Dance Instructor Dating a Student

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DL said:
In general, the interest of the studios is to protect their businesses -- not to "control lives". In any case, no matter what contract is at hand in any industry, the overriding real-life concerns are:

1. What are the interests of the parties to the contract?
2. Are the parties acting in good faith throughout the duration of the contract?
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If the studio really wanted to offer "good faith," then it needs to provide the
customer the choice of opting-in or opting-out of various interactions up-front,
in very explicit and highlighted form. Many customer would be turned off right up
front and may very well not join the studio from day 1.

As it is, studios sneak in these provisions under the covers, as riders. Studio
owners know that these provisions would not fly with many customers.
The notion of always having to PAY big money to deal with studio employees
is not going to sit well with careful spenders. The dance business depends
on the "teaser rate" type of customer recruiting and up-front declarations
goes against these tactics.

People enter into contracts because they *want* to have relationships with each other over some period of time. All this agonizing over fine details, enforceability, etc., misses the point IMO. If things get to the point where any of that matters, the relationship has probably already failed -- which means that people aren't getting what they wanted in the first place. It doesn't really matter (for this discussion) exactly *how* things fall apart after that -- it only matters that they *will* fall apart.
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The terms of these contracts are lopsided from day 1, with the studios
knowing what they want and the (new) customer pretty much clueless.
That's why "re-negotiation" or "enforce-ability" comes into the picture,
when the customer finally wakes up to what the real deal is.

Pretty much like many other businesses.
 
Partner Dancer said:
Huh? What kind of broad-net clause are you talking about?

Just do a Web search on non-compete clauses. They all involve "solicitation," which
could get involved (including 3rd-party involvement). No clause can prevent a
customer from actively seeking out the previous service provider (instructor) on
his/her own will. Of course, there must be proof there was no solicitation.

In the cases you mentioned, there probably was some solicitation going on.
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This might be the first time PD and I agree. I don't believe any contract can take away a consumers right to shop where ever they choose, use whichever doctor (insurance issues aside), plumber or dance instructor they wish. The non-compete clause signed by the employee, on the other hand can be enforced in many but not all states. I don't believe it would hold up anywhere telling a consumer where they can spend their money. I am not an attorney so I really have nothing to base this on other than what I have seen over they years and the company I work for enforcing, and in some cases failing to enforce, the non -compete clause we all signed.
 
CaliChris10 said:
Non competes for students are a joke also. If an instructor leaves a studio and his students want to follow him/her that should be their choice. What the heck is this anyway nazi ballroom. Why do people sign these contracts?!
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I find your comment comparing what maybe happening in ballroom dance to what happened in Nazi Germany disgraceful and obscene. Millions of people were murdered in Nazi Germany. Your comment demeans and minimizes what happened to all those victims of those horrible crimes. You have a lot of soul searching to do.
 
flightco said:
This might be the first time PD and I agree. I don't believe any contract can take away a consumers right to shop where ever they choose, use whichever doctor (insurance issues aside), plumber or dance instructor they wish. The non=compete clause signed by the employee, on the other hand can be enforced in many but not all states. I don't believe it would hold up anywhere telling a consumer where they can spend their money. I am not an attorney so I really have nothing to base this on other than what I have seen over they years and the company I work for enforcing, and in some cases failing to enforce, the non -compete clause we all signed.
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The clause punishes the instructor not the student. The instructor gets sued. Studios try to control those that they employed rather than those buying their services.
 
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freeageless said:
I find your comment comparing what maybe happening in ballroom dance to what happened in Nazi Germany disgraceful and obscene. Millions of people were murdered in Nazi Germany. Your comment demeans and minimizes what happened to all those victims of those horrible crimes. You have a lot of soul searching to do.
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Ease up and not be so literal/PC. I don't think anyone was outraged at the Soup Nazi on Seinfeld or
Hogans Heroes or The Producers. The usage of the word is widely used for case 3 below (and note
she used lower case!!!):

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nazi
 
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freeageless said:
I find your comment comparing what maybe happening in ballroom dance to what happened in Nazi Germany disgraceful and obscene. Millions of people were murdered in Nazi Germany. Your comment demeans and minimizes what happened to all those victims of those horrible crimes. You have a lot of soul searching to do.
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I agree but I think she is young and may not get it yet. I was young once and didn't get a lot of things either. It comes with time.
 
Rhythmdancer said:
The clause punishes the instructor not the student. The instructor gets sued. Studios try to control those that they employed rather than those buying their services.
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In complete agreement with you but there were comments about students signing a contract saying they would not take lessons other places, or something of that nature. I was only saying I don't think this, if it really happened, could hold up in court.
 
twnkltoz said:
Asking the student to honor the non-compete may be one of those things where the studio puts it in the contract knowing it's not enforceable in court but hoping the student will honor it.
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Yup. Voice of reason.

Just like a studio would like a student to sign up for 5 years of lessons
at a time.
 
freeageless said:
I find your comment comparing what maybe happening in ballroom dance to what happened in Nazi Germany disgraceful and obscene. Millions of people were murdered in Nazi Germany. Your comment demeans and minimizes what happened to all those victims of those horrible crimes. You have a lot of soul searching to do.
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Godwin's law...that moment at which you know you are truly wasting your time
 
Partner Dancer said:
Ease up and not be so literal/PC. I don't think anyone was outraged at the Soup Nazi on Seinfeld or
Hogans Heroes. The usage of the word is widely used for case 3 below (and note
she used lower case!!!):
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Sorry PD, but you don't get to decide what should count as offensive for others. You may disagree, but even your disparaging use of PC seems to indicate that you think this is about "sounding" a certain way. For those who may not know, yesterday happened to be Holocaust Memorial Day, meaning the reference could have carried this much more weight. Part of engaging in civil discourse involves honoring other people's viewpoints even when we disagree with them -- not berating those who don't think and act according to our prescribed beliefs.
 
twnkltoz said:
Asking the student to honor the non-compete may be one of those things where the studio puts it in the contract knowing it's not enforceable in court but hoping the student will honor it.
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thing is, and this isn't on the studio, but on whomever is going to sign....most folks presume that anything they sign is legal and binding and that isn't always true, but since many folks don't know an attorney personally and often won't spend the time or money trying to find out, often students honor those agreements because they don't know and they aren't willing to find out the hard way or the easy way
 
Partner Dancer said:
Ease up and not be so literal/PC. I don't think anyone was outraged at the Soup Nazi on Seinfeld or
Hogans Heroes or The Producers. The usage of the word is widely used for case 3 below (and note
she used lower case!!!):

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/nazi
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shrug...meh...apples to oranges...those were unambiguously comedies...her comment didn't seem to be in jest...and, as an aside, I wouldn't presume that those sitcoms didn't offend some....more to the point, with regard to trying to have civil discourse: people should be deliberate and conscientious in their choices about how to interact in order to minimize being inflammatory instead of having a cocky " I do what I want and say what I want and you can all just deal with it" sort of tone, imv
 
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