least some silver/gold material to be able to do pre-novice even. Student/student heats give you a chance to compete at a lower level in all the dances. I see more of it in bronze than in silver and gold. I think it's also a good warmup and another opportunity to be on the floor.

 

[Chris Stratton]

I don't think that's the case. I think it has more to do with the fact that they aren't ready for the amateur comps--you have to be dancing at least some silver/gold material to be able to do pre-novice even. Student/student heats give you a chance to compete at a lower level in all the dances. I see more of it in bronze than in silver and gold. I think it's also a good warmup and another opportunity to be on the floor.

This must be a regional thing... NDCA comps in the northeast that I've thought about attending have "novice bronze" and similar am/am categories.

I do think people are often -wrongly- encouraged to feel like they have to be fairly advanced before they can enter a competition of any sort with an amateur partner. With some looking around, it should be possible to find suitable events for determined dancers with just a few months of experience.

 

[twnkltoz]

You're probably right, Chris...I've never seen "novice bronze." But then, I don't go to the smaller club or college comps.

 

[Chris Stratton]

You're probably right, Chris...I've never seen "novice bronze." But then, I don't go to the smaller club or college comps.

I was actually referring to major east-coast NDCA comps like the Yankee Classic offering am/am syllabus events at bronze level.

 

[Another Elizabeth]

I don't think that's the case. I think it has more to do with the fact that they aren't ready for the amateur comps--you have to be dancing at least some silver/gold material to be able to do pre-novice even.

This is definitely a regional distinction. On the west coast, the lowest level of amateur competition seems to usually be pre-novice (open syllabus). On the east coast, students progress through three or four syllabus levels before starting "open" events (pre-bronze, bronze, silver, gold). This was a real headache ten years ago when we were writing the current USABDA competition rules, and resulted in the "parallel tracks" system currently in place.

Since then, many east coast competitions have started offering a novice category, as a kind of pre-prechamp. I think a few west coast competitions have started offering syllabus competitions as well. But my understanding is that you would almost never see a bronze amateur competition with quarterfinals in it on the west coast, the way you do at some of the big USABDA and NDCA comps on the east coast.

 

[Chris Stratton]

But my understanding is that you would almost never see a bronze amateur competition with quarterfinals in it on the west coast, the way you do at some of the big USABDA and NDCA comps on the east coast.

Where's the NDCA comp with bronze quarters? Their national championships?

The only USABDA comp I'm aware of having them is MAC - mostly due to the availability of lots of college-circuit people in January. Though if nationals ended up here that might be a second.

 

[Elizabeth]

Where's the NDCA comp with bronze quarters? Their national championships?

La Classique du Quebec has been know to have semis and sometimes even quarter finals in syllabus events. You have to figure out the right age group though. (They do things slightly differently up there.) Its also not consistant from year to year.